fezza Posted October 7, 2021 Share Posted October 7, 2021 3 hours ago, Davexoc said: Maybe they were made to a pricepoint, one that didn't allow for the printing masks to be produced. They are cheap and would be classed as 'Railroad' in Hornby speak? You might be right Davexoc but the other Dapol Mk3s are as cheap and have the surrounds. It just seems like a cock up really. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
KMS Railtech Posted October 8, 2021 Share Posted October 8, 2021 19 hours ago, John M Upton said: What shades of Intercity grey are those supposed to be? Also despite the later o/h warning stickers, they missed off the orange cant rail line... EDIT - Just noticed there are quite a lot of markings missing off the livery. One for a detailing up project rather than ready to run I think. I intended to buy an IC one to Scotrail blue stripe it (there was one) but I reckon there could be a complete repaint on the cards looking at that. Any sign of the blue/grey versions yet? Have you got a photo of this? it seems like it did exist but we’ve never found a photo! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium John M Upton Posted October 8, 2021 RMweb Premium Share Posted October 8, 2021 There was thread about it elsewhere that did have a link to a photo but the link is now dead unfortunately. It appears there were two, initially it was thought the stripe was the standard light blue but later it seems it was darker rail blue instead. There is a photo of a Mk3 SO in the same colours with rail blue stripe on Flickr still and I intend to use that as a reference for the time being. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium John M Upton Posted October 8, 2021 RMweb Premium Share Posted October 8, 2021 Just picked up an Intercity Exec one and buffered it up to a IC Farish Mk1... Err, yeah... Rather than a simple stripe repaint and some titivating, this is starting to look like a full respray... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium njee20 Posted October 8, 2021 RMweb Premium Share Posted October 8, 2021 For me the light grey is too white, I prefer the warmer hue of the Farish mk1. But this is just Oxford mk3s all over again! Did they use that as the inspiration?! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium njee20 Posted October 8, 2021 RMweb Premium Share Posted October 8, 2021 18 hours ago, Davexoc said: Maybe they were made to a pricepoint, one that didn't allow for the printing masks to be produced. They are cheap and would be classed as 'Railroad' in Hornby speak? I think that’s a dangerous assertion. They are the only N gauge mk3 available. A lot of the errors are not present on the cheaper ‘normal’ mk3s, they’ve been introduced on the sleeper. These have never been marketed as a budget model. Dapol have been upfront in saying they weren’t tooling for different catering vehicles, due to cost, which is fine. These just feel like errors. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
woodenhead Posted October 8, 2021 Share Posted October 8, 2021 11 minutes ago, njee20 said: I think that’s a dangerous assertion. They are the only N gauge mk3 available. A lot of the errors are not present on the cheaper ‘normal’ mk3s, they’ve been introduced on the sleeper. These have never been marketed as a budget model. Dapol have been upfront in saying they weren’t tooling for different catering vehicles, due to cost, which is fine. These just feel like errors. Possibly, or as cost of production has increased they have absorbed it by doing less on the model to keep the price low. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium John M Upton Posted October 8, 2021 RMweb Premium Share Posted October 8, 2021 Some more pictures before I start to tackle it with sharp implements... The interior looks pretty good but the ends seem to be missing the tail lights? 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steadfast Posted October 8, 2021 Share Posted October 8, 2021 21 minutes ago, John M Upton said: The interior looks pretty good but the ends seem to be missing the tail lights? I mentioned that bottom of page 3 John, so you're not the only one to pick it up. But I suspect for the vast majority "ooh it's a sleeper" will do. The ends don't look right for any variety of loco hauled MK3 sadly. I get the feeling of Farish, Revolution or Cavalex had churned these out there'd be hell to pay. Hey ho. As I said previously, hopefully these end up cheap enough to chop, paint and put some sticky bits on. Jo Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
woodenhead Posted October 8, 2021 Share Posted October 8, 2021 Is that an image of a cat or an exercise cycle on the vehicle end? 4 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Kris Posted October 8, 2021 RMweb Premium Share Posted October 8, 2021 10 minutes ago, Steadfast said: I mentioned that bottom of page 3 John, so you're not the only one to pick it up. But I suspect for the vast majority "ooh it's a sleeper" will do. The ends don't look right for any variety of loco hauled MK3 sadly. I get the feeling of Farish, Revolution or Cavalex had churned these out there'd be hell to pay. Hey ho. As I said previously, hopefully these end up cheap enough to chop, paint and put some sticky bits on. Jo I agree that Cavalex or Revolution would have had hell to pay, but had Farish have made them I feel it is likely that they would have had much less stick than Dapol, as for some contributors it feels that they can do no wrong. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
woodenhead Posted October 8, 2021 Share Posted October 8, 2021 12 minutes ago, Steadfast said: I mentioned that bottom of page 3 John, so you're not the only one to pick it up. But I suspect for the vast majority "ooh it's a sleeper" will do. The ends don't look right for any variety of loco hauled MK3 sadly. I get the feeling of Farish, Revolution or Cavalex had churned these out there'd be hell to pay. Hey ho. As I said previously, hopefully these end up cheap enough to chop, paint and put some sticky bits on. Jo I think Dapol get away with this because they keep the prices down, but it's making them now look at odds with Farish and RevolutioN. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium njee20 Posted October 8, 2021 RMweb Premium Share Posted October 8, 2021 59 minutes ago, woodenhead said: Possibly, or as cost of production has increased they have absorbed it by doing less on the model to keep the price low. Occam's razor and that, I'll wager it's just an error. I think that would be a really poor show if that's what Dapol were doing though. Are you suggesting they're not going to put cantrail stripes on anything now, to keep costs down? Where does that end? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium njee20 Posted October 8, 2021 RMweb Premium Share Posted October 8, 2021 30 minutes ago, Steadfast said: I mentioned that bottom of page 3 John, so you're not the only one to pick it up. But I suspect for the vast majority "ooh it's a sleeper" will do. The ends don't look right for any variety of loco hauled MK3 sadly. I get the feeling of Farish, Revolution or Cavalex had churned these out there'd be hell to pay. Hey ho. As I said previously, hopefully these end up cheap enough to chop, paint and put some sticky bits on. Jo From the slightly oblique angled shot I'd hoped they were still there, albeit too recessed, but yes, very clearly not been moulded. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium JR_P Posted October 8, 2021 RMweb Premium Share Posted October 8, 2021 Being cheap to buy doesn’t excuse basic livery errors…. simple care and attention (and a QC review) should not add anything to the cost of the model. You can spend hours reviewing livery diagrams and I know from personal experience that you do get tunnel vision and miss things - but not such basics like the font and the principal colours! I think if Dapol didn’t have prior history of such errors people could be a bit more forgiving and put it down to a ‘bad day at the office’, but their inconsistency is so consistent!!! 1 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steadfast Posted October 8, 2021 Share Posted October 8, 2021 28 minutes ago, Kris said: I agree that Cavalex or Revolution would have had hell to pay, but had Farish have made them I feel it is likely that they would have had much less stick than Dapol, as for some contributors it feels that they can do no wrong. True, but equally there seems to be a few with the view that Dapol can do no wrong. There's elements on Farish models I'm not keen on (37 NEMs, Mish mash of wire and moulded handrails on some locos, no air brake mk1s for example) and there may be the odd dubious colour used, but (unless I've missed something steamy, in which case I apologise) there's been nothing akin to this MK3 for many years. 10 minutes ago, njee20 said: Where does that end? Unpainted models so we can do it ourselves, he says in jest! 8 minutes ago, JR_P said: Being cheap to buy doesn’t excuse basic livery errors…. simple care and attention (and a QC review) should not add anything to the cost of the model. You can spend hours reviewing livery diagrams and I know from personal experience that you do get tunnel vision and miss things - but not such basics like the font and the principal colours! I think if Dapol didn’t have prior history of such errors people could be a bit more forgiving and put it down to a ‘bad day at the office’, but their inconsistency is so consistent!!! Perfectly put! Jo 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
woodenhead Posted October 8, 2021 Share Posted October 8, 2021 27 minutes ago, njee20 said: Occam's razor and that, I'll wager it's just an error. I think that would be a really poor show if that's what Dapol were doing though. Are you suggesting they're not going to put cantrail stripes on anything now, to keep costs down? Where does that end? It may be less research, less checking, less verification and maybe simplifying the spraying process. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium njee20 Posted October 8, 2021 RMweb Premium Share Posted October 8, 2021 Yes, but again, where does that end? Given their ongoing ability to make basic livery errors I’m sticking by my statement. I’m not sure the majority of the market would choose a ‘low fat’ product to keep costs down. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
woodenhead Posted October 8, 2021 Share Posted October 8, 2021 8 minutes ago, njee20 said: Yes, but again, where does that end? Given their ongoing ability to make basic livery errors I’m sticking by my statement. I’m not sure the majority of the market would choose a ‘low fat’ product to keep costs down. is this ongoing ability to make livery errors restricted to N gauge or do they do it across the board? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium John M Upton Posted October 8, 2021 RMweb Premium Share Posted October 8, 2021 From what I have seen, the errors seem to be mainly in N but OO scale does get them as well, remember the Class 68's with the Compass logo printed too far along the bodyside? They did produce free body replacements for those though. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Adam1701D Posted October 8, 2021 RMweb Gold Share Posted October 8, 2021 OK, I've gone and ordered one to measure up for vinyls. I'll see if I can improve on the RTR finish... 2 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
woodenhead Posted October 8, 2021 Share Posted October 8, 2021 3 minutes ago, Captain Electra said: OK, I've gone and ordered one to measure up for vinyls. I'll see if I can improve on the RTR finish... What with these and the TPE vinyls for the Kato 800, these RTR manufacturers are doing you favours 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold TomE Posted October 8, 2021 RMweb Gold Share Posted October 8, 2021 50 minutes ago, Kris said: I agree that Cavalex or Revolution would have had hell to pay, but had Farish have made them I feel it is likely that they would have had much less stick than Dapol, as for some contributors it feels that they can do no wrong. I guess it helps that 99% of the time Farish (and Revolution) get it right so there is less to criticise, except the lack of output, lead times and of course, the price. The problem with Dapol is one minute they are producing models of Class 68 quality, which I still rate as one of the best modern image locos ever produced in N Gauge, and the next they are churning out tat like these. In my case this means that I will never pre-order a Dapol product because you just don't know where it's going to be on the scale of 68 to Pacer. At least with the other manufacturers you can be confident that when it arrives it will be a generally sound model that runs well and looks good out of the box. Tom. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
woodenhead Posted October 8, 2021 Share Posted October 8, 2021 (edited) 3 minutes ago, TomE said: I guess it helps that 99% of the time Farish (and Revolution) get it right so there is less to criticise, except the lack of output, lead times and of course, the price. The problem with Dapol is one minute they are producing models of Class 68 quality, which I still rate as one of the best modern image locos ever produced in N Gauge, and the next they are churning out tat like these. In my case this means that I will never pre-order a Dapol product because you just don't know where it's going to be on the scale of 68 to Pacer. At least with the other manufacturers you can be confident that when it arrives it will be a generally sound model that runs well and looks good out of the box. Tom. To me, the 68 was a joint development with the OO model and had focus, the other items be it the Pacer, the new Mk3 sleepers and even the Maunsell coaches are N only items with protracted development that seem to come to a point where we get Dapol's 'Good enough' rather than a Farish or RevolutioN 'Good enough' Look at the M7, where did they get the idea a loco of that size would be 'good enough' without any DCC readiness built in? Edited October 8, 2021 by woodenhead Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium njee20 Posted October 8, 2021 RMweb Premium Share Posted October 8, 2021 1 hour ago, woodenhead said: is this ongoing ability to make livery errors restricted to N gauge or do they do it across the board? The 68 cited springs to mind, as do the awful decorated samples of the OO gauge 59, but as an N gauge modeller I don’t pay as much attention to the other scales, nor anything pre-1990! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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