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Kirkby Luneside 2: Point rodding complete - 3-linking....

Lunester Layout EM S&C



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#1 Physicsman

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Posted 01 January 2015 - 15:14

Afternoon Lunesters and anybody else who is interested enough to pass this way.

A new year and a new thread for - eventually - a new layout.

I'm not going to fill pages with an introduction. Somewhat pointless when I can refer you to the KL thread, also in the S&C section.

The timeline for the KL build went from August 2011 (start of garage conversion), through June 2012 (start of baseboard frames), through February 2013 (first loco runs) to December 2013 (demolition of the whole thing, due to future house move).

The whole of this was a MASSIVE learning experience for me. New skills, new track, much larger layout than previously and - MOST IMPORTANTLY - lots of new friends via RMweb. The core Lunester grouping raised the standard of everything I did and I can't thank you enough. From a motivational point of view alone, your input allowed me to do more in a year than I'd done in the previous ten!

The demise of KL was a great shock to me. Even in October 2013 I was starting to build the platforms for KL station, with no thought in my head about moving house. KL was built to last forever - just look at the timber in the baseboard structure (!!!) (don't worry, KL2 will be similar) - cutting it up took over a week and nearly burnt out my power tools!! For those not in the know, the reason for the move was simple. My brother (who lived across the road) and myself sold both our houses and bought a larger one between us. Bigger garden as well. AND, of prime importance - KL2 can fill the whole double garage rather than the 3/4 it occupied at the old house. Yummy!!!!

So we arrive here. The KL thread is still open and active. At over 530 pages, 13300 posts and nearly 320,000 views it'll continue in parallel to this thread. But from now, I'll post exclusively in the KL2 thread (though I'll be polite and reply to anyone whos posts in KL!!)

What can you expect in here?

At risk of repeating myself, I'll put a few separate posts in here over the next few days to detail my general aims and how KL2 will - hopefully - be so much better than KL. I regard KL as a "dry run" and hope I can improve it, based on experience.

I'll copy the outline plan etc over to here - so you don't have to keep going back to KL - when it's appropriate.

For the moment all you can expect to happen is a gradual start to clearing out the new garage and to see the garage converted. This may take a couple of months, as I have other projects on the go (garden building for starters), but - unlike KL - I'll detail the conversion, step by step, as I know that some will be interested.

If all you want to see is baseboard construction, tracklaying etc, then you'll have to wait a few months.

From starting the garage conversion to trains running took about 18 months for KL. My aim is to do it in 9 here. And do it in a better, more organised way. Details will be clear, eventually.

So, that's the start of this thread.

Once the layout build itself is underway, I'd appreciate it if we could keep the KL2 thread to layout matters. Until then, it's open for anything related to KL/KL2 as you wish to post. Please use the Lounge for general stuff. And no, there'll be NO sausage factory or facilities in the vicinity!!

Phew, time for coffee. Pics of the current state of the garage later...

Jeff


Edited by Physicsman, 31 October 2017 - 19:12 .

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#2 Jason T

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Posted 01 January 2015 - 16:46

Hooray, at last. Now there is a thread going, you HAVE to get started :)

 

If I remember, I'll get some shots of the baseboards for Clayton when I am at the club on Tuesday, showing how the risers have been built. Remember, we want NO flat earth policy on KL2, and that includes below rail height.


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#3 Physicsman

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Posted 01 January 2015 - 16:56

Hooray, at last. Now there is a thread going, you HAVE to get started :)

 

If I remember, I'll get some shots of the baseboards for Clayton when I am at the club on Tuesday, showing how the risers have been built. Remember, we want NO flat earth policy on KL2, and that includes below rail height.

 

Jason, I'm glad you're the first person to reply to my opening gambit. On KL, you were post #3.

 

You, more than anyone (even Andy) were responsible for the raising of the standard of KL and I KNOW that will continue here.

 

As for "flat earth". Ha! The ground areas at either end of the layout - where there's a viaduct and a bridge - will fall away to a scale depth of 70 - 100 feet below rail datum. More importantly, the area to the front of the station area will be more open plan - allowing easier contouring.

 

As for ABOVE. Umm. Well, The Fell, mk 2 is likely to rise to about 200 feet above rail level....

 

And since you've mentioned it, and I wasn't planning to chuck it in quite yet, the next post includes the outline plan for KL2. Similar to KL, but simpler and more based-on (BUT NOT MEANT TO BE A COPY) Kirkby Stephen.

 

Jeff


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#4 Jason T

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Posted 01 January 2015 - 17:01

I was thinking of the embankments running towards the bridges and also the area behind the station where the access road climbs up from the main road. As such, the board that the station is on will need to be cut to shape rather than full width :)

 

If I have my way (and I reckon I will ;) ), you'll be using the jigsaw a lot on the baseboards for this one and planning out where the track will be going long before screwing the boards down :)


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#5 Mythocentric

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Posted 01 January 2015 - 17:03

Hooray, at last. Now there is a thread going, you HAVE to get started :)

 

If I remember, I'll get some shots of the baseboards for Clayton when I am at the club on Tuesday, showing how the risers have been built. Remember, we want NO flat earth policy on KL2, and that includes below rail height.

 

Yep! What he said! Looking forward to the first ventures into kit-building from you Jeff! Loads of fun and not as hard as it first appears plus it gives you the stock you need rather than the stock the manufacturer's want you to have. Looking forward to it! :declare:


Edited by Mythocentric, 01 January 2015 - 17:20 .

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#6 Physicsman

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Posted 01 January 2015 - 17:03

For your amusement and pleasure.

 

A plan of the Kirkby Stephen area, c. 1912 and the SCHEMATIC plan for KL2 (done with Anyrail, using Peco geometry - I'm using SMP/Marcway track/turnouts). The fiddle yard is entirely indicative - detail will be sorted once the proper available space is known:

 

Track plan 1912.JPG

 

Oct 17 FY using KL config.jpg

 

Jeff


Edited by Physicsman, 01 January 2015 - 17:05 .

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#7 Physicsman

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Posted 01 January 2015 - 17:10

The 1912 plan, as published, has North to the right and South to the left. 

 

KL/KL2 were built with the orientation reversed, Carlisle being tin the direction of the viaduct. So here's the 1912 plan "flipped", for easier reference: 

 

Track plan 1912 flip.jpg

 

Oct 17 FY using KL config.jpg

 

Jeff


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Posted 01 January 2015 - 17:12

Looking forward to you building and progress with KL2

Brian

#9 Physicsman

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Posted 01 January 2015 - 17:17

This is all a fair way off. I'll just chuck a few pics of how the garage looked yesterday, then retire to let you muse over it all for a while! In other words, I'm hungry and I'll be back later!!

 

DSCF1945a.jpg

 

DSCF1946a.jpg

 

DSCF1948a.jpg

 

When empty, it can provide a fair bit of space: around 17' x 17':

 

Bunker 2.jpg

 

Bunker 3.jpg

 

Jeff


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#10 Physicsman

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Posted 01 January 2015 - 17:22

I was thinking of the embankments running towards the bridges and also the area behind the station where the access road climbs up from the main road. As such, the board that the station is on will need to be cut to shape rather than full width :)

 

If I have my way (and I reckon I will ;) ), you'll be using the jigsaw a lot on the baseboards for this one and planning out where the track will be going long before screwing the boards down :)

 

Quite agree. There'll be a LOT of mock-ups of real track sat on boards (not theoretical Templot stuff) before anything goes down.

 

I've a lot of constraints here, most notably the position of the viaduct and the curvature onto it, but it'll be fun getting it all to fit. The problem solving is one of the main reasons I enjoy all this!

 

Jeff


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#11 Allegheny1600

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Posted 01 January 2015 - 18:01

Hi Jeff,

Congratulations on the start of KL2, happy 2015 too!

Wow, it looks as though you've emptied the garage already, I take the 'empty' pictures were taken around moving in time?

This is going to be fascinating.

ATB,

John.


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#12 Mythocentric

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Posted 01 January 2015 - 18:29

Quite agree. There'll be a LOT of mock-ups of real track sat on boards (not theoretical Templot stuff) before anything goes down.

 

I've a lot of constraints here, most notably the position of the viaduct and the curvature onto it, but it'll be fun getting it all to fit. The problem solving is one of the main reasons I enjoy all this!

 

Jeff

 

A good reason for considering L-girder construction, US-style Jeff. Straightforward to build and adaptable to any situation as far as scenery goes, with a considerable strength to weight ratio. A fair saving in ply too if you only use it for the track bed. Still plenty of scope for Jeff-style construction techniques though!

 

Regards

 

Bill


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#13 Physicsman

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Posted 01 January 2015 - 18:44

A good reason for considering L-girder construction, US-style Jeff. Straightforward to build and adaptable to any situation as far as scenery goes, with a considerable strength to weight ratio. A fair saving in ply too if you only use it for the track bed. Still plenty of scope for Jeff-style construction techniques though!

 

Regards

 

Bill

 

Yes, Bill. I already have a set of 8 different interlocking L-girders planned, though the precise size will be judged in-situ.

 

It's been a bit of an ongoing joke over the last 6-8 months on the KL thread - just how thick I intend the L-girder main struts will be. I'm always being told off by Mike (Dent) because I over-engineer. Have to admit, I'll still be over-engineering here.

 

Jeff


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#14 Physicsman

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Posted 01 January 2015 - 18:48

Hi Jeff,

Congratulations on the start of KL2, happy 2015 too!

Wow, it looks as though you've emptied the garage already, I take the 'empty' pictures were taken around moving in time?

This is going to be fascinating.

ATB,

John.

 

Yes John, the empty photos were taken on the day I moved. If only the garage was like that now!

 

Having said that, a couple of days after the move it was almost impossible to get into the garage. Yesterday's photos have the garage with only 50% of the maximum that was dumped there.

 

There'll still be plenty of stuff stored under the L-girder tables when the layout is underway. But a lot of the items in the photo will be removed over the next month or so.

 

Jeff


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#15 Andrew P

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Posted 01 January 2015 - 19:49

Hi Jeff, so you've started the thread without me :o  Looks like there's a lot to do over this weekend to get things moving. do you still have much Gardening to do still?

 

I see Steve is doing the front garden, WHY? is that just a Lawn, ahhaha?

 

Have you actually ordered any timber yet?

 

I have trains running, and that's earlier than I expected.

 

Good luck with the build mate, its now added to my Follow List, along with Dent, Bacup and the Lounge along with a few others. 


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Posted 01 January 2015 - 20:38

Looks like you've a lot of stuff to shift ,my lofts like that it's 20foot by 10 feet but can only use half for a layout as the rests storage of the other halfs junk , I've said I'm going to have a large car boot sale and spend proceeds on loco's :) but i swear there's more getting up there since that comment lol

Brian

#17 Physicsman

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Posted 01 January 2015 - 21:25

Hi Jeff, so you've started the thread without me :o  Looks like there's a lot to do over this weekend to get things moving. do you still have much Gardening to do still?

 

I see Steve is doing the front garden, WHY? is that just a Lawn, ahhaha?

 

Have you actually ordered any timber yet?

 

I have trains running, and that's earlier than I expected.

 

Good luck with the build mate, its now added to my Follow List, along with Dent, Bacup and the Lounge along with a few others. 

 

No timber yet, Andy.

 

I think it's going to take a couple of weeks to sort through all that lot. The problem is that NONE of it is rubbish. We got rid of 5 skips worth of that before the move. So it's really a question of reorganising and moving what we can into the new sheds.

 

My first target is to get access to the back wall, so I can start. At that point I'll order the first batch of timber and a load of insulation board. 

 

This is going to take time. If the garage was empty it'd be a doddle.

 

Jeff


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#18 Jason T

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Posted 01 January 2015 - 21:27

Maybe not rubbish, but do you need it all? (Looking at the dining table & chairs for instance). Garage / car boot sale beckons, I reckon
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#19 Andrew P

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Posted 01 January 2015 - 21:30

Jeff what about the celing I would have thought that the Builders would have lined that.

 

Now that you have to do it will you take advantage as I have with the Potting Shed of adding some Loft Insulation to help maintain a more even temperature?

 

Ceiling and thermal insulation 007.JPG


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#20 Physicsman

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Posted 01 January 2015 - 21:31

Maybe not rubbish, but do you need it all? (Looking at the dining table & chairs for instance). Garage / car boot sale beckons, I reckon

 

Interesting that you say that, Jason. The table and 2 of the 4 chairs, along with a spare washing machine and fridge - and a couple of other bulky items - will be disposed of. Either to a charity shop, for possible resale, or via the council "large items" dumping scheme.

 

Steve is still with dad in Barrow. He'll be back tomorrow and I suspect that we'll do a bit of sorting this weekend.

 

Jeff


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#21 Physicsman

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Posted 01 January 2015 - 21:35

Andy, the ceiling will have 12mm ply sheeting fitted to the underside of the joists (last time I used plasterboard which was a bl**dy awkward nightmare!)

 

Above the board we'll use fibre insulation, on a roll, to a depth of 6" (last time I slotted in foam board, but roll is easier).

 

The garage walls will have 4" Kingspan/Recticel board insulation, behind a set of cross-joists and a 12mm ply wall frontage.

 

It's all going to be cosy!!

 

Jeff


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#22 'CHARD

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Posted 01 January 2015 - 21:35

Well, The Fell, mk 2 is likely to rise to about 200 feet above rail level....

 

OH MY GOD....

 

Manifestation of Nightmares  


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#23 Andrew P

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Posted 01 January 2015 - 21:38

Andy, the ceiling will have 12mm ply sheeting fitted to the underside of the joists (last time I used plasterboard which was a bl**dy awkward nightmare!)

 

Above the board we'll use fibre insulation, on a roll, to a depth of 6" (last time I slotted in foam board, but roll is easier).

 

The garage walls will have 4" Kingspan/Recticel board insulation, behind a set of cross-joists and a 12mm ply wall frontage.

 

It's all going to be cosy!!

 

Jeff

That's interesting Jeff, for my roof I used 6mm Ply and also the same for the side walls, although I should have gone for 9mm on the side walls as I did on the two end walls, 9mm is plenty, ask Mike, ahhaha.


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#24 Physicsman

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Posted 01 January 2015 - 21:38

OH MY GOD....

 

Manifestation of Nightmares  

 

I was wondering when you'd make a comment....

 

I'm almost tempted to have one - even if it's only a cardboard cut-out in the background - on the layout to keep you happy.

 

Maybe not. The Fell makes a Q1 look beautiful!!

 

Jeff


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#25 Physicsman

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Posted 01 January 2015 - 21:41

That's interesting Jeff, for my roof I used 6mm Ply and also the same for the side walls, although I should have gone for 9mm on the side walls as I did on the two end walls, 9mm is plenty, ask Mike, ahhaha.

 

Andy, in that you are correct and I've written the wrong number in....

 

I used 12mm last time, and at around £30 a board (8' x 4') it was expensive. I think Steve had already suggested I thin it down a bit - as it doesn't really matter given what's behind - and he's not even paying!

 

Jeff


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