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My almost correct chop shop, coaches, not even BR


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6 hours ago, Gibbo675 said:

Hi Folks,

 

I actually manged to make a pair of class 142's into something slightly less useful !!!

 

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It has since been glazed, but not yet numbered.

 

Gibbo.

 

There was a serious idea by BR to reborn MK1 under frames with this body. But the slagging off BR got in the press (BR reintroduce third class etc) it never went any further. 

 

Third class, if they could see the new DFT ordered trains with sardine ironing board seating.

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Quick update, as the pots are waiting.

 

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Here is the TS sat on a replica underframe with the trussing cut off.

 

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The bogies are MJT 8`6" etch bogie frames, assembled with gorrila glue as I can`t use a soldering iron for crap. They have DC kits side frames glued on, as I must be doing something wrong as I have never been able to get the DC kits DMU bogies to run freely. The wheels are Bachmann 36-034 as they are 12mm disc (no holes) so perfect for DMUs. I have taken the centre bolster section from the replica bogie kit, cut it to size, and glued it to the bogie mounting of the MJT etch. This give me the correct ride height and allows me to retain the replica clip fit system.

 

PS-Gibbo, what am I doing wrong with the DC kits bogies?

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1 hour ago, cheesysmith said:

PS-Gibbo, what am I doing wrong with the DC kits bogies?

Hi Chessy

 

Are you sure the question isn't "What am I doing with DC kits bogies?"

 

From my past experience they are like Kirk bogies, one good one will not do a whole train. It is a competition between the mouldings and my hamfistedness who can make the most wonky bogie.

 

I would keep making the bogies as you are doing if the work fine for you.

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The bogie question is because I have made over 12 EMU gresley bogies, and these have no problems and are free running. Just interested in where am I going wrong?

 

I did remember reading somewhere that the DC kits DMU bogies were designed around non top hat bearings and shorter, not 26mm axles, can anyone confirm this as right or wrong.

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12 hours ago, Clive Mortimore said:

No what ever next? 

 

People would be making oddballs like this diagram rebuilt diagram 275 buffet no E9195E. :scratchhead:

 

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I also attack LMS coaches

This will be M105M again a sole example. The real one started life as a RKS but was rebuilt by BR into a buffet.

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BR coaches don't get away either.

One of three BR dia 30 Griddle cars

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Isn't modelling fun?

 

 

 

That’s a very intricate livery on the Griddle car.

 

Makes me glad I do pre-group - the liveries are easier...

 

Duncan

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Answering my own question. This is a photo of a Bachmann 36-034 next to a wheel bought from charlie as a complete kit more years ago than i want to think about.

 

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Sorry it a bit blurry, but you can see the shorter axles charlie provided in his kits.

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Quick tips for anybody wanting to use these MJT rigid bogie frames. This is what it looks like removed from the fret, note the enlarged holes for the bearings, as we will be using 12mm wheels we need the lower of the two holes.

 

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Fold the centre pivot piece up first, as it is easier to thread the wire before folding up the sides.

 

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The bearings should pop into place, if not, two or three turns with a files will open it enough.

 

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Open the bearing holes in the side frames you will be attaching, here i used a 3mm drill bit.

 

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Glue the side frames on, here using gorilla glue, and a set of handy G clamps, again from wilkos.

 

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And this is what you get, just add wheels. Word of warning, you may think you work bench is flat, these will find out for you.

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I did say I would be showing the bad as well as the good, well he is some bad.

 

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i had already made a 116, but whilst working through this build, I noticed I had forgot a window in the brake van. So tried drilling and cutting a new window. Disaster, I forgot this was where there was already a join between body sections, and the result above says everything.

 

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So, out with the dremel, and a section from those off cuts I said not to throw away, and one repaired 116 with the missing window added (I did this both sides to save messing about).

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8 hours ago, cheesysmith said:

PS-Gibbo, what am I doing wrong with the DC kits bogies?

Hi Dave,

 

I'm not sure although I've only have trouble with the ones that are moulded from grey plastic as that seemed pretty resistant to all of the glues and solvents I could find to apply. The ones moulded from black plastic seem to go together well enough after a liberal coating of EMA Plastic Weld.

I would first apply to both surfaces to be bonded hold together tightly while applying more around the joint, a slight wiggle with plenty of pressure seems to get the plastic to form a secure joint.

 

Gibbo.

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Yes Charley used to supply wheels with the correct axle length to fit Lima bogies (ie shorter than "normal" ones)

 

Try using Butanone on the grey plastic bits (including the shiny dmu sides). It doesn't set as quick as plastic weld but it does a better job of holding the parts together.

 

Baz

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Some relevant and useful tips here, as I've recently landed an unmade DCK SR 2H kit (the Bachmann RTR model being way outside my budget). I've also just obtained a new bottle of EMA Plastic Weld, which I usually swear by, but in fairness the DCK instructions do recommend Butanone above all else so it sounds like I should take that seriously........whenever I get around to building it.

 

Cheesysmith, your 116 experience reminds me of finishing off my Lima 118 3-car set, back in 1998 I think, I had it all assembled and painted but when it came to applying the Replica rub-down numbers completely forgot that, due to reusing the Lima glazing (temporarily - it's still there!) I had only 'butt-welded' in the DMS's extra window sections, pressed too hard and..........aarrgghh! Should have left the chassis in! Luckily I was able to very carefully re-glue it from the inside without any evidence on the outside. BTW, imaginative use of Replica suburban coach bodies, I'm sure Godfrey Hayes (whom I've known for a very long time, until I moved away from Swindon early last year) would be intrigued at such use of his products!

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5 hours ago, crompton 33 said:

EMA Plastic weld will not work on DC kits. The best glue i found to use was evo stick plastic Pipe weld.

 

I think I understand how that would work on such difficult plastic (although I'm still rather puzzled as to why Charlie chose to use material with the same properties as plastic pipes, did it need to be that tough for a model? - Perhaps it was to avoid fragility around the recessed window openings.....)

 

3 hours ago, cheesysmith said:

I got a big bottle of MEK off evilbay. Works well enough for me on any DC kits bits. Also cheaper than buying those little bottles of plastic weld and such.

 

Interesting, I wouldn't have expected that - MEK (I think it was actually Slater's MekPak?) was the first liquid cement I used in the early 1970s but I always thought it was intended only for polystyrene and plasticard. When I couldn't get that I used whatever brand I could find, then one day bought a Parkside kit with parts (door bangers I think) made from ABS plastic, for which EMA Plastic Weld was recommended. I usually picked up new bottles of PW at shows for around £3, but 'under present circumstances' checked Amazon (as one does) but it was a whopping £8.95 on there so I added it to a Lendon's order for £3.45.

 

BTW the 2H kit came without interiors so I ordered some Bachmann Class 205 interiors from ekmexhibitions for £12.50 the pair. Will they fit? Not the end of the world if they don't, but armed with a fistful of files I am optimistic......!

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As for the plastic used in the kits, the story is he chose the plastic because it allowed the thinner sides around the windows so making the adding a strip of plastic behind as close to flush as possible . Something to do with the strength to thickness ratio. 

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Just a quick post whilst I wait for the first cycle of prime and rub to dry. These are some of the tools I use. Big bottle of MEK i got of evilbay, the rubbing block and clamps came from wilkos, and the file sticks are nail file boards from asda. There is also the rechargeable dremel knock off from aldi, plus various knives and files.

 

The clamps are one thing i suggest everyone who does cutting and shuts goes out and get, they have been so useful to me. 

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1k views, and I only started this on Sunday, wow, I'm flattered people are interested. The rub`n`fill cycle are about half way through, so at this rate will have them done by the weekend.

 

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Sorry for the poor photo, but one cannot have just one project on the go at once. Here is the 115, next to the repaired 116 DMBS, next to my 131, next to my 114 make out of cutting two of charlies 108 body kits together. And there is another different bog cart waiting for me to glue together, pics will follow later, hopefully after the 115 bodies are done.

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3 hours ago, cheesysmith said:

 

one cannot have just one project on the go at once.

 

 

One project at a time appeals to my sense of order, but in practice to maintain decent overall progress one needs Project 2 on standby to get on with while glue and/or paint on Project 1 is setting/drying.

Or, Project 1 is driving one up the wall so swapping to Project 2 avoids a meltdown! :banghead:

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On 04/04/2021 at 14:18, cheesysmith said:

Lets start with the easiest coaches, the trailer centre cars.

 

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This is a replica suburban coach laid against the drawing for the TCL. Notice the doors line up, but beware.

 

 

Is this the right drawing? I thought that all class 115 stock was non-corridor.

 

Great project: these were the trains of my youth, growing up in High Wycombe in the 70s. I suppose that I must have seen Allerton units after I moved to Liverpool in 1982, but I was more interested in the 304s and locomotives!

 

Jim

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Checked the drawing, and it is labeled as Derby (at pancras and Marylebone) press steel  and BRCW TCL. This is a example of why to check. The windows are right for the 117 & 118 but not for the 115 and 127. As for the gangways, most had gangways added in later life, the 127 trailers for use in other sets when transferred to Birmingham. The adding of gangways was a conversion of the suburban DMUs in later life. Not all got done (125 went to scrap without) and some classes only part got done (115 and 116 for example). 

 

As I said at the begining this book has errors, but is a good starting point. But as in every reference used always check against photos.

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Stupid tablet spell checker
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Also, a good reason to start with replica coaches for these conversions is because the suburban MU which were built without gangways had flat intermediate ends but those built with gangways had the 3 piece rhombic shaped ends. This goes for electric and diesel version.

 

A second reason is it avoids having to put all those hinges and handles/handrail on, with careful cutting you can keep the original moulded detail. A 115 has 66 passenger doors, adding wire handrails and handles/hinges would drive me nuts.

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On 06/04/2021 at 11:32, Clive Mortimore said:

Hi Chessy

 

Are you sure the question isn't "What am I doing with DC kits bogies?"

 

From my past experience they are like Kirk bogies, one good one will not do a whole train. It is a competition between the mouldings and my hamfistedness who can make the most wonky bogie.

 

I would keep making the bogies as you are doing if the work fine for you.

The Cunning Plan to use up spare MJT etches on DC Kits DMUs  (when I actually build the kits in the cupboard ) has just been validated....

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On 06/04/2021 at 21:42, cheesysmith said:

I got a big bottle of MEK off evilbay. Works well enough for me on any DC kits bits. Also cheaper than buying those little bottles of plastic weld and such.

Wizard models will sell you a decent size bottle of Butanone for around £3 if not a bit less.

 

This also works a treat on the DC kits plastic.

 

John.

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3 hours ago, cheesysmith said:

Also, a good reason to start with replica coaches for these conversions is because the suburban MU which were built without gangways had flat intermediate ends but those built with gangways had the 3 piece rhombic shaped ends. This goes for electric and diesel version.

 

A second reason is it avoids having to put all those hinges and handles/handrail on, with careful cutting you can keep the original moulded detail. A 115 has 66 passenger doors, adding wire handrails and handles/hinges would drive me nuts.

Actually, doing one coach is bad enough, the vertical handrails were still to add after painting.

 

 

IMG_1163 copyweb2.jpg

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