RMweb Premium newbryford Posted November 3, 2018 RMweb Premium Share Posted November 3, 2018 I’m in the process of ordering a sound decoder (I’m not on pocket money anymore!!), then I can finish off the loco and *maybe* have it done for Blackburn expo in a couple of weeks, if Mr NB lets me play with it..... A partner to '417... Has it got Kadee's fitted? Don't forget the MXAs...... Cheers, Mick Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jack374 Posted November 6, 2018 Author Share Posted November 6, 2018 Indeed it can be a partner to yours...a very colourful combo! It hasn’t got Kadees so can you bring a couple pleeeeeeease. And yeah, the MXAs are ready to go. I’ve been busy this weekend and the last few days trying to get it ready. The rods have been painted by spraying primer then white then yellow; the last colour was literally the last paint in the can! I’ve also added a 4 pin plug to connect the pick up wires and motor terminals with the decoder, which is mounted in the top of the bodyshell. When I got the decoder (speedy service courtesy of Legomanbiffo/Charlie at DC Kits) I fired up JMRI DecoderPro and set about customising the chip, by rearranging the sounds and also by making the first two function outputs independent, as these are always directional but for the 08 I’ve made them separate. This means that one end can be wired to one FO and end no.2 to the other, leaving 2 spare FOs, one of which I’ve wired the cab light into. Therefore I can use the 8 pin socket and not need the purple FO4 wire, whilst having independent control of each end and cab lights. The speaker is the supplied 'sugarcube' in the enclosure, which sounds very bassy for such a small speaker! Other touches have included finishing drilling the brass rod for the buffers and mounting this in the original buffer housings, then painting these and other small details and weathering the rods. Attached are the current progress photos. All that is left is reassembly. Of note is that some lead was added to replace the weight lost by removal of the old motor, and the two flying leads are for a DCC Concepts 'super stay alive', which was ordered after I found their standard stay alives aren’t up to the job for an 08. Funnily enough they’ve run out of their own SSA and the ESU Powerpack, so I turned to eBay for the former as the latter seems akin to rocking horse sh1te currently! It’s full throttle now to get this finished for Friday! Keep modelling! Jack. 6 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
bradfordbuffer Posted November 8, 2018 Share Posted November 8, 2018 Indeed it can be a partner to yours...a very colourful combo! It hasn’t got Kadees so can you bring a couple pleeeeeeease. And yeah, the MXAs are ready to go. I’ve been busy this weekend and the last few days trying to get it ready. The rods have been painted by spraying primer then white then yellow; the last colour was literally the last paint in the can! I’ve also added a 4 pin plug to connect the pick up wires and motor terminals with the decoder, which is mounted in the top of the bodyshell. When I got the decoder (speedy service courtesy of Legomanbiffo/Charlie at DC Kits) I fired up JMRI DecoderPro and set about customising the chip, by rearranging the sounds and also by making the first two function outputs independent, as these are always directional but for the 08 I’ve made them separate. This means that one end can be wired to one FO and end no.2 to the other, leaving 2 spare FOs, one of which I’ve wired the cab light into. Therefore I can use the 8 pin socket and not need the purple FO4 wire, whilst having independent control of each end and cab lights. The speaker is the supplied 'sugarcube' in the enclosure, which sounds very bassy for such a small speaker! Other touches have included finishing drilling the brass rod for the buffers and mounting this in the original buffer housings, then painting these and other small details and weathering the rods. Attached are the current progress photos. All that is left is reassembly. Of note is that some lead was added to replace the weight lost by removal of the old motor, and the two flying leads are for a DCC Concepts 'super stay alive', which was ordered after I found their standard stay alives aren’t up to the job for an 08. Funnily enough they’ve run out of their own SSA and the ESU Powerpack, so I turned to eBay for the former as the latter seems akin to rocking horse sh1te currently! 6128E167-268A-4CE8-AC69-A5742B86E03A.jpeg 5028696B-334C-4396-A2E4-61CA3B9FA1E0.jpeg 6940B8FA-A08A-407A-BB83-DB50E19D3336.jpeg 31C9058B-C6D2-477B-BBFF-3E541647315D.jpeg It’s full throttle now to get this finished for Friday! Keep modelling! Jack. Top work jack...make sure you finish the o8 as you can't have too many fronts. G Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
bradfordbuffer Posted November 8, 2018 Share Posted November 8, 2018 Top work jack...make sure you finish the o8 as you can't have too many fronts. GSome times I like spell checker sometimes it's a pain in a#@s....fronts should read gronks!(railway slang for class 08 not type of letters).G Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jack374 Posted November 9, 2018 Author Share Posted November 9, 2018 Top work jack...make sure you finish the o8 as you can't have too many fronts. G Cheers G...I knew what you meant haha. See you tomorrow. Well at the 11th hour last night, I finished the 08. Thankfully the DCC Concepts 'super stay alive' arrived yesterday (it was estimated today or Saturday), so this was soldered on and then everything was squeezed into the bodyshell. The stay alive is next to the roof, with the speaker protruding slightly out of the front opening and the decoder sat diagonally behind; this was the only way everything would fit in. The motor sounded rough upon tests earlier this week but the smoothing properties of the stay alive mean it now runs sweetly. Needless to say it’s an excellent motor for its size! After reassembling everything by assembling and adding the buffers, when I first tested it the lights didn’t work. Body off again, and the cause was the blue +ve common wire has become detached from the decoder when I soldered on the stay alive. Simple fix and everything works fine now: And shots showing the weathered rods, details picked out and new buffers. Also I’ve added a plasticard bar to connect the front steps as per the prototype, which doesn’t foul the coupling... I’m glad it’s done! Come along to see it on Mick's 'Deadmans Lane' layout at Blackburn Exhibition if you can, it’d be nice to put some faces to RMweb names. No doubt I’ll post some photos of it from the weekend on this thread. Happy modelling! Jack. 10 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jack374 Posted November 11, 2018 Author Share Posted November 11, 2018 The loco performed faultlessly all weekend whilst it was running on Mick's 'Deadmans Lane'...the only slight issue is that the sound is rather quiet but I can have a look at this in due course. Here are a few piccies: A huge thanks to Mick and team for having me (and the loco). It was nice to meet up with some fellow modellers on the forum, some of whom follow my workbench wanderings...many thanks! Now then...which loco will be next to cross the workbench?.... Thanks, Jack. 12 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium newbryford Posted November 11, 2018 RMweb Premium Share Posted November 11, 2018 08417 enjoyed the company of another gronk for the weekend on DL I really must get on with my 08762. Cheers, MIck 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jack374 Posted December 3, 2018 Author Share Posted December 3, 2018 Long time, no updates! I’ve been doing a few bits as and when, however today I did this at work.... Done on a milling machine as I’d completed all my tasks on the welding section (which we’re on this week). It’s a Bachmann class 20 chassis, and for anyone unfamiliar, what was there originally was symmetrical to the remaining 'column', which houses the bogie-mounted gear towers. This is so a decent speaker can be added, and it will become DRS 20303 in the old DRS scheme...the last remaining 20 to wear it (up to 2013 ish). Also currently at the workshop is another chassis, the entrails for which are pictured below (smaller motor and red/black wires and 8 pin socket are so I could plug it into my Powercab and play about with the functions on JMRI DecoderPro...more on this later) : There will also be a secondary function decoder to power more lights...the speakers are from Richard of Roads and Rails. The sound chip arrived this week from Charlie at DC Kits (with Legomanbiffo sounds), but which class is it from?? Answers on a fiver to postcode DE...... Keep modelling! Jack. 6 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
bradfordbuffer Posted December 4, 2018 Share Posted December 4, 2018 Long time, no updates! I’ve been doing a few bits as and when, however today I did this at work.... BA107D62-1806-4A0B-A1C0-DDA39CC3DD9A.jpeg DE703BAB-423B-4E15-A206-6D81470FD236.jpeg Done on a milling machine as I’d completed all my tasks on the welding section (which we’re on this week). It’s a Bachmann class 20 chassis, and for anyone unfamiliar, what was there originally was symmetrical to the remaining 'column', which houses the bogie-mounted gear towers. This is so a decent speaker can be added, and it will become DRS 20303 in the old DRS scheme...the last remaining 20 to wear it (up to 2013 ish). Also currently at the workshop is another chassis, the entrails for which are pictured below (smaller motor and red/black wires and 8 pin socket are so I could plug it into my Powercab and play about with the functions on JMRI DecoderPro...more on this later) : 3D19830C-29A5-42D4-97AC-58C82C9ABDB7.jpeg There will also be a secondary function decoder to power more lights...the speakers are from Richard of Roads and Rails. The sound chip arrived this week from Charlie at DC Kits (with Legomanbiffo sounds), but which class is it from?? Answers on a fiver to postcode DE...... Keep modelling! Jack. should full postcode be! DE656BN? (I do hope that's not the same as service providers premises near Derby station) Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jack374 Posted December 4, 2018 Author Share Posted December 4, 2018 should full postcode be! DE656BN? (I do hope that's not the same as service providers premises near Derby station) Close enough....I ask you in advance now if you’re in the area so I can get the Vs ready...... Jack. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium newbryford Posted December 4, 2018 RMweb Premium Share Posted December 4, 2018 Close enough....I ask you in advance now if you’re in the area so I can get the Vs ready...... Jack. V is for Voyager? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
bradfordbuffer Posted December 5, 2018 Share Posted December 5, 2018 Close enough....I ask you in advance now if you’re in the area so I can get the Vs ready...... Jack. You may salute! On Friday afternoon at aforementioned postcode....pm to follow on day! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jack374 Posted December 6, 2018 Author Share Posted December 6, 2018 You may salute! On Friday afternoon at aforementioned postcode....pm to follow on day!I might see you then in that case! So, as no one guessed, the sound, speakers and milled chassis are for my 68. Most of the meat has been removed from around the bogie towers, with only the motor surround remaining (and top of this flattened as I’m not reusing the circuit board). Also the unnecessary lump behind the lights has been milled down to a flat 'ledge' to allow some new lights to be added yet the bufferbeams to be refitted. Finally, two holes have been added to allow the sound from the speakers to escape. I see daylight! I’ll crack on with this...I’m really looking forward to seeing what it sounds and looks like at the end. Keep modelling! Jack. 5 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jack374 Posted December 6, 2018 Author Share Posted December 6, 2018 Another quick update on this evening's progress...I’ve finished changing the mapping of both the LokSound V4 and Zimo MX685 function decoder, to create this set up: ZD being Zimo function, SD being Loksound decoder. This way I have each light 'set' (either pair or individual) on its own function output, so any lighting combination is possible if programmed in. Currently if you only press F0 the No.1 end lights come on directionally, which suits exhibition roundy roundies, yet all the lighting options are possible if you’re shunting etc. I’ve shifted (what I’d deem to be) the useless sounds up the F key list or removed them completely, whilst the lighting for the No.2 end has the same F keys as No.1 but with 10 added. Of note is that there is both 'drive hold' (engage and the motor speed 'freezes' so you can throttle the sound, release and the motor will accel/decel to speed) and conventional notching of the sounds is possible. The latter is present on all decoders I’ve encountered and can be assigned to F keys to be used, if it hasn’t been assigned already (like this project due to the presence of 'drive hold'). The Zimo decoder only allows up to F12 to be used, hence why the FOs for parking lights are split across both decoders...originally I had the Loksound for the head/tail lights at each end and Zimo for the rest before I found this minor glitch. Below is the function mapping now I've changed it about...the selection of a row to move it up/down allows a neat table to be made (click to make clearer): And an infinitely simpler one for the Zimo decoder: Now I’ve just got to wire it all up! Jack. 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Departmental203 Posted December 7, 2018 Share Posted December 7, 2018 (edited) Very ambitious project Jack, the CV's (not work ones!!) look complex and hacking at the chassis block...! (Not something I'd do!!) Will you put a "baffle plate" for the Class 68? Good luck with this one and as always, excellent work Jules Edited December 7, 2018 by Departmental203 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jack374 Posted December 7, 2018 Author Share Posted December 7, 2018 Will you put a "baffle plate" for the Class 68? Good luck with this one and as always, excellent work Thanks very much Jules! It is ambitious but then again it's what I want, and as my modelling preference doesn’t change, I can afford to spend time making it as I want it. Not sure what you mean about a baffle plate...the speakers come pre-assembled and sound excellent to me. I’ll be mounting one 'upright' (sound upwards) below the roof fans and the other facing down so the sound can escape as fully as possible. The current plan is to just mount them to the bodyshell roof. I aim to have all the wiring on the roof with only the track feeds and motor connected by a 4 pin plug, to avoid excessive connections. Thanks, Jack. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Departmental203 Posted December 9, 2018 Share Posted December 9, 2018 Sorry about that Jack What I meant by a baffle plate is on the Hornby Class 60, there is a plastic moulding behind the grill being a representation of the components inside the loco. And I was used to calling it a baffle plate! There is a component behind the grille in this photo, I meant to ask, will you build a representation of it? Keep at it! Jules Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jack374 Posted December 9, 2018 Author Share Posted December 9, 2018 What I meant by a baffle plate is on the Hornby Class 60, there is a plastic moulding behind the grill being a representation of the components inside the loco. I meant to ask, will you build a representation of it?Ahhh I see, no worries, I just didn’t know what you meant! Funnily enough I found a good photo showing a 68 with an engine room light on, and you can see everything behind the grille. Dapol made some poor plastic inserts but they’re not representative of the real thing, so I may look into it. The problem is, there is minimal space either side so it would have to be super low-relief. I’ll have a ponder... Here’s a photo showing behind the grille that I took at Preston when a ScotRail one came south... Thanks, Jack. 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steadfast Posted December 9, 2018 Share Posted December 9, 2018 What about printing an image as a decal or on photo paper? It'll fit in a reduced width gap, and behind the mesh, so long as the image has some texture and the light and shade work right, no one will ever know. Jo 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium newbryford Posted December 9, 2018 RMweb Premium Share Posted December 9, 2018 What about printing an image as a decal or on photo paper? It'll fit in a reduced width gap, and behind the mesh, so long as the image has some texture and the light and shade work right, no one will ever know. Jo We will...... (Says he who mostly detests printed grilles but actually made one for himself.................) Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steadfast Posted December 9, 2018 Share Posted December 9, 2018 If it looks right... ;-p Jo Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium JDW Posted December 10, 2018 RMweb Premium Share Posted December 10, 2018 Ahhh I see, no worries, I just didn’t know what you meant! Funnily enough I found a good photo showing a 68 with an engine room light on, and you can see everything behind the grille. Dapol made some poor plastic inserts but they’re not representative of the real thing, so I may look into it. The problem is, there is minimal space either side so it would have to be super low-relief. I’ll have a ponder... Here’s a photo showing behind the grille that I took at Preston when a ScotRail one came south... ACE1F943-73A6-485A-AAB0-7A3C915FAE67.jpeg Thanks, Jack. Is that one of the new tri-mode ones, it appears to have a third rail pick up shoe attached to the bogie...! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jack374 Posted December 10, 2018 Author Share Posted December 10, 2018 What about printing an image as a decal or on photo paper? It'll fit in a reduced width gap, and behind the mesh, so long as the image has some texture and the light and shade work right, no one will ever know. Jo Good idea Jo, many thanks. I’ll probably do it in plasticard for some extra relief, or I could be REALLY lazy and just paint it on the speaker enclosure...I’ll have a think... Is that one of the new tri-mode ones, it appears to have a third rail pick up shoe attached to the bogie...! Haha I hadn’t thought of that JDW...they’re getting some tri-mode 93s so anything is possible! We will...... (Says he who mostly detests printed grilles but actually made one for himself.................) Hypocrite! And no one would know because I’ve decided not to fit an engine light.... Jack. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jack374 Posted December 14, 2018 Author Share Posted December 14, 2018 So then...a breakthrough. Since milling the chassis last week, I’ve been beaverig away to try and find a solution to the 'halo' issue. I deem it an issue because I’ve not yet seen a model with what I’d say were "acceptable" halos as well as non-bleeding main lights. Various things were tried, some with success and others yielding no success at all! A restock mid-week on 0603 SMDs from eBay and tonight I’ve cracked it. Using the aforementioned LEDs and also some 1K5 SMRs (resistors), I’ve put 4 in a square format and soldered them so they are in parallel - tests with series ones drew a mammoth current. A 2mm lighthouse LED was placed through the middle, this being white/red with a common positive so ideal for DCC. Below is the circuit board cut lines and finished board: And the results... (Note my nameplate I made last week whilst welding, apologies for the messy bench!....) With one from the decoder itself: With a small 3v cell, the lighting was fairly dim however the middle photo above is with a desk lamp pointed at it, and they’re still visible. The decoder powered photo is excessively bright, so any worries I had about dim lighting aren't worries at all! I’ll reduce the current for the halo outputs on the decoders when I’ve fitted the lights for good. Keep modelling! Jack. 4 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium newbryford Posted December 14, 2018 RMweb Premium Share Posted December 14, 2018 Can you do another four locos for me please............... Top work Jack. Cheers, Mick 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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