Tri-ang Railways.

[Nearholmer]

Looking at the Triangle layout at the TCS show on Saturday, I was reminded again of how much product, with how much ‘play value’ they bought to market in such a short period, and HD were churning out new products too...... no wonder the market was glutted by the mid-late 1960s!

[2mmMark]

The HD EMU always was a Class 501 but with Southern Region numbers - 57' underframe and the LMR style jumpers on the ends. The only thing missing were the bars over the door windows. The cab on the old Triang EMU is a pretty fair shot (for 1957) at the 1925 Eastern Section type but the compartments are much too generous.

 

I can imagine present day commuters looking longingly at that compartment size!

[BernardTPM]

I can imagine present day commuters looking longingly at that compartment size!

Ah, but these days they'd just put tip-up seats down each wall and make a big floor space to cram standees into!

[Legend]

...and producing reasonably lifelike models that kids like me at the time could enjoy at reasonable prices. They probably got at least as many, if not more, kids lke me into the hobby as HD, simply because they were cheaper, even if that lower price came at the cost of reduced accuracy and trying to use expensive chassis for more than one model even if that resulted in compromises like the diesel shunter. And it had to be reliable and work when the track was assembled on the floor, and the coaches and wagons stay coupled on uneven floors. And cope with bring put away and taken out repeatedly. That is so different from a permanent fixed layout on a baseboard.

Some of their 1960s models still stand up well to much more expensive new models. One only has to think of their EM2, a daring choice of loco back then, even if it was needed to give a UK prototype for their catenary system.

Us kids grew up, and with our own income, not just pocket money, could afford to spend more on our hobby once our kids had left home and we'd paid off much of the mortgsge. We wanted more accurate models with more detailing for our money. You only have to look at the catalogues over the last 60 years to see how the RTR market has changed enormously. And trying to satisfy both the low cost trainset and high realism models for adults markets is something with which Triang/Rovex/Hornby Hobbies still struggle today.

Triang and Triang - Hornby were fantastic systems for their time . I might have got here by some other means anyway, but my actual route was through a Triang Freightmaster set in 1965. My parents , while not poor, would have struggled to finance a Hornby Dublo set and the low cost meant that together with presents from relatives a got a lot of play value in one go.

 

Just look at Oscar Paisleys excellent layout over on YouTube to see what they had 50/55 years ago. A complete track system, inclined piers , catenary that worked . Show me a system that has that now. Simple but ingenious engineering . Yes , of course there were compromises , but that has to be put into context with what was available at the time . It was robust and above all we had fun.

Edited August 6, 2018 by Legend

[sagaguy]

It can still be done.This is one of my Triang EM2s running under Trix Catenary collecting traction current from the wire.

 

             

 

The trailing bogie was modified to improve the return current to the track.

 

 

            

 

 

                   Ray.

 

 

 

[roythebus]

The Tri-ang Brush type 2 was an excellent model for its time. the advert used to boast that you could read the maker's name on the works plates and, with a magnifying glass you could! quite how well it stands up to today's 31's for accuracy I don't know.

[Guest spet0114]

The Tri-ang Brush type 2 was an excellent model for its time. the advert used to boast that you could read the maker's name on the works plates and, with a magnifying glass you could! quite how well it stands up to today's 31's for accuracy I don't know.

 

From memory, I think there are certain features (exhaust vents?) that firmly link the Tri-ang model with the locos before they were re-engined (i.e. when they were nominally Class 30). If a decent model of a Class 31 is required, I think the Lima bodyshell is a reasonable starting point, but am open to correction here.

 

Cheers

Adrian

[Nearholmer]

Many of these ‘old hat’ models, in both 0 and 00, are anything but pin-shap-accurate, but they all pass the ‘can I tell at a glance what it represents’ test, which is all that boys ever wanted and, say it quietly for fear of upsetting sensitive people, is largely good-enough for me.

 

That having been said, the Triang 350hp shunter didn’t ‘do it for me’, even when I was a kid. You could indeed tell at a glance what it was supposed to be, but you could also tell at a glance that something was far from right.

[Legend]

I think the A1A-A1A Brush Type 2 as it was described then was a pretty sharp piece of moulding . And remember it was brought to you at a reasonable price. But there is no way that model can really compare to today’s offerings , except perhaps in Longevity. I still retain my 1965 original , she has past through BR Blue and is now in Railfreight red stripe. She does the job but is no where close to the standard of today’s models. Like Adrian I think the Lima one caught the appearance just about right, better than the newer Hornby version. The Airfix one never really did it for me.

 

Agree about the shunter, the lack of side frames was a major issue, and I think it’s too high or large in general, perhaps because it was designed for a clockwise mechanism. The Hornby Dublo and later Wrenn versions were much more like the real thing, but of course, very pricey .

Edited August 6, 2018 by Legend

[Nearholmer]

Yep, the Wrenn one was the first loco I bought once I’d started full-time work, there being no way I could afford it on the previous regime of paper rounds, shelf-stacking, fruit-picking etc.

 

I still think it conveys the heavy, ponderous essence of the real thing better than all the subsequent works of finesse.

Edited August 6, 2018 by Nearholmer

[Il Grifone]

Many of these ‘old hat’ models, in both 0 and 00, are anything but pin-shap-accurate, but they all pass the ‘can I tell at a glance what it represents’ test, which is all that boys ever wanted and, say it quietly for fear of upsetting sensitive people, is largely good-enough for me.

 

That having been said, the Triang 350hp shunter didn’t ‘do it for me’, even when I was a kid. You could indeed tell at a glance what it was supposed to be, but you could also tell at a glance that something was far from right.

 

My younger brother was given a clockwork Tri-ang set with the shunter, a couple of wagons and a brake van. Elder brother just had to put it out of its misery and after parting with 4/10d, she became a saddle tank.... 

 

The Dean Single also had a legible works plate. Mine is long since clogged up with paint.... 

Edited August 7, 2018 by Il Grifone

[GoingUnderground]

Having seen Sagaguy's conversion of HD carriages into a class 501, it started me wondering whether it might be possible to do something similar with a set of Triang suburban stock. So I started playing around with some photoediting software and managed to create the image below from some Triang coaches up for grabs on Ebay.

 

Before:

 

and After:

 

Both carriages have the right number of doors, but it would mean an awful lot of cut & shut and making good, and that's before sorting out the cab ends.

 

So I had a look at doing something simpler, and it turns out that it is relatively easy to add an extra compartment to the 3rd Brake and the extra windows for the cab so it goes from this

 

to this

 

and leave the suburban composite as it is.

 

Add a motor bogie and it all could come to life. 

 

A Tri-ang mytabin, in the (controversial) spirit of producing an additional model by utilising as many common parts as possible? Whilst the end result isn't accurate, I think it could capture the look and feel of the original if you ignore the fact that it wouldn't have been red, but green, or rail blue livery.

 

Sadly I've too many other bits and pieces unfinished, not to mention things SWMBO wants doing to the house & garden, to start playing around like this. But perhaps, one day.........

Edited August 8, 2018 by GoingUnderground

[RJS1977]

I don't know about a 501, but it's certainly possible to make a 304 out of them!

[GoingUnderground]

I don't know about a 501, but it's certainly possible to make a 304 out of them!

I was thinking of the 501 as I used them to get to work in the 1980s, and they ran with the Bakerloo line between Watford Junction and Queens Park, and with the District line between Gunnersbury and Richmond. So they would complement my interest in the London Underground. Also the Triang suburban is 9" long which is the correct length for the 57' length of the 501 carriages even if the "compartments" are too widely spaced to get the proper 7 or 9 configuration without a total rebuild.

 

But thank you for the idea, even though the 304 looks to be based on a 64' chassis. I'd have loved to have a model of the 304s when i was a teenager to run on my layout in the loft. It would have been the ideal model for Triang as it served Piccadilly as did their EM2 and AL1. It was a pity that they never introduced an OHLE multiple unit, it might have helped with sales of their catenary kit.

 

An OHLE multiple unit did appear in the TT range catalogue once, but was never released AFAIK.

Edited August 9, 2018 by GoingUnderground

[sandwich station]

It would have been the ideal model for Triang as it served Piccadilly as did their EM2 and AL1. It was a pity that they never introduced an OHLE multiple unit, it might have helped with sales of their catenary kit.

Piccadilly and EM2???

[GoingUnderground]

Piccadilly and EM2???

Yes, EM2.

 

The passenger services through the Woodhead tunnel to Sheffield ran from Manchester London Road, platforms 1-4. IIRC, station being renamed Piccadilly in 1960. The EM2s were withdrawn in 1968, so they did run in to Piccadilly when it was called Piccadilly.

 

Piccadilly originally opened in 1842 as Store Street, and was shared between the Manchester & Birmingham, which formed part of the LNWR in 1846, and the Sheffield, Ashton-under-Lyne and Manchester, which changed its name to the Manchester, Sheffield & Lincolnshire in 1849.

 

The name change to London Road was made in 1847.

 

There are stories of an EM1 being routed on to the AC lines at Piccadilly and coming to grief.

 

I can't recall ever seeing a picture of Piccadilly with an AL1 and either an EM1 or EM2 in the same shot.

Edited August 9, 2018 by GoingUnderground

[Golden Fleece 30]

Piccadilly and EM2???

Here is a photo I took of Electra herself in BR lined green at Manchester Piccadilly around 1967/8 time.

 

Garry

[GoingUnderground]

Here is a photo I took of Electra herself in BR lined green at Manchester Piccadilly around 1967/8 time.

 

Garry

Thank you for posting that photo. The EM2 is my favourite Triang loco.

[GoingUnderground]

Piccadilly and EM2???

Yes, EM2.

 

The passenger services through the Woodhead tunnel to Sheffield ran from Manchester London Road, platforms 1-4. IIRC, station being renamed Piccadilly in 1960. The EM2s were withdrawn in 1968, so they did run in to Piccadilly when it was called Piccadilly.

 

Piccadilly originally opened in 1842 as Store Street, and was shared between the Manchester & Birmingham, which formed part of the LNWR in 1846, and the Sheffield, Ashton-under-Lyne and Manchester, which changed its name to the Manchester, Sheffield & Lincolnshire in 1849.

 

The name change to London Road was made in 1847.

 

There are stories of an EM1 being routed on to the AC lines at Piccadilly and coming to grief.

 

I can't recall ever seeing a picture of Piccadilly with an AL1 and either an EM1 or EM2 in the same shot.

And with grateful thanks to Rivercider who posted this picture https://www.flickr.com/photos/blue-diesels/35520969205/in/photolist-4Sf4i8-4Sjg3d-9rq2FS-9rn4jr-98jyrM-9jtVYd-9yvq8k-4hPWSu-rhLgry-b8A2KX-W7SfBx-7DEb1A-26PqtTb-bPxmQK-aFbQbi-aTahAT-qEyepJ-FYLnt3-d1d7hq-qod3jt-zvW2yK-b84hmr-pWuaj6-Xc3m5p-4HuVzi-qoqNxY-qfdeKr-ZYcWeG-8Kg4tK-9rn6yX-qEYYW8-ahAWVN-9EQwYk-7v5Yeu-7wxC7N-8CZm7U-qEXsdH-inKFfF-7wtP22-jH4jpA-48eYpj-qFCbVj-7vhqMH-9DEJPY-4uh83W-4uhwoC-63PYJx-5xGtxu-9viazL-3JxGcW/ in this topic http://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/topic/136441-ac-and-dc-at-piccadilly/ in The Woodhead route sub-forum, here's photographic proof of an AC loco and an EM2 just outside Piccadilly.

 

I just love this picture. Reminds me of my teenage years and my EM2 and AL1 on the layout that I shared with my brother in our loft.

 

Thanks also to Sandwich Station who prompted me to ask if there were any such pictures around.

Edited August 10, 2018 by GoingUnderground

[sagaguy]

I can`t recreate that scene at the moment buthere is my refinished Triang EM2 along with two Trix EM1s.

 

 

               

 

Line up of some of my electric locos,Triang EM2,Triang & Trix ALs,Lima Cl.86

 

                 

 

            

 

 

                     Ray.    

[Legend]

And with grateful thanks to Rivercider who posted this picture https://www.flickr.com/photos/blue-diesels/35520969205/in/photolist-4Sf4i8-4Sjg3d-9rq2FS-9rn4jr-98jyrM-9jtVYd-9yvq8k-4hPWSu-rhLgry-b8A2KX-W7SfBx-7DEb1A-26PqtTb-bPxmQK-aFbQbi-aTahAT-qEyepJ-FYLnt3-d1d7hq-qod3jt-zvW2yK-b84hmr-pWuaj6-Xc3m5p-4HuVzi-qoqNxY-qfdeKr-ZYcWeG-8Kg4tK-9rn6yX-qEYYW8-ahAWVN-9EQwYk-7v5Yeu-7wxC7N-8CZm7U-qEXsdH-inKFfF-7wtP22-jH4jpA-48eYpj-qFCbVj-7vhqMH-9DEJPY-4uh83W-4uhwoC-63PYJx-5xGtxu-9viazL-3JxGcW/ in this topic http://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/topic/136441-ac-and-dc-at-piccadilly/ in The Woodhead route sub-forum, here's photographic proof of an AC loco and an EM2 just outside Piccadilly.

I just love this picture. Reminds me of my teenage years and my EM2 and AL1 on the layout that I shared with my brother in our loft.

Thanks also to Sandwich Station who prompted me to ask if there were any such pictures around.

That’s a great picture . Somehow just evocative of the time . Thanks very much for posting . It kind of reminds me of the scene from the 1967 Triang-Hornby catalogue . All we need is an ex HD Barnstaple in the same pic now (Impossible I know)

[GoingUnderground]

I decided to do a bit of "Triang Bashing", but in the nicest sense, of course, and convert the R.222 B.R. Suburban Brake 2nd into a Class 501 DMBS Lookalike. It's a "Lookalike" as I wanted to keep as much of the original possible, and didn't much fancy the cut'n'shot to get all 7 "compartments" so there only 6. 

 

it also means that i can use the "R.223 composite suburban as the centre car, provided I close my eyes to the fact that it too has too few "compartments".

 

I'm still working on it, but here's a picture of it after the weekend.

 

 

It's built in the spirit of Triang ,i.e. trying to create additional rolling stock by using as much of the existing components as possible. I've included the front end of another R.222 for the "Before and After". Please excuse the missing buffers on the Brake, I removed them to start work on converting it to the DTBS.

 

It is motorised, using the motor bogie from the R.156 S.R. Suburban EMU. The only non-Triang parts are some black plasticard to build the assembly from which the motor bogie is suspended. But the design for that was inspired by the R.156 moulding. There's also some plasaticard in the old window openings as they needed altering.

 

 

I just need to find the time to finish it, the multiple unit connections and the underframe equipment, complete the DTBS conversion, and then and decide what colour they are to be, 1950s Mid-green, 1960s Brunswick Green with yellow panels, 1970s Rail Blue, or 1980s Two-Tone Blue and Grey they wore at the end of their lives. Or should I even commit more "heresy" against accurate modelling and keep close to the existing dark red/crimson colour of the bodyshells. but that would be the least of my crimes in creating it.  Oh, and it'll need window bars.

Edited August 20, 2018 by GoingUnderground

[Il Grifone]

I feel another 'Project' coming on. I must look for some green brake/2nds....

[sagaguy]

I used these castings for the jumper cable on my 501.

 

                               http://www.dartcastings.co.uk/mjt/1111.php

 

                 Ray.

[GoingUnderground]

I used these castings for the jumper cable on my 501.

 

http://www.dartcastings.co.uk/mjt/1111.php

 

Ray.

Ray,

 

Thanks for the link, but they're not right for the 501s.