SteveyDee68 Posted August 17, 2019 Share Posted August 17, 2019 (edited) Asking the combined wisdom of RMWeb... Have just acquired a Lima “HO” Wagonlits blue livery sleeper coach... Is this model, to the best of the Forum’s knowledge, true HO, or over-scale? Wanting to create a “representative” Night Ferry train without paying £100+ per etched coach kit! Many thanks Steve Edited July 8, 2020 by SteveyDee68 THREAD TOPIC CLOSED Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Andy Hayter Posted August 17, 2019 RMweb Premium Share Posted August 17, 2019 I think (but I stand to be corrected) that the only scale rtr F type CIWL coaches used in the Night Ferry formations came from LS Models/Heris around 10 years ago. These were not cheap but not the price you quote either. https://www.ebay.fr/itm/LS-Models-SNCF-voiture-lit-type-F-epoque-IV/223619700447?hash=item3410c5d6df:g:NRkAAOSwxx1cTxTf https://www.ebay.fr/itm/LS-Models-49127-CIWL-Schlafwagen-Type-F-blau-Ep3-mit-Emblem-Faltenbalg-NEU-OVP/283476560012?hash=item420085088c:g:xIgAAOSwc5haxg5l https://www.ebay.fr/itm/LS-MODELS-49126-CIWL-carrozza-tipo-F-livrea-blu-1-e-2-cl-nr-serv-3792-ep-II/183184893027?hash=item2aa6aba463:g:0SkAAOSwqHta1022 https://www.ebay.fr/itm/LS-Models-49121-3tlg-Liegewagen-Typ-F-CIWL-1937-II-1-2-Klasse-DC/303204081816?hash=item46985f2098:g:hMMAAOSwmAJdFNAc I don't know the Lima model but I suspect it may be more generic than accurate and will be more likely to represent a train blue coach or something running through to Italy. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest JiLo Posted August 17, 2019 Share Posted August 17, 2019 DId Revell do a plastic kit for the CIWL? Seem to remember it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium cctransuk Posted August 17, 2019 RMweb Premium Share Posted August 17, 2019 5 minutes ago, JiLo said: DId Revell do a plastic kit for the CIWL? Seem to remember it Do a Google search on Revell CIWL Wagon Lits. Regards, John Isherwood. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest JiLo Posted August 17, 2019 Share Posted August 17, 2019 1 minute ago, cctransuk said: Do a Google search on Revell CIWL Wagon Lits. Regards, John Isherwood. My memory served me right! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sncf231e Posted August 18, 2019 Share Posted August 18, 2019 (edited) The LS Models CIWL Night sleeper coaches (the so called type F CIWL sleeper) as mentioned here above are correct. The type F or Night Ferry sleepers were made to run from Paris to London, crossing the channel on a ferryboat. They were smaller than all other CIWL sleepers and had entrance doors only on one end. Lima (or Revell) did not make a type F sleeper. Jouef made one (also available as Playcraft) which is (just) acceptable. An overview of many CIWL cars can be found in an e-book I made on the subject: http://sncf231e.nl/ciwl-carriages-by-fredsmall/ . Top 2 pictures LS Models, next three Jouef: Regards Fred Edited August 18, 2019 by sncf231e 1 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Il Grifone Posted August 18, 2019 Share Posted August 18, 2019 Lima Wagon-Lits are likely to be H0 scale in profile and TT in length. It used to be a common failing of Continental coach models and they were no exception. Later models were better in this respect but I don't think there was anything C.I.W.L.. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Andy Hayter Posted August 18, 2019 RMweb Premium Share Posted August 18, 2019 Some of the later CIWL models look (and I stress look because I have not run a ruler over them) to be scale length; however none of the ones I have seen look remotely like the F type Night Ferry cars - all being models of the last generation CIWL coaches. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sncf231e Posted August 19, 2019 Share Posted August 19, 2019 There is no scale length CIWL car made by Lima. Most earlier Lima models are not based on a CIWL prototype at all! The modern Lima sleeper is based on the CIWL type MU but should be 30 cm and is only 26 cm. See here a comparison between a correct length ACME (bottom) and a Lima (top) CIWL MU sleeper: These pictures are from an overview of many CIWL cars I made in an e-book: http://sncf231e.nl/ciwl-carriages-by-fredsmall/ Regards Fred 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SteveyDee68 Posted July 8, 2020 Author Share Posted July 8, 2020 Thank you (belatedly) for all the information. The Lima coach I acquired is as per the top photograph in Fred's last post, and is definitely HO scale. Something else for me to sail out into the waters of eBay in the hopes that it might be of use to somebody (unless the bogies are of any use?!) Steve S Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Atlantic Coast Express Posted May 13 Share Posted May 13 Interestingly, there appears to be quite a lot of interest in the recent past surrounding the CIWL Wagon-Lits Night Ferry Type F Sleepers, and across all the model railway gauges. Bit of digging around it appears Playcraft Railways may well have there in the mid-1960s with these couple of consumer advertisements. Have never seen one of these in the flesh so to speak. There’s a nice blog on Night Ferry at https://shamrocktrains.com/posts/night-ferry/ and a complete chapter in Martyn Pring’s 2020 book ‘Boat Trains: The English Channel & Ocean Liner Specials’ https://www.pen-and-sword.co.uk/Boat-Trains-The-English-Channel-and-Ocean-Liner-Specials-Hardback/p/18521 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sncf231e Posted May 13 Share Posted May 13 9 hours ago, Atlantic Coast Express said: Interestingly, there appears to be quite a lot of interest in the recent past surrounding the CIWL Wagon-Lits Night Ferry Type F Sleepers, and across all the model railway gauges. I do not get the impression of any interest (except from me) about the Night Ferry. But for those who want to know about Night Ferry sleeper models, I wrote an article about it which can be read or downloaded from my website (for free of course): http://sncf231e.nl/wp-content/uploads/2023/01/The-Night-Ferry-sleeper-modelled.pdf Regards Fred Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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