Roy P

Totally agree. What I was really getting at from a purely personal view point is that when it comes to running under the wires, it's the location at least as much as the stock that would attract me. This for me means the 6 track section at the south end of the WCML where the local D.C. lines run alongside the fast and slow A.C. pairs. I spent more time on the D.C. lines' 501 units than I ever did behind an A.C. loco. It is the nostalgia of rattling up the smoke as a teenager and all that. I'm not really looking for a reason to run a Bachmann class 85 - I bought one anyway. As an enthusiast of all Britain's railway heritage there are plenty of other fish for me to fry which might offer a simpler satisfaction. Having said all that, I do get what your saying about easier prototype locations for A.C. modellers and this leads us back to the catch 22 we are faced with regarding for the moment, in R-T-R terms of waiting for stable mates and infrastructure for the 85 to justify the effort. There are those who's passion for these things means that they are willing and able to make such an effort and they have shown on this forum some magnificent achievements. These talented individuals may not actually need R-T-R product to make their dreams a reality. It would just be a nice timesaver for them if done properly to their standard and by accounts the Bachmann 85 was. Other recent efforts apparently not. This all underlines the original question of what if anything, may we see being produced as a follow up to the 85 and is there enough demand for it? Catch 22! RP

One aspect governing the potential popularity or otherwise of R-T-R electric stock that seems to overlooked is the main line nature of these things. Fewer people with have the resources for a convincing or satisfying mainline than something easier on the space/time/wallet continuum. I grew up under the wires and have a soft spot for the AC and DC electrics that did their business between Euston and Watford. It would take a major change in my fortunes to turn my six track WCML model from a concept (from the armchair) to something physical. My compromise (like those with more than one particular sphere of interest) is to have one small layout rather than several large ones*. The presence of a Bachmann class 85 in my collection is a little slice of what I'd do given the chance. Having no immediate ambition to build a 50x25 ft model of the stretch of line between Headstone Lane and the Oxhey Ridge with endless DC kits 501s, Southern Pride 310s and converted EFE '38s shuffling along; I will happily buy an example of any AC electric stuff that Bachmann may offer me even if it does sit around doing nothing except pay homage to my pipe dream. RP

It creeps up on you! I was happy fitting the details and then one day, suddenly, I couldn't see to fit a small black object into a small black hole against a black background. I'm making a very slow transition to DCC and haven't yet got around to chipping the Heljans. I was wondering if the lights are somehow configured to work better when chipped? Has anyone made the comparison? I'll find out for myself in due course but for the time being I was just curious. RP

Agreed; but I'm hoping they'll confirm the livery and detail options before then to give us a taster and them some entries in the order book. This will, if all goes to plan, be one of very few models that my son and I will want different versions of for very different reasons. It doesn't happen very often but that's the joy! He gets to appreciate the finer points of my NRM specials and I, in return get to stare in wonder at his class 70 diesel. Between us we've got this one covered. RP

More electrics may have been preserved if OHLE was available on the Great Central, Severn Valley, Bluebell etc. Sorry! Couldn't resist. In all seriousness,and getting back to the original thought; I believe that at least in the longer term it is probably inevitable (if there are any model trains left at all) that there is a future for R-T-R electrics and I have my own personal favourites but I do wonder, as time passes and more old received wisdom is thrown out of the window, whether we will be left with what one might term a "traditional British model railway with wires" or something more like a "British Kato" urban train set? That would be a suggestion that the basic flavour of model railways in Bitain will change before a widespread acceptance of "Railway Modelling - but not as we knew it". This sort of thing may well happen but before it does, give me something to keep my AL5 company as it sits on display next to the NRM, and BCC specials. All dressed up and nowhere to go! RP

Although these video clips will not answer this question specifically, they might give a little clue as to the haulage capability of Bachmann locos when unhindered by too much flange drag! http://www.youtu.be/Y4QKemz9iO0 Over 200 videos in this impressive collection. I don't know if the owner is a member here but a quick search didn't show anything RP Ooops! Sorry about that. I used the wrong link. I meant to use the one showing the Garratts working; not falling apart.

My local Martins newsagent had one on the shelf this morning so I did the honourable thing. I would be interested in the whole series if I thought there were to be a few historical subjects from the early days that would never be made R-T-R. A collection of static versions of locos already in my collection wouldn't be for me. They are doing Rocket and I would like to see how they tackle a subject that doesn't lend itself to a OO translation. FWIW on Mallard I counted eleven separate handrails but no moulded ones. The bit of cab and tender front detail and glazing makes me wonder if a series of plastic kits could not be made for £8.99 a pop. It needs painting properly in any case.

Looking at this pic from Kernow (The original from Bachmann has dissapeared) http://www.kernowmodelrailcentre.com/images/prod_40062.jpg Viewed from the front, the cab cutout appears to feature quite heavy beading/framing/strengthening. The actual side sheets may not be as "robust" as they look from the rear 3/4 view. Whether this is correct, acceptable or "good enough" will be in the eye of beholder. I suspect that when the model is painted black it won't be the first thing I notice about it. RP

A bit of a strange one this. Bachmann's original "mock-up" ( Swanage Diesel Gala 2013 171a.jpg ) had the underground roundel better proportioned than the real one. The model comes out accurate but looking wrong. Had they stuck with their original plan it would have looked better but would have been incorrect. A difficult call perhaps.Maybe Bachmann should have stuck to their guns and offered a couple of tins of paint to match the loco with the model. then everyone would be happy. These things are not my usual cup of tea but I have the advantage of having a 20 year old son who buys the things I don't. So LT twins for him this Christmas and LMS twins for me. We know were his Mum has hidden them! RP

Further info from the instruction sheet ; Coil springs sitting in a circular recesses on the top of the plastic mouldings that carry the axles and limit the lateral movement which is in turn held by a keep plate arrangement. An observation may be that the amount of lateral movement allowed for average curves means that the "frames" appear a bit narrow (as with any OO model) and this may need attending to (and probably will be) by anyone wishing to convert to a wider gauge. That's for the LMS/BR models. No one's going chop this one about. Are they? RP

I believe that was referring to the sideways movement. The front and rear axles are sprung vertically but I haven't had it apart to see quite how. I'm not sure how I would quantify the strength of the springing but I don't think it would have an unreasonable effect on the weight available for traction. RP

I would think so so long as their feet aren't too big. RP only 11 (eleven) left as of this time

My Receipt was stapled to the order/delivery note within the "Documents enclosed" pocket stuck to the top of the box. HTH RP

That’s a thought Watford shed as viewed over the fence from platform 9 across the wedge toward the St.Albans bay platform with a hint of 11 &12 and the yard beyond. I've often fancied a bash at some of the London Road stuff. It would be a parallel project and would take a while due to a steep learning curve for me. Still nothing ventured, nothing gained. Where do I find out more about this shed kit. Watford had two quite distinct 3-road sheds side by side. I don't recall anything of them personally other than asking my mother what the big round hole in the ground was for! "That's where the turntable used to be" - "What's a turntable?"- and so forth. I didn't see much of Watford Junction until 1966 when the Abbey Flyer began stopping at Garston. (And we're back on the 313s again) Thanks Jol (and apologies to everyone else) RP

Coal Tank / Watford Tank? Not much "use" to me but yes please! RP

Guilty! Many people may work out their "normal modelling requirements" from what is available when planning their layout. If the layout has a particular theme then the stock requirement will be limited to some degree. After that it's what takes your fancy. And why not? I have the models you mentioned (L&Y on it's way this week) and a few others sitting in a cabinet as if in a museum while my principle operating interest is 1960s North London suburbia. Being born in Watford in 1961, I have rose tinted view of it. But a general interest in British railway heritage means that I also have a soft spot for historical museum pieces which is what the "pretty" models are to me. RP

I can't help but read that first bit as a Monty Python skit! RP

With several requests for the PEP units (313/4/5 - 507-8 ) to be considered, I have often wondered why the kit makers - DC kits, Southern Pride,Bratchell - have not attempted them as they would appear to tick most boxes. I almost feel that it is such an obvious choice that the kit makers believe that as soon as they'd released it, the R-T-R one will come along. But still it doesn't. I believe I read some where that Hornby got as far as a mock up 313 but went with the 466 instead as the 313 had too many vehicles. Hmmmm! Maybe 313s are just haunted by the ghosts of 501s RP Remembering the luxury of facing forwards.

Buying BRM from my local newsagent as I do, I have just read the P2 review. As no one else has mentioned it (I believe) I was interested in the phrase "The front end arrangement is a separate moulding joined invisibly between the drop in the footplate and the junction of smokebox and boiler." This may indicate a built in option for alternative front end which would be a logical way of getting some mileage out of the model ( details aside maybe - or maybe not). For the record I would have paid more for a full-fat version on the grounds that it would still be the only affordable R-T-R P2 we are likely to get even at double the price. After an initial disappointment at Hornby's current direction I took a mental step backwards myself. Imagine if Hornby had ceased to be and a new manufacturer came up with the Star, DoG and P2 at these prices. I guess we might snap them up while mourning the passing of the old company we knew and loved. If anyone has yet to read Tony Wright's review, may I suggest that you read the conclusion first. It helps to balance some of the the comments in the main text. Especially if you've been reading BRM since its begining (almost) and find the tone this time around a touch "unexpected" RP

Anyway, back on the topic of the Lanky tank, there are 93 left on the website as of this time. I ordered mine last weekend when there were 143. I suspect that a few people didn't need their funds tied up for too long and are ordering nearer to delivery which is reasonable. I expect the last ones to shift fairly quickly now. although I would feel for anyone who misses out, it should be seen as encouraging for both the NRM and Bachmann ( and the collectors club) that such models continue to hit the spot. More please! RP

Aside from the LSWR T9 and M7 and a few Terriers there were the GNR J52s and N2s. I always thought it was shame that 1470 GREAT NORTHERN (or even the pre naming 1471 "SIR FREDERICK BANBURY") wasn't produced in GNR livery after Hornby had gone to the trouble of producing the taller (GNR gauge) chimney, dome and cab and the square ended buffer beam. I hope we haven't seen the last of the A1/A3s done to this standard or ebay will soon tell Hornby what we might have paid for them. RP

Although I would like to see some "British OO track" as much as anyone, I wouldn't envy anyone who had to roll up here and state which set of the inevitable compromises had been chosen. In any case, I suspect that the range would have to be fairly extensive from the outset and although it may ultimately prove profitable, it would be too much of a slow burner for DJM at this point in time. I can think of a scenario where it may be possible sooner rather than later but as I have no money to put where my mouth is, I'll keep that to myself. I hope it's not long before DJM is at least in a position to give it serious consideration whatever the final decision. In the meantime, the suggestion for the PEP unit variants looks like something to think about in the medium term. Something that could be drip fed over many years. RP

I think the difference here is that we have an opportunity to offer for consideration a set of proposals that we would like to see modelled to a set of standards that have been outlined by DJM. The annual wish list doesn't actually allow us to state which manufacturer we would prefer to fulfil those wishes. I seem to recall a poll carried out by one of the printed monthlies that did ask that question. At the time, most requested that Bachmann made the items. This was a while ago now. Pre-Clan Line if you know what I mean! It might be a bit of an eye opener (or possibly not) if we were able to state who we would want to produce our wished for models, what standard we would want them made to and how much would we pay for them. This would make the annual poll a tad complicated but this thread is a start. RP

Now that was a good idea! I just need to find a way of expressing to her my disappointment that the black LMS twins and Cock o' the north won't be under the Christmas tree either!. What else can I have instead? There's probably a good reason to do my window shopping at 1 am. RP

Although I doubt that Bachmann could build three LNWR 4-6-0s for the price of a Hornby Star, I wouldn't mind enacting that contest. RP