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Mark Saunders

Bachmann Salt Van

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I have always found the Bachmann Salt van strange as it has a steel chassis but the prototype has a wooden chassis, so I thought I would put it right with a Parkside one I had spare!

 

The part finished van is shown, what do you think?

 

post-3578-0-06044600-1441043254.jpg

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Very good to see Mark. Has always puzzled me to why Bachmann never upgraded their Salt wagon chassis... Only problem I've got now is that I have around 20+ Salt wagons that could do with this upgrade!!

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I think that the best option for a replacement chassis would be the Cambrian one as I believe it has the headstocks as  separate parts, unlike the Parkside one that has them as part of the ends!

 

Their C43 15' OH Timber Chassis is £2, so is a reasonable option for replacing the Bachmann one!

 

Mark Saunders

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On 31/08/2015 at 18:48, Mark Saunders said:

I have always found the Bachmann Salt van strange as it has a steel chassis but the prototype has a wooden chassis, so I thought I would put it right with a Parkside one I had spare!

 

The part finished van is shown, what do you think?

 

post-3578-0-06044600-1441043254.jpg

 

5 years on, during this lockdown I'm looking at various projects including upgrading a Bachmann 33-177 Manger's Salt Wagon with the appropriate wooden chassis to replace it's steel one. Can you recall @Mark Saunders the catalogue number of the Parkside Dundas chassis you ordered for your Saxa Salt wagon please?

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30 minutes ago, Garethp8873 said:

 

5 years on, during this lockdown I'm looking at various projects including upgrading a Bachmann 33-177 Manger's Salt Wagon with the appropriate wooden chassis to replace it's steel one. Can you recall @Mark Saunders the catalogue number of the Parkside Dundas chassis you ordered for your Saxa Salt wagon please?

 

It was off a PC 71 with the headstock carefully sawed off the body Which leaves a spare body! 

 

A Cambrian chassis may be just as good as it comes with headstocks ?

 

 I think any of the Parkside wooden solebar kits would work as the solebar is a separate mould from the body with the integral headstock.

 

 I hope this helps?

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Coincidentally I did something similar about three years ago!  Can't remember what bits I used.  Isn't the Bachmann Salt Van a foot too long, though?

 

P1020613.jpg.4c6e9e681e38ccd7fef903423c22efba.jpg

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On 31/08/2015 at 18:48, Mark Saunders said:

I have always found the Bachmann Salt van strange as it has a steel chassis but the prototype has a wooden chassis, so I thought I would put it right with a Parkside one I had spare!

 

The part finished van is shown, what do you think?

 

post-3578-0-06044600-1441043254.jpg

 

Quite right Mark. A steel chassis won't last very long on a salt wagon. 

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Seeing that picture with the diesel reminded me: always wondered, were salt wagons in this PO livery still running in the 50s and 60s, does anybody know?  I've always fancied one or two!

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32 minutes ago, tomparryharry said:

A steel chassis won't last very long on a salt wagon. 

 

And what about those bolts?

 

Was the corrosive nature of salt the basis for the choice of wood over steel? And would better lining have been an option to protect not only the chassis but also the other steel components?

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13 minutes ago, truffy said:

 

And what about those bolts?

 

Was the corrosive nature of salt the basis for the choice of wood over steel? And would better lining have been an option to protect not only the chassis but also the other steel components?

 

Good point. What I do know, is that we've got salt wagons at Pontypool, and the chassis are wooden. I'd guess that bolts are starting to corrode after a while. That said, some ships are recovered with the bolts intact; the woodwork has long gone.

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41 minutes ago, Willie Whizz said:

were salt wagons in this PO livery still running in the 50s and 60s, does anybody know?

 

They were, and the blue Saxa livery.

 

There is another thread about the whole question of salt transport, but can I remember what its called? Sorry!

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Thanks.

 

i think the other place it was discussed was in a thread about pre-group wagon loads/traffics, which won’t add to ‘late’ dates, but did reveal a lot about loading practices etc, including photos.

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My model, and my picture with the diesel, are both a bit 'tongue in cheek' really as I don't know when the wagons stopped being used.  I had had the Bachmann wagon for years just because it looked nice and I used to have a Hornby Dublo one, but I was inspired to dig it out and give it a better underframe when I read David Larkin's recent books about non pool private owner wagons on BR.  They include several pictures of salt wagons in use in the BR period, but I don't think any of the pictures actually have dates for the photos(?).

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They lasted well into the 1960s. However I think most of the survivors would be in ICI livery with a few of the advertising ones still about.

 

Circa 1960 according to the HMRS.

 

https://hmrs.org.uk/photographs/saxa-salt-locn-apex-roof-van-237-circa-1960-r3l-lhs-photo-by-m-ruggles-marked-non-pool-wooden-solebars.html

 

A few more here.

 

https://hmrs.org.uk/photographs.html?limit=45&railway_company=266

 

Including the famous Shaka Salt livery.

 

https://hmrs.org.uk/photographs/shaka-salt-10t-10-plank-peak-roof-van-no-164-unidloc-ca1955-side-marked-non-pool-empty-to-stafford-common.html

 

Worth remembering the vans were for packaged salt not loose.

 

 

 

Jason

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Posted (edited)

Now, the question is, having identified that peaked roof salt wagons branded for ICI, Saxa, and Shaka were running during my 1948-58 period, can I establish an excuse for one on the Cwmdimbath pickup? Rule 1 and all that but if it's seriously impossible then Rule 1 doesn't quite cut it for me, there has to be some justification however wobbly.  There's another industrial estate siding on the branch down towards Glynogwr just after Dimbath Jc, and this already enables traffic to appear at Cwmdimbath, only to be run around and taken away again, from a sawmill and cable drum manufacturer and something in shocvans and empty hyfitshocs.  I am therefore going to move the frozen food packing plant from Cwmdimbath Remploy estate to this one, and expand it in to preserving food with salt as well.  This leaves an empty premises at Remploy, so they could expand into something needing vans, or we could have a new tenant altogether, purpose as yet unstated.  

 

The last dispatch of frozen food will leave the siding this evening during the running session, in a Bachmann BR standard insulated and a Parkside Mica in BR white livery, along with a Kitmaster BR meat van, and these vehicles will only appear to be run around in future.  No ceremony will be observed, but the foreman may well be out with his 127 Brownie to record the occasion for posterity, and the staff are meeting up later for a session in the Non-Political, and Cwmdimbath's BR contingent will attend, with the exception of 'Preacher Bob' Protheroe, the goods agent, who is a strict teetotaller and religious nutter who maintains goods traffic in the valley by threatening customers with eternal damnation if they use road transport, or in fact for pretty much anything else they do as well...

Edited by The Johnster
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ICI did all sorts of chemicals, not just salt. If you had a process with a sodium content, that would need to be kept absolutely dry. Certain aluminium alloys used Sodium as a degassing agent, and bl**dy dangerous, to boot.  Some salts are used in certain paints (although I'm not sure which), and of course, chemical processes.

 

Google up "industrial uses for salt" and I'm sure the answers lie within.

 

Happy modelling,

 

Ian.

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Ah, but I need salt, which will provide rationale for a peak roofed salt wagon; chemicals in drums can be loaded into vans or sheeted opens.  A paint factory might be a possibility, depending on the quantities involved; if the salt is a small constituent of the paint, which I suspect, then it will probably be supplied in smaller containers as part loads in vanfits.  

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13 hours ago, The Johnster said:

Ah, but I need salt, which will provide rationale for a peak roofed salt wagon; chemicals in drums can be loaded into vans or sheeted opens.  A paint factory might be a possibility, depending on the quantities involved; if the salt is a small constituent of the paint, which I suspect, then it will probably be supplied in smaller containers as part loads in vanfits.  

Have you  never had Welsh Bacon, or Carmarthenshire Ham? Both use such an amount of salt that a solitary wagon wouldn't suffice; more likely a block train.

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Exactly, which is why my thinking is towards food processing rather than the much smaller amounts added to paint.  Moreover I reckon a food processing plant would be less unlikely in this sort of location than a paint factory, though there was a paint factory at Machen in the Rhymni Valley.  

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The salt vans were for domestic and catering salt and would be going to shops, bakeries, etc. To be unloaded at your local goods shed. You would (or probably not) be surprised how much a small town would get through.

 

They also got everywhere. The one preserved in Scotland was found in a field in Scotland still with its Saxa Salt livery visible. A long way away from Cheshire.

 

http://www.srpsmuseum.org.uk/10100.htm

 

 

Jason

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26 minutes ago, Steamport Southport said:

They also got everywhere. The one preserved in Scotland was found in a field in Scotland still with its Saxa Salt livery visible. A long way away from Cheshire.

 

http://www.srpsmuseum.org.uk/10100.htm

 

 

Quote

This is actually two wagons made into one. The steel underframe was built in 1903 by Hurst Nelson

 

How ironic! :lol:

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Posted (edited)

Domestic and catering means a more refined type of salt, but even a small village like Cwmdimbath would possibly get through a wagon load every 3 or 4 weeks; justification enough for me!  The fish and chip shop would have got through a fair bit on it's own.  I'll rethink the food processing factory, and use the wagon for domestic/catering supply to the goods siding.  Looks as if ICI, Saxa, and Shaka liveries are suitable for my period, and I am looking at 'Bay; Baccy do a nice weathered ICI and Shaka.  The squeeze has expressed a preference for a yellow Saxa, and this is achievable with a Dapol body donor with Parkside chassis (unless the Dapol chassis has a separate brake handle which I doubt given that it's a HD/Wrenn derived beastie, but of course the Baccy versions need the chassis replacing.  Unless the upcoming August 2020 release have wooden chassis...

 

I don't mind a bit of working up but it's only a wagon and I don't want it to develop into a full on 'project'.  I don't need a salt wagon, but i'd like one and it fits my policy of having a fairly wide biodiversity of wagons; it is justifiable if my fuel oil tank and cattle van are justifiable.  I like having a fleet of goods vehicles in which no two wagons are the same, and the few of the same design are in different liveries, even my two BR vanfits are one planked one ply.

Edited by The Johnster

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Don’t forget that Cheese and Butter making was more localised at the time and there would be a demand for Dairy Salt.

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