Late GWR nnon corridor C83 / D132

[MJI]

Worked out I require a few of the above.

 

2  and 1 BT minimum.

 

Are there any kits available of this type in 4mm?

[gwrrob]

Bill Bedford ( Mousa Models) used to do the sides for the C83 I think. Not listed on his website now I'm afraid.

Edited October 4, 2020 by gwrrob
info.

[chrisf]

IIRC Bill does the sides for the C83.

 

Chris

[MJI]

Ok thanks. Just need to find a roof profile. And work out ends.

 

Other vehicles I need are covered by Airfix B set and Mark 1 long non corridors.

[Mike G]

I would not use the Comet roof. This is an LNER design. A better match - but still not 100% accurate - is from MJT. Part number 2970.  You may have to etch the ends yourself. I can send you the top line roof profile as I used it on my B set. Drop me a PM if you need this. I just hope this system supports DWF files.

 

regards

 

Mike

[MJI]

9 hours ago, chrisf said:

IIRC Bill does the sides for the C83.

 

Chris

 

I bought both sets

[MJI]

3 hours ago, Mike G said:

I would not use the Comet roof. This is an LNER design. A better match - but still not 100% accurate - is from MJT. Part number 2970.  You may have to etch the ends yourself. I can send you the top line roof profile as I used it on my B set. Drop me a PM if you need this. I just hope this system supports DWF files.

 

regards

 

Mike

 

I will probably cut a plastic card former and mark around it.

 

If I can build a Worsley works DMU I can do these

[MJI]

On 04/10/2020 at 19:21, Mike G said:

I would not use the Comet roof. This is an LNER design. A better match - but still not 100% accurate - is from MJT. Part number 2970.  You may have to etch the ends yourself. I can send you the top line roof profile as I used it on my B set. Drop me a PM if you need this. I just hope this system supports DWF files.

 

regards

 

Mike

 

I have the DWG thanks, who are good etchers to use for a small batch (6)?

 

For a laugh I imported them into our software. But the cutting machines our customers use are designed for much bigger things and material.

[Mike G]

23 hours ago, MJI said:

 

I have the DWG thanks, who are good etchers to use for a small batch (6)?

 

For a laugh I imported them into our software. But the cutting machines our customers use are designed for much bigger things and material.

I used PPD. But they have a minimum size sheet. It's worth giving them a ring, they are really helpful. The other option is printing it out, gluing down and carefully scribe - just a thought.

 

Mike

[MJI]

Haha I think I will try a scribe and cut, just need to buy some thin brass.

 

Why did my insistance on accurate trains have to go to my fun small layout?

 

I am the person who makes sure their BR Mark 1 vacuum cylinders are the right way round.

 

But then I will probably be the only person with accurate stock for 1960 and 1980 Western Region.

 

Luckily I like making my own stuff, RTR will never do everything.

 

Hence my converted and semi scratch collection of WR DMUs. My Airfix air conditioned coaches converted to accurate W vehicles.

 

[Mike G]

4 hours ago, MJI said:

Haha I think I will try a scribe and cut, just need to buy some thin brass.

 

Why did my insistance on accurate trains have to go to my fun small layout?

 

I am the person who makes sure their BR Mark 1 vacuum cylinders are the right way round.

 

But then I will probably be the only person with accurate stock for 1960 and 1980 Western Region.

 

Luckily I like making my own stuff, RTR will never do everything.

 

Hence my converted and semi scratch collection of WR DMUs. My Airfix air conditioned coaches converted to accurate W vehicles.

 

Then you have the same modelling ethos as me. If it's there, it goes on. Which is why I came up with the etch...

 

Good luck

 

Mike

[MJI]

I now know most of parts to get, MJT roof, Comet floor, underframe and end castings, will check my pictures for roof vents (got a good mix).

 

Will also relay on piccies to see what the hnges are like, pretty sure there is a picture in the 1890 on book.

 

Just need to decide on bogies. Comet or MJT, anyone have experience in them both?

 

Will be 00 likely code 75.

[Mike G]

Can't comment on either I use Bill Bedford sprung bogies for all my coaches. I have heard that the twin torsion MJT bogies are good.

As for the cosmetic sides MJT all the way, excellent castings. The only problem is (as with all castings) they make the bogie an unprototypical width. But untill something better comes along I'll live with that.

 

Mike

[MJI]

Got MJT frames and sides on order, roofs as well, I am happy with the rigid frames my 119 DMU uses them for the unmotored bogies.

 

Roofs as well.

 

Decided they well be cleanish maroon as well as the B set.

 

Spent an hour exmining photos on line and then realised I had a west country branches in colour book.

 

55 Red late 50s mixed, 60 75% maroon, 62 if tatty red, if shiny maroon.

 

On and the 45xx are green, I THINK I can get away wtih removing GWR and adding lining. May not even require renumbering.

 

May have wrong front end version of D63xx

[Mike G]

If your going to do a B set, look here for details ;

 

http://www.gwr.org.uk/b-set-notes.html

 

Stay safe

 

Mike

[MJI]

2 hours ago, Mike G said:

If your going to do a B set, look here for details ;

 

http://www.gwr.org.uk/b-set-notes.html

 

Stay safe

 

Mike

 

That is where I got the numbers from!

[Hal Nail]

13 hours ago, MJI said:

55 Red late 50s mixed, 60 75% maroon, 62 if tatty red, if shiny maroon.

 

On and the 45xx are green, I THINK I can get away wtih removing GWR and adding lining. May not even require renumbering.

Also Maroon, as opposed to carmine/crimson (red), was unlined initially and then lined later 

 

I dont think you've said which branch you are referring to but a few 4575s stayed in black to the end. Then there is the choice of BR logo - St Blazey certainly had a few lined early enough to have the lion and wheel, others went straight to totem.

 

I'm not sure how common c83s were. A few photos around of one on the Looe branch but certainly not as widespread as the E140/145 brake composites or even the similar brake 3rds.

[chrisf]

1 hour ago, Hal Nail said:

I'm not sure how common c83s were. A few photos around of one on the Looe branch but certainly not as widespread as the E140/145 brake composites or even the similar brake 3rds.

 

Most of them went new to London or Birmingham and sprinkled around the WR as older stock was withdrawn.  I would have been surprised to find one on the Looe branch given that it was restricted to shorter vehicles until something was done to permit the use of DMUs.

 

Chris    

[Hal Nail]

4 hours ago, chrisf said:

 

Most of them went new to London or Birmingham and sprinkled around the WR as older stock was withdrawn.  I would have been surprised to find one on the Looe branch given that it was restricted to shorter vehicles until something was done to permit the use of DMUs.

 

Chris    

I may well be remembering diagrams wrong - will check again later 

 

Edit: I was thinking of c61/63 collett types whereas i now realise c83 is the later equivalent 

Edited October 11, 2020 by Hal Nail

[MJI]

5 hours ago, Hal Nail said:

Also Maroon, as opposed to carmine/crimson (red), was unlined initially and then lined later 

 

I dont think you've said which branch you are referring to but a few 4575s stayed in black to the end. Then there is the choice of BR logo - St Blazey certainly had a few lined early enough to have the lion and wheel, others went straight to totem.

 

I'm not sure how common c83s were. A few photos around of one on the Looe branch but certainly not as widespread as the E140/145 brake composites or even the similar brake 3rds.

 

Looking at the more western branches. Falmouth and west. Have noted.

 

B sets of Airfix. Airfix with 9ft bogies. Ones same as the GWR web site article. Very late GWR non corridor stock. BR Mark 1 non corridor. And the occasional Sunshine carriage.

 

Also noted 45xx as most common steam loco and 22 as most common Diesel. BRCW 118 as usual DMU from build to withdrawal.

Edited October 11, 2020 by MJI

[MJI]

Looe branch was 7ft bogie restricted. They did have longer stock on them. My last trip was in W59520. Which everyone should know.

Edited October 11, 2020 by MJI

[MJI]

Careful studying of photos while referring to various books.

 

GWR profile is obvious. Counting doors. I can spot a Mark 1 miles off.

[Hal Nail]

27 minutes ago, MJI said:

B sets of Airfix. Airfix with 9ft bogies.

E140 and 145 respectively. The later E147s also common down that way.

 

The Looe branch had an all third in the same family as "Airfix" B sets with 7ft bogies, which is what I was referring to. I've been toying with a cut and shut in 7mm from the Lionheart stock.

 

A few corridor bow ended all thirds got used as supplementary coaches as well.

[MJI]

I have two E140 being worked on. A wreck of one which will become a E145. I have seen the Comet based E147 article.

 

I worked out all the suitable non corridors by referring to books by Harris and Parkin. I have a huge collection of books about carriages as I used to collect and maintain details of preserved stock.

 

Seen quite a few B sets strengthened by a T so far seen C83 and Mark 1 all long versions. Another set was 6 late non corridors, all long ex GWR. Sets of 2 to 4 non ccorridors seems quite common when not a B set.

 

I am looking at Falmouth Helston St Ives trains.

[MJI]

37 minutes ago, Hal Nail said:

E140 and 145 respectively. The later E147s also common down that way.

 

The Looe branch had an all third in the same family as "Airfix" B sets with 7ft bogies, which is what I was referring to. I've been toying with a cut and shut in 7mm from the Lionheart stock.

 

A few corridor bow ended all thirds got used as supplementary coaches as well.

 

I was expecting to find lots of photos of 57 ft and similar length stock, but no not further west.

 

I am really enjoying the research, makes a change from scouring through old spotting notes to get the formation of a particular train.

 

Talking aout carriages, I only ever once travelled behind a Deltic in BR times, the coach I travelled in became an engineers vehicle near where I lived.