Minor Points: Annie's layout projects.

[Schooner]

Vol. 2 p.51 :)

 

They're both excellent, with a great deal to inspire, but thanks for the reminder to go back and check Vol. 1 again, it's been a while since my last peruse.

[Northroader]

You’re right, sorry, having a senior moment!

[Annie]

5 hours ago, Schooner said:

Vol. 2 p.51 :)

 

They're both excellent, with a great deal to inspire, but thanks for the reminder to go back and check Vol. 1 again, it's been a while since my last peruse.

Thanks for that.  It's a pity that they don't have it in a digital downloadable format as with the exchange rate and postage it's certainly no bargain.

[Annie]

Yes it's me again.  I thought it might be a good idea to come here and sweep out the dust and cobwebs since I haven't been here for a while.

The November copy of the 'O' Gauge Guild Gazette arrived today which was a lovely surprise since I'd forgotten that I'd joined the Guild what with having been so useless sleepy so much lately.  I must say that I certainly got my money's worth with the Guild Gazette since it's a good thick slab of a magazine and looks like a good read.

 

Greatly daring I've ordered two lengths of Peco 'O' gauge bullhead set track from Ironhorse Hobbies which is just about the only place it's possible to buy anything model railway related here in NZ.  Set track isn't too horrible in price being  $NZ22.95 each for straights and $NZ23.95 for their standard 2nd radius curve.   The points are a bit on the eye wateringly expensive though at $NZ166.95 each for a medium radius bullhead electrofrog point. 

Ironhorse got a load of points in last month and already they've all been snapped up.  Going by their usual habits it'll be about six months before they shift themselves to restock again.

 

 

I did look at this though......  Peco ST-701 O Gauge Starter Set, Bullhead (Code124).  At $NZ554.95 it would be a significant purchase for me so it's going on the 'thinking about it' shelf and it might be moved on to the 'you can forget about that' shelf soon after.

Annoyingly they don't really say what's in the box which is a right pain.  Anyone here purchased one of these and feels like spilling the big secret please tell all.

 

EDIT:  I've just discovered that Ironhorse Hobbies have chairs and bullhead rail for the use of intrepid persons who want to lay their own track and pointwork.  I wonder when they got those in since I've not seen them listed before.  That's more like it since I've done track laying before now.  Alright it was a while ago, but I haven't gone senile yet so I should be able to pick up how to do it again.

Edited November 10, 2023 by Annie
can't spell for toffee

[brumtb]

2 hours ago, Annie said:

Yes it's me again.  I thought it might be a good idea to come here and sweep out the dust and cobwebs since I haven't been here for a while.

The November copy of the 'O' Gauge Guild Gazette arrived today which was a lovely surprise since I'd forgotten that I'd joined the Guild what with having been so useless sleepy so much lately.  I must say that I certainly got my money's worth with the Guild Gazette since it's a good thick slab of a magazine and looks like a good read.

 

Greatly daring I've ordered two lengths of Peco 'O' gauge bullhead set track from Ironhorse Hobbies which is just about the only place it's possible to buy anything model railway related here in NZ.  Set track isn't too horrible in price being  $NZ22.95 each for straights and $NZ23.95 for their standard 2nd radius curve.   The points are a bit on the eye wateringly expensive though at $NZ166.95 each for a medium radius bullhead electrofrog point. 

Ironhorse got a load of points in last month and already they've all been snapped up.  Going by their usual habits it'll be about six months before they shift themselves to restock again.

 

 

I did look at this though......  Peco ST-701 O Gauge Starter Set, Bullhead (Code124).  At $NZ554.95 it would be a significant purchase for me so it's going on the 'thinking about it' shelf and it might be moved on to the 'you can forget about that' shelf soon after.

Annoyingly they don't really say what's in the box which is a right pain.  Anyone here purchased one of these and feels like spilling the big secret please tell all.

 

EDIT:  I've just discovered that Ironhorse Hobbies have chairs and bullhead rail for the use of intrepid persons who want to lay their own track and pointwork.  I wonder when they got those in since I've not seen them listed before.  That's more like it since I've done track laying before now.  Alright it was a while ago, but I haven't gone senile yet so I should be able to pick up how to do it again.

Try this Annie for contents of ST-701 :   https//www.themodelcentre.com/st-701

Tony

 

[Annie]

59 minutes ago, brumtb said:

Try this Annie for contents of ST-701 :   https//www.themodelcentre.com/st-701

Tony

 

Thank you very much Tony.  I think it should be alright to quote part of the Peco description.

 

WHAT'S IN THE BOX?
Presented in a colourful and smart plastic box the set comprises the following components:
6 x ST-700 Straight track sections
1 x ST-702 Powered Straight
2 x ST-725 Curved track sections
1 x ST-750BH Right hand turnout
1 x ST-751BH Left hand turnout
4 x SL-740BH Buffer stop
1 x PM208 PECO Modellers' Library Your Guide to O Gauge Railway Modelling.

On the reverse side of the box we give modellers some sample track plans that can be created with the contents.

 

Now why couldn't Ironhead Ironhorse Hobbies do that.

 

The idea behind the starter set is to provide enough track for a basic shelf layout to get something up and running fairly quickly and I've certainly got no arguement with that.

Edited November 10, 2023 by Annie
more to say

[Annie]

My piece of 'O' gauge set track arrived from Ironhorse Hobbies.  For some reason I thought I'd ordered two pieces, but apparently I'd only ordered one, - no doubt due to me being suspiciously cautious about getting an 'O' gauge finescale infection.

To my great surprise my little kitbash 0-4-2T 3 rail loco that's made from all manner of scrap Hornby bits was perfectly happy to be placed on my new piece of Peco track and its wheels cleared the chairs without any problems.  When I put it together I used Hornby 'O' gauge 'M1' wheels which are on the fine end of coarse when it comes to old 'clocker' engines, but even so it came as a bit of a surprise to see it sitting on the rails like it was meant to be there.  The rear pony wheels are repro replacements for one of those marvellous Hornby No.2  4-4-4T tank engines and I think they might be machined a little finer than the originals so they just manage to clear as well.

I'm not planning on trying to run my little 'saved from scrap' engine on Peco set track and I doubt that it would go through the points anyway, - not to mention that it would need a conductor rail as well, - but it was nice to get it out of its box and dust it off and take its picture just for fun.

 

Edited November 15, 2023 by Annie
Um.........

[Northroader]

That looks like a very promising start to me. Centre third rail, I suppose?

[Annie]

33 minutes ago, Northroader said:

That looks like a very promising start to me. Centre third rail, I suppose?

I made my little green engine to run on centre third rail track and it had a few adventures at Hornby Railway Collectors Association events until someone tried running it on AC instead of DC and deranged its insides.  I was able to fix it sometime later, but it never went out again for adventures after that.  It's actually quite powerful for its size and can haul 20 of the old type Hornby open wagons with pressed steel wheels along with a brake van.  Those old pressed steel wheels aren't the smoothest rolling wheel ever devised so that was a considerable drag on its drawbar.  It's powered by a 12 volt robotics can motor that only just fits inside its boiler driving through a set of chunky plastic robotics gears which work surprisingly well.

 

As to running on Peco set track, - even if I could fit up a central third rail, - I don't think it would be very practical as pointwork would be a nightmare to get working properly.  So sorry no, - my little green engine has a great big box of 0-27 track it can play on if it wants to and that's something that I would like to set up for it sometime.

[Annie]

I made contact with Jim Read of 'O' gauge cardboard locomotive and rolling stock fame and he has very kindly given me a quantity of useful resources as well as his PDF instruction sheets on rolling stock and small locomotive construction.  When i was much younger than I am now and lacking in pocket money I made quite a few items of cardboard rolling stock.  Some of it wasn't all that good, but as time went on I did get better at it.

[Annie]

 

Here we go, - this should be fun.  😬

 

I went back to Ironhorse Hobbies and purchased six lengths of code 124 bullhead rail, 100 running rail chairs , 50 slide chairs for points and some cosmetic fishplates.

 

 

I suppose the Peco chairs are modernish generic ones rather than ones embossed with the initials of some ancient and venerable railway company, - but I guess I can cope with that.  I did think about buying flatbottom rail instead, but decided not to even though I'm using flatbottomed rail on my virtual Norfolk layout's tramways and light railways.  Having not worked with hand laying chaired track before I wanted to have a try at it even though I might make a howling out loud hash of it.

 

Besides my little shopping list added up to way less than half the cost of a ready made (trade you a kidney for one) Peco bullhead point and only 14% of the cost of a starter track set, - so even if I make a right muddle of it I still think it was worth a go.  Besides that Ironhead Hobbies is busy slapping 'just missed out' stickers over an increasing amount of their 'O' gauge stock so I thought I'd best get in quick.  They don't seem to ever want to order anything more until the very last 'O' gauge item on their shelves is gone so that was  another good reason for me to shake up my housekeeping budget a little.

 

While I was there I looked at the cost of their Peco 'O' gauge goods wagons and said, 'No!' very quickly.  I'm just glad that I purchased that pile of 'O' gauge wagon wheels a couple of months ago.

 

With now being in possession of jim Read's cardboard loco building notes, two axle sets of Slaters Manning- Wardle wheels, a miscellaneous pile of small electric motors and gear sets along with more box tank photos and drawings than I can shake a stick at  I think I should be able to do something without having to spend too much more money.

[Barclay]

Box Tank - oh, yes !

[Annie]

Starting to mess about with 'O' gauge again now that I'm feeling more well has sent my thoughts drifting back to Goonhilly.

For those that don't know 'Goonhilly' is a layout featured in an 'O' Gauge Guild publication that was introduced to me by Brother Schooner.

The original was created by a member of the Andover Model Railway Society and it is conveniently mentioned on RMWeb and amazingly the photos haven't been slaughtered.

It's also mentioned on Faceplant, but I know that not everyone wants to go looking at social media websites in case their brains get infected.

 

Goonhilly measures 9ft 6ins x 20ins so it is compact rather than being micro which would suit me just fine.  Having a Cornish association was one thing about this layout that attracted my interest, but really I think it could be dressed up to resemble any number of light railway end of the line situations.  (Terminus is a bit posh for a light railway).

Apparently this is what is called a 'Piano line' as devised by the Rev. P.H.Heath and published in Railway Modeller in July 1965.  The original used Triang track and fitted on a 5ft X 1ft baseboard.  (PM me if you want a copy of the article).

 

 

I must be feeling serious about all this as I ordered some more Peco bullhead chairs today.

Edited November 17, 2023 by Annie
Um.........

[Pacific231G]

5 hours ago, Annie said:

Starting to mess about with 'O' gauge again now that I'm feeling more well has sent my thoughts drifting back to Goonhilly.

For those that don't know 'Goonhilly' is a layout featured in an 'O' Gauge Guild publication that was introduced to me by Brother Schooner.

The original was created by a member of the Andover Model Railway Society and it is conveniently mentioned on RMWeb and amazingly the photos haven't been slaughtered.

It's also mentioned on Faceplant, but I know that not everyone wants to go looking at social media websites in case their brains get infected.

 

Goonhilly measures 9ft 6ins x 20ins so it is compact rather than being micro which would suit me just fine.  Having a Cornish association was one thing about this layout that attracted my interest, but really I think it could be dressed up to resemble any number of light railway end of the line situations.  (Terminus is a bit posh for a light railway).

Apparently this is what is called a 'Piano line' as devised by the Rev. P.H.Heath and published in Railway Modeller in July 1965.  The original used Triang track and fitted on a 5ft X 1ft baseboard.  (PM me if you want a copy of the article).

 

 

I must be feeling serious about all this as I ordered some more Peco bullhead chairs today.

It's worth noting that if you add an extra siding to the original Piano Line thus

or thus

 

you get a lot more play value operational interest out of it.

There was a second version inspired by the Rev. P.H. Heath's Piano Line featured in RM in Feb 1983 in an article entitled "Imitation is...". That used Peco Streamline (small radius and small Y) where Heath had used Tri-ang Series 4 so was a bit longer at 5ft 6ins  and looked more realistic 

Again,  it would take no more space to add a second siding 

 

 

FWIW This is my drawing on a six inch grid of the enlarged (in width not length)version of Goonhilly which I greatly enjoyed seeing at Wycrail in 2008. The break is (obviously enough) between the two back to back points. 

 

If any of my photos of Goonhilly were lost in the Great RMweb Image Disaster I'll post them here. 

 

BTW If you think the basic Piano Line concept is unrealistic, it isn't . I've found at least three light railway termini that were laid out that way for space reasons. They weren't in Britain.

Edited November 17, 2023 by Pacific231G

[Annie]

2 hours ago, Pacific231G said:

It's worth noting that if you add an extra siding to the original Piano Line thus.....

Thank you very much David for posting these additional variations on the Piano Line layout.  Believe it or not I'd not heard of Piano Line layouts until I started to look more closely at Goonhilly as a possibility.

 

2 hours ago, Pacific231G said:

BTW If you think the basic Piano Line concept is unrealistic, it isn't . I've found at least three light railway termini that were laid out that way for space reasons. They weren't in Britain.

As soon as I saw the basic layout, - and now your variations on the theme, - it was light railways and tramways in a restricted space urban or city location that very much came to mind.  All of them are possibilities that I'll keep in mind for future projects.

 

Goonhilly is still very much the kind of layout I'd like to concentrate on and I'm grateful for your redrawn version of the trackplan which looks just that little bit more eased for space between the tracks.  I wouldn't be able to sneak anymore length where I would like to site the layout, but a little extra width wouldn't be a problem.

 

All of your photos are fine by the way and escaped the destructive chaos that was inflicted on the forum.  I have copied them as a reference, but I didn't want to post them here without permission.

 

Edit:  One of the advantages of having a digital sub to RM is that I could immediately look up the Feb 1983 article "Imitation is..."  Despite the not exactly brilliant photocopying of the page it was still possible to clearly see the potential of adding in that extra siding.

 

Edited November 17, 2023 by Annie
More information

[Annie]

Thinking about it.

 

 

Edited November 18, 2023 by Annie
added a picture

[Annie]

I've got a very nice set of drawings for a G15 Tram Engine from the GER Society, but I think I might be biting off more than i can chew if I attempt to make one of those after being so long away from doing any scratchbuilding.  I think Wantage Tramway No.4 would be a bit more like it for getting my hand in again.

It's a little disappointing that Worsley Works has O gauge scratch aid etches for No.4 at a very reasonable price, -only there's no way that i could be counted as being safe with any kind of soldering implement.  Narcolepsy went and ruined all that for me.

 

I had made a start on making a 1/16th to the inch scale model of No.4 when i had to give up model making and that was going to be mostly built from wood, - soooooo why don't i make an 'O' gauge No.4 from wood as well.  I recently found most of my model timber supplies including a lovely sheet of 1mm ply.  I've got that superb razor saw I purchased when i decided to have a go at model making again and I've yet to try it out.

[Annie]

Wantage No.4 picture.  From what I can see the wheels aren't coupled.  I know the drawing shows that, - only finding a picture to confirm this where people weren't standing in front of the wheels wasn't all that easy.

 

[Annie]

From the August 1954 issue of RM.  Plainly I'm an old fashioned girl because I find these kind of model construction techniques fascinating (O gauge).

 

 

Edited November 19, 2023 by Annie
added a picture

[Annie]

And just to make it all complete here's a resized (by me) C.J.F. drawing from RM July 1961.  Be aware though that this drawing is not accurate in some of its details.  I have digital copies of the 3 page article by the Rev W. Awdry from this issue of RM should anyone want them.

 

Edited November 19, 2023 by Annie
added a picture

[Annie]

Woodworks here in NZ is a specialist company that does stripwood for all modelling purposes.  https://www.woodsworks.co.nz/

 

I used to deal with them several years ago and it's nice to see that they are in still in business and thriving as well.

I like working with wood and 'O' gauge should be just a nice size for me to have some reasonable success with it.  No stinky glues that make me feel ill is a definite bonus when it comes to working with wood.

 

I also had some luck with picking up 50 half metre Billings Boats planks in two different sizes at a discounted price so they should be useful as well.

[Pacific231G]

On 17/11/2023 at 18:42, Annie said:

Thank you very much David for posting these additional variations on the Piano Line layout.  Believe it or not I'd not heard of Piano Line layouts until I started to look more closely at Goonhilly as a possibility.

 

As soon as I saw the basic layout, - and now your variations on the theme, - it was light railways and tramways in a restricted space urban or city location that very much came to mind.  All of them are possibilities that I'll keep in mind for future projects.

 

Goonhilly is still very much the kind of layout I'd like to concentrate on and I'm grateful for your redrawn version of the trackplan which looks just that little bit more eased for space between the tracks.  I wouldn't be able to sneak anymore length where I would like to site the layout, but a little extra width wouldn't be a problem.

 

All of your photos are fine by the way and escaped the destructive chaos that was inflicted on the forum.  I have copied them as a reference, but I didn't want to post them here without permission.

 

Edit:  One of the advantages of having a digital sub to RM is that I could immediately look up the Feb 1983 article "Imitation is..."  Despite the not exactly brilliant photocopying of the page it was still possible to clearly see the potential of adding in that extra siding.

 

I'm happy for you to repost them here so long as they're credited. I would have added a few to my last post but the plans were already taking up a lot of space.

[Pacific231G]

On 18/11/2023 at 18:00, Annie said:

Wantage No.4 picture.  From what I can see the wheels aren't coupled.  I know the drawing shows that, - only finding a picture to confirm this where people weren't standing in front of the wheels wasn't all that easy.

 

According to Reg Wilkinson's  no 4  was built by Henry Hughes & Co. in Loughborough as an 0-4-0 "but usually ran as a 2-2-0 except in severe weather conditions or when working heavy goods trains" There are balance weights on only one set of wheels  so we can assume inside cylinders acting on the right hand axle (in the photo) with some way of coupling to the other axle when needed- presumably a belt or chain as there is no balance weight at all on the left hand wheel (and other photos show the same) which  any kind of coupling rod (which could not in any case be switched in and out) would require. The wheels were 2ft 6inch diameter.

From this photo, that the drawings were apparently based on, it appears to have had a locomotive (i.e horizontal with fire and smokebox at opposite ends)  boiler 

Edited November 19, 2023 by Pacific231G

[Pacific231G]

On 17/11/2023 at 18:42, Annie said:

Thank you very much David for posting these additional variations on the Piano Line layout.  Believe it or not I'd not heard of Piano Line layouts until I started to look more closely at Goonhilly as a possibility.

 

As soon as I saw the basic layout, - and now your variations on the theme, - it was light railways and tramways in a restricted space urban or city location that very much came to mind.  All of them are possibilities that I'll keep in mind for future projects.

 

Goonhilly is still very much the kind of layout I'd like to concentrate on and I'm grateful for your redrawn version of the trackplan which looks just that little bit more eased for space between the tracks.  I wouldn't be able to sneak anymore length where I would like to site the layout, but a little extra width wouldn't be a problem.

 

All of your photos are fine by the way and escaped the destructive chaos that was inflicted on the forum.  I have copied them as a reference, but I didn't want to post them here without permission.

 

Edit:  One of the advantages of having a digital sub to RM is that I could immediately look up the Feb 1983 article "Imitation is..."  Despite the not exactly brilliant photocopying of the page it was still possible to clearly see the potential of adding in that extra siding.

 

If you want a better copy of "imitation is..." I can PM it to you.

[Annie]

29 minutes ago, Pacific231G said:

There are balance weights on only one set of wheels  so we can assume inside cylinders acting on the right hand axle (in the photo) with some way of coupling to the other axle when needed- presumably a belt or chain as there is no balance weight at all on the left hand wheel (and other photos show the same) which  any kind of coupling rod (which could not in any case be switched in and out) would require. The wheels were 2ft 6inch diameter.

Thanks very much for this photo of No.4 which I haven't seen before.

 

The wheels have journal pins for mounting coupling rods.  I know from the E22 tank engines on the GER that removing the front coupling rods to convert them to a 2-4-0 from an 0-6-0 didn't take much effort so I would imagine that it would be the same with No.4.  If the right hand axle is a crank axle it would need balance weights, but they wouldn't be so necessary for the left hand wheels since there's no crank journals to balance.