RMweb Premium jamie92208 Posted December 25, 2019 RMweb Premium Share Posted December 25, 2019 58 minutes ago, PenrithBeacon said: My experience of being a passenger in a first generation dmu on Shap was that they went up very slowly and were mostly in first gear! Cheers Probably about as slowly as a class 40 on a special I was once on. Jamie 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Clive Mortimore Posted December 25, 2019 RMweb Premium Share Posted December 25, 2019 2 hours ago, jamie92208 said: Probably about as slowly as a class 40 on a special I was once on. Jamie Hi Jamie It was travelling at a speed to allow the punters on board to enjoy the rolling hill scenery. 3 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold 5BarVT Posted December 25, 2019 RMweb Gold Share Posted December 25, 2019 And perhaps equivalent of my experience going up Lickey with EE type 3 vice Peak (37 vice 45 for the younger readers). Paul. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
PenrithBeacon Posted December 25, 2019 Share Posted December 25, 2019 3 hours ago, jamie92208 said: Probably about as slowly as a class 40 on a special I was once on. Jamie I imagine that was after the bankers had gone. Expresses with D200 power were normally banked from Tebay. The loco was likely close to being overloaded on Shap on it's own. Cheers Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post LNER4479 Posted December 26, 2019 Author Popular Post Share Posted December 26, 2019 I'm used to going up Shap at 50mph (unassisted) with steam. 6233 in 2002 and 60163 in 2010. Here we are cresting the summit with the A1 at a minimum of 42.5 mph What are a magnificent pair(!) 19 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
PenrithBeacon Posted December 26, 2019 Share Posted December 26, 2019 2 hours ago, LNER4479 said: I'm used to going up Shap at 50mph (unassisted) with steam. 6233 in 2002 and 60163 in 2010. I think you will find that an 8P pacific is a good deal more powerful than a D200, also these 8P engines in preservation are pretty pampered things, it would have been unusual in steam days for this to have happened. Cheers 1 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
LNER4479 Posted December 26, 2019 Author Share Posted December 26, 2019 Indeed. Of course not all steam specials go up the bank QUITE so fast: 11 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium jamie92208 Posted December 26, 2019 RMweb Premium Share Posted December 26, 2019 On 25/12/2019 at 15:30, PenrithBeacon said: I imagine that was after the bankers had gone. Expresses with D200 power were normally banked from Tebay. The loco was likely close to being overloaded on Shap on it's own. Cheers It was a Cumbrian Mountain Express in the 80's. Class 40 Preston to Carlisle (rather slowly) the IIRC Sir Lamiel to Hellifield. Sir Nigel took over to Carnforth then the quite nice sight, at least to me, of Sir Nigel being replaced by an early electric (81 or 85) for a sprint back to Preston. All in all a good day out but the performance of the 40 on Grayrigg and Shap seemed appalling to me. However some of the occupants of my coach enthused about it. Jamie Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
LNER4479 Posted December 26, 2019 Author Share Posted December 26, 2019 (edited) I've always been rather intrigued by this picture (of an EE Type 4). Look carefully about two thirds of the way down the train and you'll see what looks suspiciously to me like another locomotive (can't make out whether it's steam of diesel?) lending assistance but with a further rake of coaches behind it! I don't think it's a fluke 'snap' with a train going down the hill as I can't see any sign of a loco right at the back and all vehicles appear to be on the same track (ie the 'down' / uphill direction). The most likely scenario is that the lead train has got into trouble, with the next train behind it already having passed Tebay (hence not possible to send out a banker to offer assistance). In such a circumstance, the following loco is having to assist as well as hauling its own train - there's 19 vehicles in shot in total! Whichever way, the lead loco is clearly not having a good day ... Apologies to whoever took the photograph but it was freely downloadable from t'Web (albeit v. low res) - I just didn't make a note of where I got it from. Edited December 26, 2019 by LNER4479 7 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Clive Mortimore Posted December 26, 2019 RMweb Premium Share Posted December 26, 2019 Hi Grahame The video you have shared, isn't the fireman on Britannia good, no sign of smoke just steam coming out the chimney. Where as the Jubilee is pouring out semi burnt muck from its funnel. 1 3 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium St Enodoc Posted December 26, 2019 RMweb Premium Share Posted December 26, 2019 3 hours ago, LNER4479 said: I've always been rather intrigued by this picture (of an EE Type 4). Look carefully about two thirds of the way down the train and you'll see what looks suspiciously to me like another locomotive (can't make out whether it's steam of diesel?) lending assistance but with a further rake of coaches behind it! I don't think it's a fluke 'snap' with a train going down the hill as I can't see any sign of a loco right at the back and all vehicles appear to be on the same track (ie the 'down' / uphill direction). The most likely scenario is that the lead train has got into trouble, with the next train behind it already having passed Tebay (hence not possible to send out a banker to offer assistance). In such a circumstance, the following loco is having to assist as well as hauling its own train - there's 19 vehicles in shot in total! Whichever way, the lead loco is clearly not having a good day ... Apologies to whoever took the photograph but it was freely downloadable from t'Web (albeit v. low res) - I just didn't make a note of where I got it from. Very modellable... 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
LNER4479 Posted December 26, 2019 Author Share Posted December 26, 2019 3 hours ago, Clive Mortimore said: Hi Grahame The video you have shared, isn't the fireman on Britannia good, no sign of smoke just steam coming out the chimney. Where as the Jubilee is pouring out semi burnt muck from its funnel. The story - so I understand - is that the Jubilee wasn't steaming very well so they were probably down on pressure with a 'black' fire hence the slow rate of progress. Britannia clearly has all the steam she could need but the driver is 'plodding' to avoid being stopped at the signal ahead just before the summit. Once the Jubilee had cleared section beyond the summit, the Brit gets the road and you can hear him open up and accelerate away. Note however the following TPE DMU getting caught up in the backwash of it all... I gather they've since 'sorted' the drafting with Galatea and it goes like stink now. 6 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
trustytrev Posted December 26, 2019 Share Posted December 26, 2019 3 hours ago, Clive Mortimore said: Hi Grahame The video you have shared, isn't the fireman on Britannia good, no sign of smoke just steam coming out the chimney. Where as the Jubilee is pouring out semi burnt muck from its funnel. Hello. It's that extra cylinder Clive. Probably not used to anything that isn't in stereo. trustytrev. 3 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
PenrithBeacon Posted December 26, 2019 Share Posted December 26, 2019 4 hours ago, LNER4479 said: I've always been rather intrigued by this picture (of an EE Type 4). Look carefully about two thirds of the way down the train and you'll see what looks suspiciously to me like another locomotive (can't make out whether it's steam of diesel?) lending assistance but with a further rake of coaches behind it! I don't think it's a fluke 'snap' with a train going down the hill as I can't see any sign of a loco right at the back and all vehicles appear to be on the same track (ie the 'down' / uphill direction). The most likely scenario is that the lead train has got into trouble, with the next train behind it already having passed Tebay (hence not possible to send out a banker to offer assistance). In such a circumstance, the following loco is having to assist as well as hauling its own train - there's 19 vehicles in shot in total! Whichever way, the lead loco is clearly not having a good day ... Apologies to whoever took the photograph but it was freely downloadable from t'Web (albeit v. low res) - I just didn't make a note of where I got it from. There is a similar incident in one of the B&R videos but I can't remember which one. Cheers Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clearwater Posted December 26, 2019 Share Posted December 26, 2019 To lower the tone somewhat, reminds me of ‘Enterprising Engines’ where Henry rescues both the Hymek and the other diesel when they fail on their respective trains... 1 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold 5BarVT Posted December 26, 2019 RMweb Gold Share Posted December 26, 2019 Q 7 hours ago, LNER4479 said: Of course not all steam specials go up the bank QUITE so fast: Feel sorry for the Brit crew. Signal check at the bottom of Shap is just what you don’t want. But the sounds were good. Paul. 1 3 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
92220 Posted December 26, 2019 Share Posted December 26, 2019 On 24/12/2019 at 21:35, LNER4479 said: Inevitably, there's a post-Peterborough; pre-Glasgow list of things to be getting on with. High on my list is to 'sort' the 1950s Royal Scot set. 'But what's wrong with it?', I hear you ask ... (anybody?) Well, I'll tell you - none of the designated RTR Duchesses will drag it up the hill! Unfortunately, my blue, sloping smokebox 46224 has turned out to be a bit of a 'dud'. As if to highlight the vagaries of RTR mechanism, my red 46248 makes a much better fist of it ... but that's in 1964 condition so completely out of era. HOWEVER ... help is at hand. Not what you expected? At Peterborough, Barry-O spotted these powered coach chassis on the Replica Railways stand - so I nipped round and picked one up for myself. The BG is the last vehicle in the train heading up the hill so it'll effectively be acting as a banker. Bit of a cheat but 'needs must' (quicker than the more elegant solution of kit building a DJH equivalent). The BG is here already having had irretrievable alterations made to its undersides. With a bit more filing of the Replica diecast chassis, the Bachmann underframe is made to fit. Side frames purloined from a redundant Lima MkI have been prepared ready for fitment. And there we are. Subterfuge complete. Have to wait till Glasgow to try it out mind. Meanwhile, deep in the darkest recesses of the chapel, something is stirring... Looks like bit of a big job broke out? With a new decade just around the corner, standby for a landmark posting on 1st Jan. I'll keep you in suspenders until then I really should have given you one of mine apologies! Iain 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lowlander Posted December 26, 2019 Share Posted December 26, 2019 5 hours ago, LNER4479 said: I've always been rather intrigued by this picture (of an EE Type 4). Look carefully about two thirds of the way down the train and you'll see what looks suspiciously to me like another locomotive (can't make out whether it's steam of diesel?) lending assistance but with a further rake of coaches behind it! I don't think it's a fluke 'snap' with a train going down the hill as I can't see any sign of a loco right at the back and all vehicles appear to be on the same track (ie the 'down' / uphill direction). The most likely scenario is that the lead train has got into trouble, with the next train behind it already having passed Tebay (hence not possible to send out a banker to offer assistance). In such a circumstance, the following loco is having to assist as well as hauling its own train - there's 19 vehicles in shot in total! Whichever way, the lead loco is clearly not having a good day ... Apologies to whoever took the photograph but it was freely downloadable from t'Web (albeit v. low res) - I just didn't make a note of where I got it from. Hi From what I can make out from the picture. There is a tank engine banking the leading train, which in turn has another class 40 and train attached to it. All the best Stephen 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium melmerby Posted December 26, 2019 RMweb Premium Share Posted December 26, 2019 8 hours ago, LNER4479 said: Indeed. Of course not all steam specials go up the bank QUITE so fast: I notice the two kettles are holding up an EMU! 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Enterprisingwestern Posted December 27, 2019 RMweb Gold Share Posted December 27, 2019 On 24/12/2019 at 22:35, LNER4479 said: Meanwhile, deep in the darkest recesses of the chapel, something is stirring... Looks like bit of a big job broke out? With a new decade just around the corner, standby for a landmark posting on 1st Jan. I'll keep you in suspenders until then Did the police catch the burglars? Mike. 4 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post LNER4479 Posted December 29, 2019 Author Popular Post Share Posted December 29, 2019 (edited) Whilst we're trying to contain our excitement, awaiting the New Year's Day posting, thought this might be of interest. This is me photographing a photo cut out from a 1950s 'Railway World' (I think - Dad passed it on to me). The location is of course the Lune Gorge so this train has just descended Shap Bank. To date, we have only token local services depicted on the layout but have become aware of this working which allows us to depict something a bit more accurate and convincing. This train left Carlisle at 1.51pm and called at all stations (Penrith, Shap, Tebay and Low Gill) to Oxenholme, before turning round and heading back north. That was pretty much it for the middle-of-the-day service for those stations. But it is of course the stock that catches the eye. Apparently this service made use of a Tyne Valley set that was available for the afternoon, hence the all teak formation. We reckon this is c.1952 so quite remarkable to find four out of five of these vehicles still in teak livery ... but there again it's perhaps typical of the early BR era with the newly nationalised railway taking time to find its feet? It's a smidgen early for us - we've said from 1953 onwards - but FAR too good to resist. Rule 1 and all that. Of course, being teak stock, we might just have one or two to hand (can't imagine why?). None of these have a role currently on Grantham nor are they likely to have one in the foreseeable future. SO the plan is to make up a representation of this train. Another picture shows a completely different formation (with at least one Thompson coach) so it might not be exactly as per the above pic. We'll probably start with a loose approximation and then tend towards a more convincing train as we work on individual vehicles. Thanks to the kind offices of Barry-O, a Hornby Stanier 2-6-4T has already been acquired. Grateful thanks to Tony Wright who had a go at assembling a homage to this train in late 1950s guise on Little Bytham. Look out for the 1.51pm Carlisle-Oxenholme heading down the bank at Glasgow and York. Edited December 29, 2019 by LNER4479 20 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
LNER4479 Posted December 31, 2019 Author Share Posted December 31, 2019 On 24/12/2019 at 21:35, LNER4479 said: In the darkest recesses of the chapel, something is stirring... With a new decade just around the corner, standby for a landmark posting on 1st Jan. I'll keep you in suspenders until then Only 24 hours to go. You won't want to miss tomorrow's post (especially if you like insane trackplans) 2 1 2 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gibbo675 Posted December 31, 2019 Share Posted December 31, 2019 (edited) 1 hour ago, LNER4479 said: Only 24 hours to go. You won't want to miss tomorrow's post (especially if you like insane trackplans) Hi LNER, Is it from a 1970's Hornby track plan book ??? You will have trouble being more inane than the larger plans in the 5th edition !!! Gibbo. Edited December 31, 2019 by Gibbo675 Spelling 1 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
LNER4479 Posted December 31, 2019 Author Share Posted December 31, 2019 Definitely more insane ... but hopefully not as inane... 1 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold teaky Posted December 31, 2019 RMweb Gold Share Posted December 31, 2019 You're tackling the approach to Newcastle Upon Tyne? You're cutting Peco track to fit? Baz is really looking forward to the ballasting. 6 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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