South Wales Valleys in the 50s

[Northroader]

The southern lines were quite fond of using shingle from beaches, but as it was smooth stones, it didn’t “bind” the way crushed rock from a quarry would. Cheap, but nbg.

[Darwinian]

On 13/01/2020 at 13:35, BMS said:

I m making a rather simpler model than most of the correspondents but I am particularly interested in ballast colour in the SW valleys, and rather less SW mainline, esp. pre-grouping. My memory from the 50s would be black (coal dust I imagine) everywhere except where recently replaced. And composed mainly of ash. 

Comments?

 

If you can find a copy have a look at Steam in South Wales by Derek Huntriss ISBN 978-0-7110-3729-8 which has many colour photos from the 50s and 60s. I don't image earlier periods would have been much different. These support the comments above and also evident is very dark staining on freight lines, between the rails and out as far as the sleeper ends, perhaps due to the leakage of fine coal dust through the end/side doors  of the colliery wagons.?

[tomparryharry]

On 14/01/2020 at 13:57, Darwinian said:

 

If you can find a copy have a look at Steam in South Wales by Derek Huntriss ISBN 978-0-7110-3729-8 which has many colour photos from the 50s and 60s. I don't image earlier periods would have been much different. These support the comments above and also evident is very dark staining on freight lines, between the rails and out as far as the sleeper ends, perhaps due to the leakage of fine coal dust through the end/side doors  of the colliery wagons.?

Yes, you're quite right. Coal dust would be washed out of the wagon doors. When on a curve, you would normally see a black lineside area, where the cant of the track raised up the one side, permanently  staining the lower side.

Edited January 15, 2020 by tomparryharry
spelling

[The Johnster]

Yards like Radyr, Rogerstone, or Jersey Marine, the coal's first port of call after leaving the colliery washery, were usually awash with water and coal slurry between the roads, even in dry weather.  It was slippery and you had to watch your step, as space between the roads was not generous.  Imagine walking down a narrow ravine on a slippery surface, only one or both of the cliffs each side of you might start moving at any moment with stock being shunted on top of it.  

 

Nerves of steel, boyo, wills of iron, hearts of steel, and knobs of butter.  For the sarnies...

[88D]

11 hours ago, The Johnster said:

Yards like Radyr, Rogerstone, or Jersey Marine, the coal's first port of call after leaving the colliery washery, were usually awash with water and coal slurry between the roads, even in dry weather.  It was slippery and you had to watch your step, as space between the roads was not generous.  Imagine walking down a narrow ravine on a slippery surface, only one or both of the cliffs each side of you might start moving at any moment with stock being shunted on top of it.  

 

Nerves of steel, boyo, wills of iron, hearts of steel, and knobs of butter.  For the sarnies...

Gosh, Johnster, you make the suburbs of Cardiff sound like Mountain Ash! Have you been on a creative writing course recently! (Insert smiley)
Dai

[The Johnster]

Radyr could be particularly nerve wracking, especially at night.  Radyr, at the Quarry end, where we Canton men picked up trains going upline somewhere, was fed from behind by through roads being shunted by the pilots at the junction end, and the sidings were on a curve.  So, there you'd be, all on your own, examining your train on the way to prepping the van (at Radyr it was always immaculately prepped anyway and all you had to do was put the lamps up), in profound darkness despite the yard lighting, with rakes of mineral wagons within inches of your elbows on both sides.  Wagons continually slammed into these rakes from the Junction end and you never knew when the noise might presage a sudden movement of the stock next to you. 

 

Having examined both sides of the train and given the driver his road slip, you'd repeat the performance, but this time he'd have blown up for the road, and the shunters would have called him forward.  So your train started moving, and then would pick up speed when he'd got the road out of the yard.  He'd have gone at least the length of the train before the van was clear of these wagon canyons, and you could give him the 'tip'.  I used to hang about at this clearing point so he could see me and, like all goods guards, had become adept at the art of swinging aboard a van moving at 15-20mph.

 

Not as bad as picking up traffic from Swansea High St. Goods.  Here you had to make the train up yourself while the shunters dealt with vans and opens gravitating off the bank from Hafod Yard around the blind corner of the goods shed in all directions, some of which were yours.  It was this sort of fun that made you realise why shunters were so prone to accidents!  Like I said, knobs of butter...

 

Getting back to Cwmdimbath, where things take place in a much more relaxed manner, the cattle wagon transfers arrived yesterday, John's usual excellent service (no connection satisfied customer) and this wagon will be finished and in service this evening.  I'm going to have different numbers on each side so that it can represent different wagons in case I want to run it twice in one operating session day (these take about a week).  I believe it is a D 1840, or at least closer to that than any other LMS diagram, on the basis of it's vacuum cylinder.  I like it despite it's scale shortcomings; it is a development of a very old Midland design and has a lot of character.  

 

I gave it what was intended originally to be a base coat of Revell 'brown leather' acrylic, more to obscure the incorrect NE lettering and numbers than anything else, which as it turns out gives a very good impression of dull, faded, dirty BR bauxite, so I'm leaving it as is.  It will of course have  a wash of weathering general muck and coat of matt varnish to finish off and seal the transfers, but I've found with this that it is best to let the transfers dry out very thoroughly before sealing them as if matt varnish finds it's way underneath them microbubbles form and spoil the finish.  This is why John recommends applying the transfers over a gloss surface; I found out the hard way! I've found you can get away with eggshell.  I use spray acrylic matt varnish.  

 

Photos of cattle wagons in the BR period on HMRSPaul's site show that whatever was used to clean and disinfect them after the use of lime had ceased in the 20s did not leave much in the way of a stain, so I won't be trying to show this any more than with the general weathering wash.  A few strands of straw sticking out of the lower slats seem to be de riguer though.  I'm going to attempt using real straw, actually Timothy Hay dust and sweepings, from the squeeze's guinea pig, it's about time the little sod contributed to the layout, crumbled up.

Edited January 16, 2020 by The Johnster

[The Johnster]

The cattle wagon is finished, lightly weathered, and in service.  Timothy Hay ground up with a pestle and mortar was a failure, so I used sawdust instead, which was probably a better idea in the first place... 

 

Not exactly the best thing Baccy have ever done, but it’ll do for me!

[The Johnster]

Not much modelling happening at the moment as I'm having a bit of a health scare and back and for to hospital every day for radiotherapy.  The problem has been identified early and prognosis is not bad, but it is a bit onerous for the time being.  This has not prevented the Dimbath Valley Railway board of directors giving the procurement committee funding for new stock in the wake of the moderate success of the cattle wagon.  An LMS short GUV, Lima, has been purchased from the Bay of e, and will retain it's LMS livery under a bit of weathering as this ticks another livery box for me.  Bogies are to be replaced and I've already ordered LMS buffers from Wizard to replace the pathetic Lima plastic mushroomblobs. Lima were not the best in the world below the solebars, and this thing will come complete with completely incorrect BR standard B1 bogies, hence the replacements.  Current thinking is either Bachmann or possibly a Kitmaster Stanier donor.

 

But this is not the big news.  Cwmdimbath has only one auto fitted loco, 5555, and could do with more (so, I strongly suspect, could the real Tondu shed foreman as photos of the area at my period show that auto trailers hauled by locos without auto gear as ordinary coaches were not uncommon), and the shed did not get any 64xx allocated until after my period.  Lord and Butler have been keeping a 4575 for me which I will pay for and pick up tomoz, in BR black and to be numbered as 5524, allox 86F 1953 to take up work connected with the new regular interval timetable; plates already ordered from MMJE.  His website says he's behind with orders having been involved in a car crash last month, so I'm not expecting delivery particularly soon; hope he recovers soon and completely!

 

Also ordered were plates for 6624, which will be the new identity of the 56xx that used to be 6602.  This has been repainted in a speculative unlined green early 1948 livery with Egyptian Serif BRITISH RAILWAYS lettering.  These plates will be red backed, and 5524's will be black backed.  It's only now writing this that I've noticed the numerical similarity!

[The Johnster]

5500, to be renumbered as 5524, has arrived.  A bit of damage had been sustained at some time to the slidebar bracket rh side which had pulled the crosshead off the lower side bar and the vacuum pump piston out of the pump, which needed a bit of gentle persuasion to fix, but apart from that she seems perfect and runs well despite the lube grease, not that there isn't room for improvement with running in.  She's apparently old stock but Peter says (and I believe him) she's never been out of the box and is effectively brand new, not a bad deal for the £60 I paid for her.  She has clearly never been run and the vac/steam heating bags are in their little plastic drug dealers bag still sealed, but it's been a while I know since Baccy packed new locos in expanded poly inserts, which might date her if anyone's interested.

 

I'm going for an hour's running session to completely road test her now in a minute, but I'm not expecting any problems.  The Stanier bogies are off the BT and that's all I can do with that project until the GUV arrives, scheduled Friday.  

 

To infinity and beyonce... (is infinity in fact just an eight that's got drunk and fallen over!).

[The Johnster]

Temporary panic with the road test due the front pony misbehavin'.  Back to back was well off, too big by almost a whole mm, and a bit of brute force along the axle has sorted the problem.  5500/24 is now therefore officially in service and has worked an auto.  No manufacturer is perfect when it comes to B2Bs, but this is the worst I've ever encountered.  Another odd issue easily sorted is the centre axle, which is for some reason shiny...

 

To the pub, sod infinity...

Edited February 2, 2020 by The Johnster

[Budgie]

On 29/01/2020 at 23:06, The Johnster said:

Not much modelling happening at the moment as I'm having a bit of a health scare and back and for to hospital every day for radiotherapy.  The problem has been identified early and prognosis is not bad, but it is a bit onerous for the time being.

 

Having been through that sort of thing myself a few years ago, I hope everything goes to plan and you are able to get bck to modelling very soon.

[The Johnster]

Thank you Budgie, much appreciated. Currently half way through RT and the cure is worse than the disease so far, but of course it’s got to be done!  Sheer exhaustion is the hardest thing to deal with and I’ve been very grateful for this weekend’s respite; even got an operating session in!  Not helped by a 2 hour 2 bus commute each way. 
 

But, as they say, nil illigitmati carborundum! 

[The Johnster]

Have picked up the LMS GUV this morning from Argos collection, and have only had time for a brief inspection before setting out on the daily hospital expedition.  Only another 2 weeks!  GUV seems in fine fettle at first squiz, but I am going to have to bodge/devise/modify the bogie mounts, or bodge/devise/modify the Dapol bogie pivots.  This might be a case for my occasionally resorted to press stud method of bogie mounting!

[The Johnster]

Flushed with the success of the cattle wagon and LMS GUV projects, and the arrival of a new auto fitted small prairie, the stock acquisition committee, flush with funds intended for the delayed Blue Box 94xx, has been behaving in a manner which smacks of impulse purchasing, and I would be very surprised if the accounting department don’t react with a strongly worded note wrapped in a half brick through their window soon!

 

The offending purchases are a s/h Airfix GW liveried A28/30 trailer cheaply picked up from a local antiques market stall, and another loco.  The trailer could probably have been quietly overlooked, but the loco is another matter...

 

There is a choice of things to do with the A28/30; I could leave it as is with some weathering, replace bogies to make it more like an A28, or use it as a  buffer/roof/bell donor for my crimson liveried trailer. 
 

The loco is less excusable and requires much more Rule 1 interpretation; it’s a s/h Baccy BR Standard 3MT tank from Hatton’s.  It’ll need a renumbering and WR lamp irons as it’s current identity is 82020; it is to be renumbered as any of 82001-9, allox Barry from Tyesley October 1954, and I’ll have to invent a working for it to appear up at Cwmdim! 
 

But I want a loco with outside Walchaerts...

Edited February 8, 2020 by The Johnster

[The Johnster]

The Hattons 3MT arrived this morning and initial inspection reveals a missing buffer but no other issues.  It will become 82001.  The excuse is sn imagined Barry duty that took a 3MT or a 5101 to Clarence Road on a lunchtime passenger job, ecs Strawberry Sidings (Cardiff General), then a premium parcels to CDB, crew relieved at Tondu by Tondu men, then home on the cushions. As it runs SWML Cardiff- Bridgend, it is used to refresh Barry mens’ route knowledge, and for this reason they can request to run Llanharan-Brynmenyn, which provides an excuse for the loco on this working to be the ‘wrong’ way round if I want. 
 

The loco is booked to take water at CDB, then empty vans to Tondu and a fitted goods back to Barry via VOG, which makes it a prime target for Tondu borrowing, so long as it’s back at Barry in time to be cleaned and prepped for the job the next day!

[The Johnster]

Sum mor fo toes wat I tuk. 
 

I seem to have got myself a bit disorientated; I blame the meds.  First is a shot of the current state of play on the 42’ GUV, sitting on it’s Dapol LMS bogies, taken by a drunken shutterbug who has fallen over.  Next is the new 3MT on trials, this time the work of a trained bat, and lastly, our inebriate has fallen on his other side despite taking a walk up the mountain to clear his head, as a rare shaft of low winter sunlight picks out 5500, soon to be 5524, with an auto, and the goods depot. 

Edited February 11, 2020 by The Johnster
Scansion

[Compound2632]

On 02/02/2020 at 19:09, The Johnster said:

To infinity and beyonce... (is infinity in fact just an eight that's got drunk and fallen over!).

 

You used that gag, rotated by 90 degrees, in relation to speed limits at Kings Cross. I liked the poster who pointed out that 8 is a bidirectional speed limit, at least with the LNER-derived cut-out signs. As to any subliminal connection between eight, infinity, and Beyoncé, I do worry about you...

[The Johnster]

Don’t worry about me, Compound; I’m beyond saving...

Edited February 11, 2020 by The Johnster

[The Johnster]

Started on the 3MT detail, work so far is glueing on the vacuum bag, their brackets, cosmetic screw couplings, pipes to bottom of cylinders, front steps, and fire irons from the detail pack.  82001 never had AWS AFAIK, and certainly not in my period, so the battery box has been left off and will be used for something else, not necessarily a battery box...

    

I’ve also painted out the 2s in 82021, so that the loco is now 820 1, prior to replacing them tomorrow with 0s from a HMRS transfer sheet, precision stuff that I was too tired to do tonight, so decided discretion was the better part of getting this to look right.  Any variation in the look of the numbers will be dealt with by matt varnish and light weathering.  Yellow route availability spots below the numbers, and eventually a Barry shedcode plate, and a crew, and she’ll be done!

[The Johnster]

Current state of play for 82001; renumbering and yellow spots done, and replaced missing buffer, but need to replace drawhooks and order smokebox number from Fox.  I have decided to institute a program of replacing all my smokebox numbers with Fox xfers, as these are correctly white as opposed to the etched brass of the MMJE plates.  AFAIK only DoG and Evening Star actually had brass smokebox number plates.  It makes a big difference IMHO to the look of the loco's 'face'.  I've painted 6762 incorrectly; for some reason I had the idea that she was new to Tondu in 1946, and painted her in black Austerity G W R initials livery, with red backed number plates to indicate BR ownership (!), but she was in fact built in 1948, a BR loco, and allox TDU 11/48.  This means she should have BR black livery with Gill Sans 'BRITISH RAILWAYS' lettering, or at least a unicycling lion as she was not xfer to Upper Bank until 1959.  The red backed plates say Gill Sans lettering, though, and I will have to order an HMRS sheet for this.  She will carry a temporary unicycling lion.

 

Further loco news concerns 9681.  This loco is the 'weak link', an old Mainline body with a replacement Baccy 8750 cab and a s/h Bachmann 64xx chassis which is not quite correct for it.  This chassis has been a bit of a prima donna and has had the keeper plate off so often that the securing screws no longer secure it properly and there is play, meaning that the loco has become prone to slipping gears in the forward direction and that the keeper plate tends to foul on obstacles such as crossing rails.  I have resorted to cheap superglue (my go to for screw replacement as it hold things in place but can be easily broken, cleaned, and glued again should this be needed, a bodge but it works) after a TLC session today; relubing, and adjusting pickups.  She's running fine now, but I have a feeling she's on her way out and if she gives any further problems I'm withdrawing her for spares.  I have 6 other panniers, including 9649 and 6762 with Collett cabs, so she's not an absolute essential, and her ancient Mainline tooling has several issues, including no cab detail, or not including cab detail, or something.  She's just turning into more trouble than she's worth...

 

 

 

I've discovered another potential issue with the 3MT; apparently some were built with fluted coupling rods.  There seems no reason for this, and that fact that Swindon used plain rods for them does not explain why they should specify a further type.  It's not as if they'd have had either in stock!  Mine has plain and I'm now not sure if this is correct for 82001 or any Barry example, so will be trying to find out before ordering smokebox numbers from Fox as she may need another renumbering.  Standard locos indeed, load of rubbish mumble grumble moan complain etc...

Edited February 23, 2020 by The Johnster

[The Johnster]

Initial research (going through Google images) has turned up the following locos:-

 

Fluted coupling rods: 82000/16.  82045 is to have fluted rods according to the artwork on their site.

 

Plain rods: 82002//5/14/19-22/30.  

 

I think I'm fairly safe with 82001 and plain rods, and will keep things as they are for now but 02 and 05 are suitable Barry locos from the same batch transfer from Tyseley in 1954, 82001-9.  The list is for general guidance and I do not claim it to be 100% accurate; for all I know locos might have changed rods during overhauls.  It is best to work from dated and provenanced photos if you can.  82044, the last 'production' loco, another Barry denizen, for some reason had the numbers below the cab windows 84xxx/Ivatt 2MT tank style, at least in it's original livery.

 

TTBOMK, all the locos modelled by Bachmann have plain coupling rods, and are correctly modelled.  All Standard 3MT tanks have fluted connecting rods; the model shows this correctly.  I've gone for 82001 for sentimental reasons; it appears on the oldest surviving spotting notes I have, written at Cardiff General probably in 1957, perhaps 8, in very scrawly childish pencil (I would have been 5 or 6 years old and with Great Uncle Ted).  The loco was no doubt on a Valleys passenger working out of Barry, but I have no idea what it was...

Edited February 23, 2020 by The Johnster

[tomparryharry]

Aha! TTBOMK! That's an acronym that rolls lightly off the tongue!

 

Let's see... Two Toasts Buttered Outside My Kitchen? .... No, that's not it.....

 

Tiny Tarantulas off (to) Milton Keynes?.... No, not that, either.....

 

Twisted Tuna Believes Of Manageable Knots? ..... No. Not quite......

 

Tijuana  Trio Buskers on Mexican Karaoke?..... Getting there....

 

Aah! I've got it! Thailand Tourist Board observes Mount Krakatoa....!

 

Got it!

Edited February 24, 2020 by tomparryharry
Ideas....

[The Johnster]

No you haven’t.  You can’t see Krakatoa from Thailand (you might’ve been able to see the cloud), it’s off Indonesia in the Sunda Strait. 
 

Despite the film title, it’s west of Java...

[tomparryharry]

16 hours ago, The Johnster said:

No you haven’t.  You can’t see Krakatoa from Thailand (you might’ve been able to see the cloud), it’s off Indonesia in the Sunda Strait. 
 

Despite the film title, it’s west of Java...

 

 

Edited February 25, 2020 by tomparryharry
Deleted my own post...

[The Johnster]

I just know, that's all...