Slipshod sellers

[ejstubbs]

This week I've had two duff transactions with eBay sellers.  In the first case I ordered a set of eight ceramic screwdrivers and received seven.  In the second case I ordered two SL-E98 turnouts and received SL-98s (ie insulfrog rather than electrofrog).

 

In the first case the seller has offered me £1 refund as compensation for the missing screwdriver.  I'm inclined to refuse, since it would cost me a fair bit more than that to source the missing one.  In the second case I requested a return+refund and the seller agreed within minutes.

 

AFAICS in both cases the sellers are going to end up out pocket simply because they couldn't be bothered either to list the item correctly, or to send the item that was ordered.  A "not as described" return request cannot be refused as part of the seller's return policy (due to the Consumer Contracts Regulations) and the seller ends up having to pay the return postage cost.  So it's poor commercial practice for them, but what really annoys me is that their carelessness ends up wasting my time.

 

I had another case a few months back where, again, the item was "not as described" (a lens with the wrong mount - not always easy to tell from a not-particularly-great photo).  When I raised the refund request the seller responded that they "didn't know much about these things".  So you rely on some poor unsuspecting buyer to tell you what it is that you're really selling?  Nice...

 

Anyone else despair at the slapdash practices of some eBay sellers?

 

(Footnote: I recall someone on this forum a while back saying that they always blacklist buyers who return items.  IMO sellers who muck their customers around like the examples I've cited above don't deserve to get repeat business anyway.)

[polybear]

1 hour ago, ejstubbs said:

In the first case the seller has offered me £1 refund as compensation for the missing screwdriver.  I'm inclined to refuse, since it would cost me a fair bit more than that to source the missing one.  In the second case I requested a return+refund and the seller agreed within minutes.

 

 

 

I had one a few weeks ago (not model railway related) where the "new unused" item was obviously used; I flagged this up a message to the seller, who promptly refunded me.  I asked about return instructions - I wasn't going to get caught for postage.  He told me not to bother returning it.  :)

[melmerby]

5 minutes ago, polybear said:

 

I had one a few weeks ago (not model railway related) where the "new unused" item was obviously used; I flagged this up a message to the seller, who promptly refunded me.  I asked about return instructions - I wasn't going to get caught for postage.  He told me not to bother returning it. 

I bought a garden watering timer and the one sent was a simple 24Hour on off device, the one I ordered had a seven day timer with several programmes

I contact the seller and they asked if I wanted a refund I said I wanted an exchange for the correct type.

They sent me the correct one and told me to keep the first one!

[hayfield]

48 minutes ago, melmerby said:

I bought a garden watering timer and the one sent was a simple 24Hour on off device, the one I ordered had a seven day timer with several programmes

I contact the seller and they asked if I wanted a refund I said I wanted an exchange for the correct type.

They sent me the correct one and told me to keep the first one!

 

 

Sounds it worked very well in your favour !!

[melmerby]

53 minutes ago, hayfield said:

 

 

Sounds it worked very well in your favour !!

Except it is still in the box it came in!

Maybe I should ebay it for a few quid.

[Mallard60022]

Slapdash indeed. Almost exclusively, my MR transactions have been trouble free and with exceptional service. However some of the descriptions are naff and these days I find it really hard to find anything 'decent' such as kit built stuff. A few years back the eBay railway stuff was well categorised and some great stuff used to appear in the 'Finescale' section; no longer there AFAICS.

[hayfield]

I find with eBay bargains do come and go, bought a couple of locos cheaply as "Pewter" models, clearly a couple of K's kits

[melmerby]

1 hour ago, hayfield said:

I find with eBay bargains do come and go, bought a couple of locos cheaply as "Pewter" models, clearly a couple of K's kits

I think that is the accepted term form composite white metals.

Items in auctions quite often are described as pewter when the exact composition isn't known.

[Guest JiLo]

5 hours ago, Mallard60022 said:

Slapdash indeed. Almost exclusively, my MR transactions have been trouble free and with exceptional service. However some of the descriptions are naff and these days I find it really hard to find anything 'decent' such as kit built stuff. A few years back the eBay railway stuff was well categorised and some great stuff used to appear in the 'Finescale' section; no longer there AFAICS.

Sometimes you get lucky though.  I picked up a Bachmann 158 a while back for around 30 quid, it was just listed as 2 Hornby carriages!    Turned up boxed in the right Bachmann boxes and in pretty good nick!

 

 

[hayfield]

19 hours ago, melmerby said:

Except it is still in the box it came in!

Maybe I should ebay it for a few quid.

 

 

If you can use it, then you have two for one. On the other hand list it and let someone else benefit from the sellers mistake

[hayfield]

15 hours ago, melmerby said:

I think that is the accepted term form composite white metals.

Items in auctions quite often are described as pewter when the exact composition isn't known.

 

I have not heard the use of Pewter in model railway circles that often, as we use the term of "white metal "for low melt metals used in casting model kits, I understand in antique circles the term of "whitemetal" is used for precious metal without hallmarks, still it allowed me to buy some items very reasonably (the models if described correctly are not that valuable normally)

 

Still if everything was described correctly or using the same terminology, there would be far less bargains about  

[Crosland]

17 hours ago, melmerby said:

I think that is the accepted term form composite white metals.

Items in auctions quite often are described as pewter when the exact composition isn't known.

 

 

Yes, but "pewter model" would mean something very different to  most people than "white metal kit built loco". It indicates an ignorant seller and probably a bargain to be had

 

1 hour ago, hayfield said:

 

I understand in antique circles the term of "whitemetal" is used for precious metal without hallmarks,

 

Only for silver, or more precisely items believed to be silver and generally priced as such.

[melmerby]

33 minutes ago, Crosland said:

 

 

Yes, but "pewter model" would mean something very different to  most people than "white metal kit built loco". It indicates an ignorant seller and probably a bargain to be had

 

 

Only for silver, or more precisely items believed to be silver and generally priced as such.

Precisely

A seller not au fait with the toy train market and listing it as would be in a proper auction.

 

Edited August 31, 2019 by melmerby

[PaulRhB]

More importantly pewter doesn’t contain lead and is more expensive, unlike whitemetal which does and can’t be sold in certain countries. 

When I worked making kits 20 odd years ago we used to cast stuff for the UK in whitemetal but it had to be pewter for the US. 

[jonhall]

On 30/08/2019 at 11:40, ejstubbs said:

In the second case I ordered two SL-E98 turnouts and received SL-98s (ie insulfrog rather than electrofrog).

 

 

That's hardly a difficult mistake to make, and I'm sure the supplier didn't intend to make it, because as you say it costs them money, in a life critical environment maybe a second set of eyes would have been used to check its correct, but you haven't paid for that level of inspection, because it isn't necessary, just inconvenient.

 

Jon

[melmerby]

4 hours ago, PaulRhB said:

More importantly pewter doesn’t contain lead and is more expensive, unlike whitemetal which does and can’t be sold in certain countries. 

When I worked making kits 20 odd years ago we used to cast stuff for the UK in whitemetal but it had to be pewter for the US. 

"lead is more common in the lower grades of pewter"

From a definition of pewter.

[PaulRhB]

There’s some grey area over what people define it as as you see but the US imports had to be lead free pewter. What was sold in the trade was basically categorised as pewter if lead free and whitemetal if not. There were various grades within those definitions and we tended to add one bar of pewter to the whitemetal pot too as it helped it flow more consistently. 

[ejstubbs]

On 30/08/2019 at 11:40, ejstubbs said:

I had another case a few months back where, again, the item was "not as described" (a lens with the wrong mount - not always easy to tell from a not-particularly-great photo).

 

Just this morning another example of the same lens popped in to my Inbox (triggered by a subscribed saved search) described as having an M42 mount which clearly (from the photos) isn't.

 

If it's easy for a potential buyer to tell from a rather blurry online photo that the description is wrong, why can't the seller work it out when they've got the thing sat right in front of them?

[Paul H Vigor]

It would appear that some ebay traders are deeply confused by what constitutes a kit-built model railway item? We are shown a 'kit-built' model sat on a RTR Hornby box? And why are such items always described as 'Rare'!? It really gets my capra aegagrus hircus!

[hayfield]

4 hours ago, Paul H Vigor said:

It would appear that some ebay traders are deeply confused by what constitutes a kit-built model railway item? We are shown a 'kit-built' model sat on a RTR Hornby box? And why are such items always described as 'Rare'!? It really gets my capra aegagrus hircus!

 

Some seem to think that by altering something it turns a ready to run model into a kit ? OK some company offer conversion packs for ready to run models and could be said to be a kit of parts, but in my opinion it could never turn a ready to run item into a kit built loco

 

Another unscrupulous retails do is add a premium kit manufacturers name into the description of a lesser manufacturers products title, simply to catch semi related searches. trouble is some may be enticed into buying an inferior product. In some cases the lesser quality item has a higher price than you would expect.   Sadly eBay turn a blind eye to these practises 

[Paul H Vigor]

4 minutes ago, hayfield said:

 

Some seem to think that by altering something it turns a ready to run model into a kit ? OK some company offer conversion packs for ready to run models and could be said to be a kit of parts, but in my opinion it could never turn a ready to run item into a kit built loco

 

Another unscrupulous retails do is add a premium kit manufacturers name into the description of a lesser manufacturers products title, simply to catch semi related searches. trouble is some may be enticed into buying an inferior product. In some cases the lesser quality item has a higher price than you would expect.   Sadly eBay turn a blind eye to these practises 

I suspect they add multiple key words to the item description to ensure maximum exposure on multiple selling threads? And include 'Rare' just to be on the safe side? I'm often astounded re what some sellers consider 'rare'.

[JDW]

When they include "rare" in the description though - does anyone ever search for "rare" I wonder? And what gems might one find if one simply searched the whole of eBay for "rare"?!

[Paul H Vigor]

The awful thing about eBay is: I really don't like it, but I just have to look!

[J. S. Bach]

On 10/05/2020 at 12:37, Paul H Vigor said:

I ...snip... And why are such items always described as 'Rare'!? It really gets my capra aegagrus hircus!

 

On 10/05/2020 at 17:35, JDW said:

When they include "rare" in the description though - does anyone ever search for "rare" I wonder? And what gems might one find if one simply searched the whole of eBay for "rare"?!

 

As of a few minutes ago, there were on ebay:

rare = 5,998,330

antique = 10,804,346

vintage = 27,969,134

and 177,231 items that used all three words in the title.

 

Factor in the description and the totals change, drastically:

rare = 35,651,167

antique = 18,244,565

vintage = 44,798.563

and 1,004,3921 items that used all three words in the title and description,

 

 

Edited May 13, 2020 by J. S. Bach

[hayfield]

9 hours ago, Paul H Vigor said:

The awful thing about eBay is: I really don't like it, but I just have to look!

 

Paul

 

The more potential buyers who don't like eBay is all the better for those of us who do like it. I do find some sellers irritating, even dishonest in some cases but I just steer clear of them. Its much the same as going to a local general auction. There is a lot of tat that is really bin fodder, and a lot of good stuff at premium prices. But there still are a few Gems to be found

 

6 hours ago, J. S. Bach said:

 

 

As of a few minutes ago, there were on ebay:

 

rare = 5,998,330

antique = 10,804,346

vintage = 27,969,134

and 177,231 items that used all three words in the title.

 

Factor in the description and the totals change, drastically:

rare = 35,651,167

antique = 18,244,565

vintage = 44,798.563

and 1,004,3921 items that used all three words in the title and description,

 

 

 

JS

 

You soon get trained to skim over most lots as your eyes seem to naturally filter out unwanted items and focus on more interesting things, which usually in turn lead to even better things. The odd hour which some may say as wasted browsing through targeted lots often finds interesting items with potential, just depends if others see the same potential.