52 replies to this topic

[Mike Boucher]

Hi folks,

Last summer, I started this thread on the old site, describing my first attempt at building an etched brass kit:

http://www.rmweb.co....php?f=8&t=46653

Well, when we last left our intrepid modeller, he had "completed" soldering, but had to paint the 7mm Connoisseur Loriot he had tackled. Here's how the painting/lettering came out..

First a shot of gray primer...


Then a little bit of Humbrol GWR grey and methfix transfers...


If you look closely, you'll see that I wasn't sucessful in getting the transfers lined up quite right. It looks worse in photos than in real life, but the "M" after Loriot is pretty far off. I'll have to weather that a little heavier to try to hide it.

Also, that shows where I made a mistake in assembly. Back in when I attached the triangular braces and rivet strips to the side, the rivet strip for the center brace should have gone on the right side of the brace. I put it on the left. (the directions didn't explicitly state this, and I didn't look closely at the drawing, which does show it correctly.) Due to this, there was barely enough space for the lettering. The "M" is right up against the rivet strip.

And here are a few photos of it in the middle of a short train on one segment of the layout I'm working on...



(my next project is to assemble a new chassis for that Lima 4F, and detail it up. Right now it sounds like its grinding coffee, but I don't quite have the guts to tackle an etched brass loco kit quite yet...



What took me so long? Well, in the middle I got distracted by "saving" a cooper-craft GWR match truck that I got from an estate sale. I wound up disassembling it and starting all over, I also finished an O scale 40's vintage US gas station kit, and my wife and I adopted a little girl. Plus the fact that I was learing to work with metfix transfers, which was an adventure in itself...

Now to move on to weathering and putting on a load. I also still have to paint the ends of the brake levers white, but that'll be quick and easy!

After that, the next projects are a D&S horse box and the previously mentioned 4F chassis from JM models.

[HerbertHopkins]

Excellent! I think you chose well with the Loriot for a first attempt. My first etched kit was a D & S ex GER lowmac which is similar in many ways. I was very proud of it at the time, but I didn't make anywhere near as good a job of it as you have. Well done, keep it up!

[Rob Pulham]

It looks pretty good to me Mike.

[jukebox]

Very tidy! Well done.

[Oldddudders]

Some sensible self-criticism is healthy in not allowing complacency, but frankly if I'd seen your loriot at an exhibition, either on display or a layout, I'd have regarded it as an excellent model. Keep doin' what you're doin'!

[Mike Boucher]

Thanks for the positive comments! When I started the thread, I said that I would share both my successes and failures, in hopes of saving other people the same aggravation. So, maybe I'm a little too self-critical, but I believe that self-assessment is required to improve my skills...

A few photos of one of the distractions... One of the reasons I made this "detour" was because I had never used methfix transfers, and I didn't want to mess up the lettering on the Loriot. So...

At an estate sale last summer, I acquired a partially assembled Cooper-craft kit for a single plank wagon. No wheels, buffers, nor couplers were in evidence, and whoever started it had really bodged it up... But, it was a "take it or we're throwing it out" proposition, so I took it.

From here, it didn't look too bad...


So I tried to put some Slaters wheelsets in, and the axle wasn't long enough to reach the bearing blocks?!?!? That's never happened to me before. Upon closer inspection, I found this:



Ok, that's obviously not right... So, Someone on Yahoo's 7mm modelling list sent me a pdf of the instructions, along with a few prototype photos. As I suspected, the solebars should have been right up against the weight in the middle there. So, there was nothing to do but disassemble the whole thing. Fortunately, I was able to do this without any significant damage...



The other puzzling thing was that there had been two holes drilled in the flooring, probably to screw a load down. Well, the load was AWOL, so I stretched some spare sprue and plugged the holes...



Then it was a matter of reassembly. A friend who also got some stuff from the estate had picked up some Slaters wheelsets, 3 link couplings, and GWR buffers, so he offered to send them to me since they would work for the Match truck.

A few things did get damaged in disassembly. The small braces which hold the single plank to the solebars was history, so I made new ones from some scrap styrene. One of the brake levers was missing, and the other broke, so I made some of those from scrap etch, with a small piece of round styrene superglued in the appropriate place, and some brass wire as the rodding...

Then I painted and lettered it. Lettering was a challenge, so I'm glad I learned a bit on this. Firstly, the transfers didn't always stay where I had put them. For example, I applied the "Match Truck" lettering, and when I went to clean up the gum residue, nothing stuck. I learned that there were quality issues with some of them, but this was most likely due to the fact that I used matte paint, and there can be compounds in the paint which mean methfix transfers won't stick. So, I sprayed the wagon with Glosscote, and tried it again. Worked better, but every so often one piece of lettering wouldn't adhere, so I would seal that side with glosscote, and then continue lettering. That caused a few delays. I also found that since each number was separate, I would apply one, let it dry overnight, see if it stuck, and if so, apply the next. So lettering the number on one side only took about a week . If anyone has a good technique to be able to do all of the numbers at once, I would appreciate hearing them!

The other annoyance here was with a huge transfer sheet, there were only two 'Match Truck' transfers, one for each side. So, I had to cobble up one side using one letter from here, a couple from there, etc. At a 'one letter a day' pace, that didn't help...

Anyhow, here's how she came out once I had the lettering done...



I think it looks pretty good compared to the prototype photo, but I wish I had noticed that triangular brace centered on the solebars.



After that was done, then I went to letter the Loriot. I still need a lot of practice with this lettering stuff. I'm so much more used to waterslide decals, and can't figure out why transfers are preferred in the UK...

[Mike Boucher]

Wow, its been a while since I posted anything here, but I've finally declared "finished" on the Loriot... Here's what it looked like as of 2 nights ago




The load is a Corgi that I picked up at an estate sale about a year ago, the chains came with the Loriot, and the blocks are basswood cut and stained. The blocks are glued to the wheels, but the traction engine isn't glued to the deck, the chains are actually doing the work of holding it in place. I can slide from side to side a little, but I don't expect that to happen when its on the layout. I like how the weathering came out, almost a shame to hide it, but I think the load really adds some visual interest to the car.

I figured that from start to finish, the Loriot took me about 16 months of actual time. I've got to find more time to work on models. I've been negotiating with my wife for 1 night a week where I don't have to do any domestic tasks and can go up to the workshop and get 2 or 3 solid hours of work in. For the past few years, its been more like 15-20 minutes here or there every other week...

One of the reasons It took so long to complete was another distraction have having to finish detailing a American prototype gas station for my local club's modular layout. Here's some photos of that:









Those details took an ungodly amount of work. Each label on each can in the storefront section was a separate decal! Two stacks of cans in the windows times 19 cans in each stack, then all the items on the shelving unit behind the counter. Lots of decals!

So, now on to the next etched brass kit. Its actually the 1st kit I ever bought, but I was pretty intimidated by it. Its a GER/LNER horsebox from D&S models. Here's the obligatory photos of the etches:







I'm not a rookie anymore, and I'm definitely glad I built the loriot first. The instructions from D&S are a bit sparse, especially compared to Connoisseur's. There are a few steps where I don't exactly know what he's saying to put where, but I'll either figure it out or ask questions when I get to that point...

As of right now, I've cut out the sides and ends, and folded the sides. I have to bend the ends (like a tumblehome) and solder the box together. Hopefully I'll get that done in the next few days. My club is exhibiting at a show the first weekend in December, and I want some visible progress on the horse box to exhibit there.

[Kenton]

The first thing those etches need is a damn good clean

Looks like another one of those fun kits without a floor.

[2ManySpams]

Kenton, on 15 November 2010 - 21:23 , said:

The first thing those etches need is a damn good clean

Looks like another one of those fun kits without a floor.

Kenton

What's the best way of cleaning really mucky etches like those in the photos above? Surely there's a quicker, less painful way than a fibreglass brush A good scrub with Jif / Cif perhaps? I did get a very useful little book that covered all things like this but I'll be stuffed if I can find it right now!

[Kenton]

2ManySpams, on 15 November 2010 - 21:31 , said:

Kenton

What's the best way of cleaning really mucky etches like those in the photos above? Surely there's a quicker, less painful way than a fibreglass brush A good scrub with Jif / Cif perhaps? I did get a very useful little book that covered all things like this but I'll be stuffed if I can find it right now!

Start as you mean to end

I have had some pretty awful brass etches - some supposedly "new" from the maker. Some even with a "plastic" protective coat. I think some brass is so poor a quality it tarnishes very quick in air. This, fortunately, just looks to be mild oxidation. So probably a clean with a mild scourer will do fine - and would be my first choice. Then work your way up the scratchy scale.

You are probably going to use a a fibreglass pen on the bits you are about to solder - but I would err on caution about using one all over - it is quite abrasive and will leave fine marks.

[craigwelsh]

Kenton, on 15 November 2010 - 21:23 , said:

Looks like another one of those fun kits without a floor.

Its the top piece in the top shot. Looks like a good enough kit really, D&S are pretty good.

Clean it as you go and shiny sinks at the end before painting should be ok.

[Mike Boucher]

Kenton, on 15 November 2010 - 21:23 , said:

The first thing those etches need is a damn good clean

I have cleaned the etches. A good scrub with "Barkeepers Friend" and they're so reflective I couldn't use a flash taking the photos of the etches. They are 10+ years old, but they're cleaner than they look in those photos. The tarnish was a bit heavy in places, and I didn't get all the tarnish out from some of the etched lines, but its certainly clean enough to solder. After its all assembled, then I'll really work at getting it clean enough to paint.

craigwelsh, on 16 November 2010 - 01:20 , said:

Kenton, on 15 November 2010 - 21:23 , said:

Looks like another one of those fun kits without a floor.

Clean it as you go and shiny sinks at the end before painting should be ok.

Craig has it right, its the top piece on the etch with the sides. Interesting design, IMHO: there are holes in the floor which match holes in stringers you solder across the bottom of the sides. You solder a nut to the body and use screws to assemble after soldering the roof on and painting. Someone suggested soldering the screws to the body, so the body will sit "on stilts" while the paint is drying. I may try that...

[Kenton]

craigwelsh, on 16 November 2010 - 01:20 , said:

Its the top piece in the top shot. Looks like a good enough kit really, D&S are pretty good.

Thanks
I was thinking it might be a bit like that rather iffy Horsebox kit from the Fourtrack stable (currently being reworked I believe by new owner)
Will be watching this, given my passion for animal transports.

[7013]

Almost completed my CIWL Night Sleeper, this is my first serious brass build and it has been really satisfying, will post a picture or two when completed (hopefully this week).

[Rob Pulham]

Kenton, on 16 November 2010 - 09:44 , said:

Thanks
I was thinking it might be a bit like that rather iffy Horsebox kit from the Fourtrack stable (currently being reworked I believe by new owner)
Will be watching this, given my passion for animal transports.

I really hope you are not referring to the S&D/LMS horse box from Four Track Kenton, I just picked one up from 'everyone's' favourite auction site. I haven't really had a close look at the etches yet.

[Kenton]

Rob Pulham, on 16 November 2010 - 20:33 , said:

I really hope you are not referring to the S&D/LMS horse box from Four Track Kenton, I just picked one up from 'everyone's' favourite auction site. I haven't really had a close look at the etches yet.

No it is the GWR one that has serious problems. I believe the actual problem is that it is "inside out" or that's the way it was described to me by the new owner. (Who IIRC is due to re-release it, soon - having put it back the right way.) Something to do with mixing blue and red lines on the master.

Can speak for the S&D version - though I was bidding - wish you luck with it.

[Rob Pulham]

Kenton, on 16 November 2010 - 21:29 , said:

No it is the GWR one that has serious problems. I believe the actual problem is that it is "inside out" or that's the way it was described to me by the new owner. (Who IIRC is due to re-release it, soon - having put it back the right way.) Something to do with mixing blue and red lines on the master.

Can speak for the S&D version - though I was bidding - wish you luck with it.

Cheers Kenton, it will feature on my MB at some point. Sorry about the bidding bit. It does make you wonder ho many time fellow forum members bid against each other. The same subject came up on another forum that I am a member of. With the result that we have set up a private area where members can post links to items they intend to bid on so that other members don't end up pushing the price up in ignorance. I am sure it won't be perfect but it's better than nothing at all.

[Kenton]

Rob Pulham, on 17 November 2010 - 13:32 , said:

Sorry about the bidding bit. It does make you wonder how many time fellow forum members bid against each other. The same subject came up on another forum that I am a member of. With the result that we have set up a private area where members can post links to items they intend to bid on so that other members don't end up pushing the price up in ignorance. I am sure it won't be perfect but it's better than nothing at all.

It doesn't bother me too much - I like to think I never pay more than I really want to
I've lost out on a few kits recently that I thought would end up with but some went for way over the odds.
I know at least one other forum member who searches with the same terms that I do and we regulaly bid on the same kits.
In the end as long as it goes for a fair price then it doesn't matter.
I think the idea of a "I'm bidding" area in an open forum would be open to much abuse.... sometimes I like to think I am the only one who has noticed the item (probably never true) but there still seems to be the occasional bargain.

It would be nice though to have a "Kitbuilding" thread from the winners if they were members.

[Rob Pulham]

Kenton, on 17 November 2010 - 14:24 , said:

It would be nice though to have a "Kitbuilding" thread from the winners if they were members.

I agree, it would even make it a pleasure in some cases to loose out if you could see the result from someone else's labours rather than kits disappearing in to anonymity (I had a real struggle spelling that, but got it right and managed to fail miserably with disappearing ). Ah that's life for you.

[Mike Boucher]

Well, I've made a little progress on the horse box last weekend, so here's the latest status:

I've got the sides and ends assembled into a box! It seems to be square, and all 4 corners "almost" sit on a piece of glass. There seems to be a little rock between two corners, but its about the thickness of a piece of paper, so I'm not going to worry about that too much. Here's what she looks like:



Still need to clean up the excess solder on the outside. I'm going to clean up the inside as well where the solder might be visible thru the windows.

The next step is to add screws to the cross members (to secure the body to the chassis), and add those to both ends, aligning the screws with holes in the floor. The buffer beams are integral to the floor, so it seemed a good time to fold up the floor. The fold lines are half-etched in some places, and full etched through in other places, presumably to help folding. After folding, the gaps where they were full etched are noticable. I'm going to try the "solder in small pieces of brass wire and file square" trick. I've done that on 1 of the 4 folds, and it mostly worked, but the wire was probably too small, so I still have some gaps to fill with solder. Here's what the floor looks like now:



The gaps in the folds are really obvious on the "lower" fold there, and you can see where I started filling in the gaps on the "top" fold...

So, the next steps are to finish filling those gaps, attach the screws to the cross members (using good old 60-40 solder!) and attach the cross members to the body. Then its attach W irons to the floor. My goal is to have it sitting on 4 wheels by the "Hub Division" NMRA show in Marlboro, Massachusetts, on Dec 5th, when I'll be exhibiting with my local O scale club. We'll see how close I get to that...

But now the question. The instructions say to drill out 1/2 etched holes in the buffer beams if modelling an early period where there would be safety chains. I'm considering painting/lettering in GER teak, just because I think it would look great to have a teak vehicle. But, what do these safety chains look like, and when were they removed? That's info which isn't in the instructions. Anyone have any reference photos? (and where would I get GER transfers/decals)

The thing that's holding me back from doing that is 1) not really my time period (not that anyone on this side of the ocean would notice, and hey, its my model, I'll build it how I want to) 2) I would have to order the paint from the UK, and the post office isn't keen on shipping paint and 3) it seems, from reading the directions, that early vehicles would be westinghouse braked, while later period woud be vaccuum braked. The kit came with a casting for the westinghouse "K" brake cylinder, while nothing for vaccuum brakes. So, I would have to source out vaccuum brake parts...

About the timeframe, I've acquired the etchings for a rake of 5 GWR "clerestory" coaches, old "Mallard models" kits. I'm thinking that the GER teak paint scheme would work tacked onto the rear of that train, so that's the justification for going early period. Of course, I need to get a loco to pull those coaches, (Mitchell "City of Truro" maybe?) but the kits were too good of a deal to pass up...

BTW - can someone tell me how to change the subject/sub-subject of a thread? I want to change the "continuation of an..." line to be more descriptive as to what I'm doing now...

[LaScala]

LaScala, on 18 January 2010 - 04:25 , said:

Here's my 7mm D13 now with rattle can satin varnish on sides, flat on ends and multiple hand painted coats of thinned Vallejo brown. Quite like the clean but not shiny patina. A great kit, far better thought out than most of the older staple 7mm fodder, and really does come complete. How is the 4mm version looking?

I am very glad I chose the newish Parkside plastic kit for the GWR horsebox looking at those etches! You only need to add screw couplings to that kit and the instructions are exemplary.

[2ManySpams]

Mike Boucher, on 24 November 2010 - 19:42 , said:

BTW - can someone tell me how to change the subject/sub-subject of a thread? I want to change the "continuation of an..." line to be more descriptive as to what I'm doing now...

Go into the very first post and hit the edit post button. You do however have to click the 'use full editor' option to get to the titles. You should be able to change the titles from there.

[Mike Boucher]

2ManySpams, on 26 November 2010 - 12:03 , said:

Go into the very first post and hit the edit post button. You do however have to click the 'use full editor' option to get to the titles. You should be able to change the titles from there.

Thanx! Subjects now changed...

[Scale7JB]

Hi Mike, do you have a very rough GER date, of when you would like to model the Horsebox ?

Regarding the westinghouse/vacuum... to my knowledge, the GE was airbraked to the end, just like the southern railway, and know everything in the UK is airbraked.... There is the possibility that when the Horsebox passed over to LNER after the GER was amalgamated, the horsebox might have had vacuum pipes and cylinders added to the already present airbrake equipment..

Dont quote me on it, but just what I understand from what I have heard in the past..

JB.

[Scale7JB]

Just quickly... here is my D&S GW horsebox..

Probably not the best first kit to build, but it went okay, so lng as you ignore the vent in the top corner.

I cant take any praise for the weathering on this one i'm afraid.. The talent was produced by friend Colin as it was sold at Kettering earlier in the year and the buyer wanted it painted and weathered in BR Maroon..

JB.