Jaggzuk

Nop not forgotten he's driving trains and generally running round the layout making all the sound effects!!  In all this, I am trying to be the signalman and keeping the collisions and derailments to a minimum.  The fiddle yard has added a new level of concentration, especially while we still have manually operated points.  The next task is to get the point motors prepped ready for installation.

The engine shed you sent me is a great additions and was a fun build.  It has really enhanced what was a very small single track loco stabling point.  Now we have a really good sized MPD.  So thanks for the kit Roger.  Hope to get on with the others soon.

The ballasting looks far better now and I really like the grass landscape too.  It really lifts the look of the layout and sets the track into it.

The close coupling of the trucks is a notable improvement on TLC.

Great progress.

On the ballasting front, I think things might look improved if you can form a more well defined ballast shoulder, covering all the underlay.  Also, you might consider weathering the track before you ballast further? I am spraying mine track brown before ballasting; less risk from any white underlay/scenic plaster showing through the ballast.

Perhaps just go back over what you/kids have ballasted so far and I am sure it will fine.  From what I have observed on my work days track side, is that the grass and ballast tend to have a fairly distinct edge to each other which is enhanced by a cable trough. http://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/topic/106602-family-8x4-oo-layout-trains-running-again/?p=2898300  The ballast shoulder is one of the key things to a good looking track bed.

Here are a couple of photos to illustrate.  Both are on the freight only line to Grassington and just show that bright green or very long static grass would not be wrong ;-)

Oh dear that does not look well.  It looks like you have hard wired the decoder so I guess you cannot do a test run on DC with out the decoder attached?

It does look like it is poor electrical contacts somewhere.  Have you checked the motor bushes?  the other think is to oil the baring and moving parts, was there the risk that some weathering paint has gummed it up a bit?

I know how frustrating it is as I have a few old locos that splutter.  Keep the faith and work through all the key contact points and give everything a good clean, including the track (sticky little finger get everywhere ;-) ).

 

We also had fiddle yard envy so have added 2 new tracks which have pleased my son no end.

 

 

I hope we have not causes this ;-)  But the addition of a fiddle yard will be good for your storage/running operations.

Your revised track plan looks so much better and should allow better running options.

The scenic are coming on well, always a big leap forward when the grass arrives.  I have very little experience on static grass (I have yet to use my applicator on the layout, so far only on samples) but one thought I have is how close was your earthing pin/contact wire on the layout scenery to the actual area you were applying the grass too?  I would keep it as close as possible.

Now our fiddle yard build is now working, I must get on with our landscape scenery....

Looking forward to the next update.

Two years to the day I posted this shot!

I think we can class this Christmas blockage as being completed on time. I still have the wiring to do, installation of all the point motors and copper clad track board joints for the lifting sections, but the track is now all cut to length and connected together and trains are running!!
 

The completed fiddle yard, with hinged section in the foreground

Double track approach with Programming track spur.
 

General view
 

New double main line track on the scenic side
 

Lots of stock space now
 

Plenty of finger space between each road, which I wanted.


During the build, I was rather surprised to find the Class 08 arriving at the station having just been sent though the fiddle yard by my eldest son, upon which I said, "how did you do that", to which he replied "I just did". He had found a route with connected track and just drove a train through!!. So I was very pleased to find at the end of the track build that even without any DCC wire droppers, all the track was live when the points are set in the right direction off the main scenic board.

Two of the priorities of the fiddle yard build was to try to use only scrap timber I had stored and to use up all the spare track left from the main 8x4 build. I managed both. The result is that the track plan looks a bit odd a I had lots of R2 curves but I manged to use them all up.

The final plan has 3 through roads and 4 sidings, two in each direction. The top two are separated by the timber beam and will mainly be used for DMUs as they are very difficult to get to do do any uncoupling. I also had one spare old settrack point which I have used to lead to a short spur, which will be a dedicated programming track/loco stabling point. The two longest roads allow for an eight coach train and loco to be stored.

The final track layout

There is quite bit of baseboard space left for placing "stuff" on when forming trains. the result is a much better space for playing trains.

Really pleased with the the result and it has transformed the play time, with one of us on the station side and other in the fiddle yard pit forming trains up. I even found an extension lead for on of the the handheld controllers which reaches the "pit".

My plan will be to have a traditional probe and contact control panel for the fiddle yard points in the pit but also Peco point levers on the main lever frame. Some form of LED indicators will be required to show the routes set.

Next, fix ther track properly....

Really good video update, well filmed and edited too.  Love all the nice detail on the layout.

Christmas Engineering Blockade - Update

Good progress has been made on the layout upgrade, both on th fiddel ayrd sid and the new track capcaisy.

Two out of the three baseboard frames have been made. The angled hinged/lift out section has yet to be done - lined out with string, still not quite sure how that one will work. I have cut the MDF tops for the main section (not yet added), so quite happy so far.
 

Fiddle yard

Track alignment

The addition of the new track on the layout has started. The main civils work has been done to get the trackbed formation ready and the trackwork lay has started. The new curved turnout is in and part of the concrete track laid. This biggest headache was the fact that the point motor was right above a main part of the baseboard frame and was right on the edge. So I had to cut a big chunk out, but is was not part of the structural frame so that was good.
 

The before shot
 

Aerial view before works started

New trackwork started

The next stage will be more track heading to what will now be a double track tunnel portal with new approach retaining wall, where the grass land form used to be.

Hopefully part two of my two parcel delivery will come today, it got split up on its first delivery attempt to the house just before Christmas - 8 yards of track!!

So here is the finished plan for the fiddle yard, all the bits in orange. It also shows the new engine shed sidings and the added double track bottom right, which is part of the fiddle yard capacity improvement. What this adds is the ability to run two trains in opposite directions, one using the fiddle yard and out main loop the other using the existing double inner loops.
 

And here are a few shots of the engine maintenance depot modifications. The Engine Shed kit was kindly sent to me by RogerV, which was then inspiration for adding the extra shed road. So now we have a twin track shed, refuelling area and the depot can store 5 locos at a push. The refueling area is just a mock-up at present, not too sure whether to scratch build or buy the Knightwing kit?

The whole area changed for the better and is very much more urban and industrial now. This then lead me on to how to access the goods yard from the lower area, hence the ideas on a retaining wall access ramp. The mock-up can just be seen in the photos.

Lots of things on the boil.....

Hi Nick

The key thing I learnt about my placing of the magnet locations was that they cannot be too close to a curve.  The Kadee only work whens the rolling stock is in a straight line..  Ok this sounds obvious, but even placing the magnets on straight track after a curve can still be too close, as any wagon or coach will still over hang until the rear approaches the the straight.  The knuckle of the coupling must be over the centre line of the straight track to work.

I work to about 70-80mm from the point where the straight track ends and the curve starts and this was still tight.

The other thing to consider is how much delayed coupling you want to do in sidings.

Hope this helps.  If you want I can post a plan with the magnet locations

Christmas block all dependant upon my late order of track and points being delivered!!!  Bad planning on my part.  Just finalising the track plan and sorting the timber ready for the build effort with the boys, my two little Kirow Cranes.

This looks much more workable than the previous loop and will offer better two train running.  It does all look rather familiar ;-)

Just curious how to you get into the tunnel at the back once all the scenery has been added for derailments?

I like the modern high-tech danger signals used during a possession back up the line at Lewes.

Incidentally there's another possession today - yet more work on Newhaven level crossing. I think it would be more durable if they infilled between the tracks with sticks of licorice. Perhaps when they close the port and stop the ferry service, because they can't find the customs officers to staff yet another small port, after Brexit, the euro lorries will stop chewing up the crossing!

 

Was this defiantly a Possession?  As red flag would be quite normal for a Line Blockage, ref. Rule book GE/RT8000/HB8

Great progress.  Really like the town back scene, what kits are they from, as they look good?

Two of my items come to mind seeing this thread.

First, a white BR guards van side oil lamp.  This was the twin white aspect with a red filter that could be dropped in to turn the rear light red.  I have added an electric light so that my son can use it has bedroom light.  I have added an earth connection to the metal lamp and used all plastic light holder.

Second is a cast GNER crest that came off one of the HST Mk3 coach sides.  These were taken off when GNER lost their franchise.  GNER staff were give first refusal to get hold of these and a small number then appeared on online auction.  I was rather lucky to get this as it was being sold as "buy now" rather than a bid auction.   It is solid brass (i think) and pretty heavy.  I would wall mount it, but it is actually curved as they where shaped to the Mk3 side.  So I plan to shape a piece of wood and paint it GNER blue to one day mount it.  I love than fact I have a piece of real railway history.

See the third photo on this page for the coach mounting and also a bit of in-site in to the history  https://thebeautyoftransport.com/2014/05/14/along-the-line-blue-and-gold-gners-corporate-visual-identity-vignelli-associates-1997/

Starting with the retaining wall along the lower part of the MPD, a Metcalfe kit bash creation, (photo to coming soon).  This separates the lower goods yard and the upper station area.  One element I intend to add is a road ramp from the lower area up to the upper goods area.  I want to use the Wills Tapered Retaining Wall kit PO248 https://www.metcalfemodels.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/11/PO248.jpg  but I am struggling to find a real life example of such an urban road ramp around a station for inspiration.

I have a vague memory of seeing something like it in an old B&W photo or a BTF video. my my web search has drawn a blank.  So I anyone know of an example they can share it would be much appreciated.

The only two I have found so far but not that quite right are, Manchester central stationare https://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gare_de_Manchester_Central#/media/File:Manchester_Central_Station_7.jpg  and Leeds Great Central station https://i.pinimg.com/originals/8a/d9/38/8ad93891a86da625ea382f5ceeb0ab33.jpg

Thats a very nice MPD there Chris. I am in two minds on the kightwing fuel kit or scratch build. My fuel point will only be one sided due to limited space between the two roads. But then this got me thinking, can diesel loco be fueled from either side? Do they have a fule cap on both sides.

I like the card/plastic sheet option for the concrete, a lot less messy than filler.  Just curious what size did you make your slabs between the joints, that is, what "real life" size?

A question on the Scalescenes inspection pits, what holds the track in place over the pits where there are no sleepers? The Peco version has real chassis.

I started the shed build last night, which was a nice feeling getting back in to building rather than rolling stock mods.

Sounds like an episode of Thomas the Tank Engine.

Getting my ideas together on the look and feel for the MPD/engine shed. 

There are so may good examples on RMWeb but one thing that has attracted me is inspection pits, see last photo http://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/topic/11755-blog-coachmanns-carriage-blog-railway-buildings/.  I then found this thread http://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/topic/100817-peco-inspection-pit-lighting/ .  I think I will go for the Peco option and add some LED lights.

As part of my motivation for building the 8x4 layout was to learn new modeling techniques.  So extending the MPD this will allow me to try out making a concrete hard-standing with embedded rails.

Looking at the Rowsley shed example, I like how the Sand drying building is next to the engine shed, which is pretty much what I had originally planned.  But now with the new track I can add next tot he sand building a simple fuel point with the concrete hard-standing extending from the shed.

Hopefully the view from the station will look very good, the sort of view I remember from my early days trainspotting and being at the end of a platform, trying to see locos in the shed..

Foxwood Park - Further capacity improvements planned.

The weekend has seen a lot of activity in the railway room, mostly playing trains, but some further capacity improvements have now been planned.  Along with the addition of the planned fiddle yard/avoidance loops during the forthcoming a Christmas blockage, the MPD/rolling stock management team have request some additional depot capacity. The current offering of a single road depot just does not meet the current growth in traffic that Foxwood Park is now seeing.

Following the very kind delivery of some old Superquick kits from Rogerv (of this parish), including the Station Terminus, Signal Box and Double Road Engine Shed kits. I started to look at how they could be incorporated in to the layout.  Our current engine shed is only a single road and so I was either going to have to kit bash or have it look like a depot road had been removed during a historically rationalisation of the track layout.  But then it dawned on me as I looked along the layout, that a very simple addition of one point and a bit of track could give us a double road shed with a long approach line, thus providing 3-4 loco stabling capacity.

The whole motivation of the fiddle yard is to allow stock to stay on the rails and reduce damage and stock being pilled up on the main layout.  The same goes for locos.  The addition of a 2nd engine shed road will allow much more safe on-layout storage of most of the locos being used by the boys.

So the plan is to add reverse Settrack turnout to the left-hand siding and run a track back parallel to the depot location.  This obviously will mean that when the goods shed line is fully used that a loco cannot come off that road, but that will be part of the operation fun.  The new depot road will also allow a refueling point scene to be added, which will be nice.  The new turnout will not need a new point lever switch as it can run in tandem with the current siding entry turnout.

The orange track is the new depot road addition.

Sorry for the poor quality of the plans, but as my version of SCARM has been locked due to now being Payware,  I cannot edit my original plan because it is well over the 100 pieces offered in Freeware mode.  I cannot really justify, at the moment, paying for a license just for a few edits considering I have pretty much competed my layout planning phase.

That's lovely looking plan there Harlequin, do you take commissions? ;-). 

I think the fact that you have managed to get 3 sidings in on the left will give a lot more shunting flexibility and puzzle opportunity.  I particularly like the siding running alongside the main branch line towards the viaducts, that will look nice the the buffer stop at the top of an embankment.

Seeing the plan in graphical form like this really helps to see that less is more.  I think Rich you have got a very nice layout plan here both scenically and operationally and I am really quite excited to see how this ends up in built form.  So very Devon esque!!

Valid point Chris, the tunnel currently is just a triangle of MDF which is easily lifted off and I will keep it that way when it has the town scene on it.

Space will be a bit cramped on the fiddle side but not too bad.

And rightly so on the Mini front. Mistreat a mini and they will bite you back. Our Mini Neon always draws blood from me when I used to open "her" bonnet. But she had been garaged for 9 odd years now and looks a bit sorry for herself!

Mind you my youngest at 4 has declared he wants a green Landie for his first car!

Not trying to find and excuse to put off scenics, but I am considering some civil engineering during the 2 week Christmas Blockage.

The layout was always designed to be extended into a fiddle yard, with the off board spurs already being located inside the two tunnels.  But time has now come I think to seriously consider this development.  There are three motivations for this,

1. We have so much stock now that the main 8x4 board keeps getting clogged up as the boys play, getting everything out of its boxes.  This detracts for the scenic aspect and also stuff is getting damage being in and out of storage boxes so much.
2. we need more on baseboard storage for long train formations.
3. Whilst I am very happy with the layout, there is a limitation as to where trains can pass each other.  Currently only in the station with one train on the outer loop and the other on the flyover loop.  I have always wanted a little more double track passing opportunity.

So implementing the fiddle yard offers an opportunity to tweak the 8x4.  By adding about 2 inches to the right hand side (with the station at the bottom of the plan) I can add another outer curve to create a 1/4 turn of double track going into the tunnel.  This in effect creates a new outer loop which goes into the fiddle yard.

With this the running opportunity would now be: 1 train on the new outer loop running clockwise passing through a through road in the fiddle yard, with a second train running anti-clockwise.  The second train would use the double loop on the main board from the middle track at the station going out to the right hand tunnel, passing under the flyover to then go through the station on the inner track before going back out over then flyover and back to the station.

The new track on the 8x4 is purple, the red box will be some form of lift/swing section and the hole in the middle is 2 foot wide operators well for the fiddle yard.  The fiddle yard will be non scenic as it is under the slope the roof so has little head room.

The sidings in the fiddle yard are faced so they can feed goods traffic to either yard.

Hi Rich

Just come across you layout planning.  I sounds like you have has a bumpy time and sympathies to you.  But as you now say, you want to get on with it.

If I can add a few obs from personal experience and perhaps ask a few questions? 

Firstly who is the layout for, you or your son, or both?  This is key as to what you end up building and are happy with.  I had planned a big layout with nice scenic sections and gentle (ish curves), but then came my 1st boy and then a second (7 & 4).  That layout is still a plan and will happen one day, but I needed to build a more achievable "play" layout for the boys and I am so glad I have.

OK is it a tail chaser 8x4 and totally unrealistic track plan, but the fun that is had far surpasses the r2 - r4 curves and funny scenic sections. BUT the layout has a lot of play factor, even for me as I have quite complicated shunting puzzle scope with it.

With two boys, I needed 2 train running capability, otherwise I will have been a referee signalman all the time!!

Second, can you build all the track in a very short space of time, but perhaps if getting the scenics done takes a long time?  Kids have a short patience level, they just want to run trains, we on the other hand want a nice layout with perfect scenery that we can disappear mentally into.  BUT, kids use their imagination to play and so a finished layout does not matter to them (much).

Oh yes young kids have no real concepts of era or region , they just see, steam, diesel goods or passenger and then they like certain colours.

So to the plans, I liked the plans back in post 24, as these had more shunting options. I also liked the dairy line.  But the off scenic part on the left to me looked a bit of a waste of space  just being single track, so the bridge element  in post 25 looks nice.

Have you considered having a double track section clockwise into the fiddle yard, over the door lift section?  I only suggest this as then you could then run longer trains (my boys love that) yet still pass each other at the station.  Being limited to 1+4 and only passing at the station might in the end feel too limiting "play" wise?

I am assuming all your track is level, so that will speed up the build.

My final suggestion and as you have yet mention control, go for DCC, you will never look back.  Also get two controllers, removes the sharing issue!!  And reduces the risk of head ons.  I have an NCE Powercab with a 2nd Engineer Cab throttle, the master unit can override the cab throttle, most useful.

Anyway, keep the faith and keep sharing your ideas, it all looks good and the build will be fun.