Family 8x4 OO layout - Trains running again.

[melmerby]

Thanks for the info, looks like it did the job.

I bet those sorts of products weren't available 40 years ago.

 

Keith

[LongRail]

The key product is the fibre reinforcement, all concrete cracks waterproof concrete basically reduces the crack width to acceptable levels which do not permit water to percolate through them . The Sika products provide another barrier and have been used in the construction industry for many years . You got some very good advice from your local aquatic centre

[Jaggzuk]

Well I have managed to get my modeling mojo back and have almost completed a Metcalfe factory kit which I started on a camping holiday last summer!  Nice to be back, will post some photos shortly.

 

The only downer was to find that some of the flat laminated sections of the kit I had already made up but not yet formed into the building shape had warped even though they were kept flat in a box of half made bits.  Next time, I think the parts need to be kept flat under weights.

 

The other issue I am having is glue.  I used some superglue (not a well known brand, but bought off a tool stand at a model show) to fix NEM couplings to some coach bogies, only to find they just snap off when hauling 3 to 4 coaches together in a rake.  Under test I have actually found the glue was pretty weak and to be honest did not stick.  Any advice on NEM fish tail pocket and gluing as liquid poly did not work on this type  of plastic.

 

So today I have bought a variety of well known brands to try out: Locktite, Gorilla and Bosstick.  I will feedback on my results.

[LongRail]

Superglue tends to be quite brittle, epoxy is a better bet

[Jaggzuk]

Ok might try some. Never really used any epoxy glue before, so do you mean the two part mix type?

[LongRail]

Yes best to use araldite 5 minute goes off quickly but then needs to be left at least overnight to fully cure

[Jaggzuk]

Ok, I think I went a bit over board with the glue purchases!!

 

 

 

But at least I should be able to stick things together now and hopefully they will come adrift

 

The pot of superglue top left is call Blue Spot and this is the one that appears not to stick any more, or at least plastics.

 

I shall give some feedback on the two Gorilla products when I use them.

 

Edited September 8, 2022 by Jaggzuk

[Jaggzuk]

So it is not quite finished yet, as it needs the roof coping flags and the platform canopy adding, but I wanted to show the interior with lighting.  I have used two LED ribbon strips each with 3 white LEDs on and lit using 12v.

 

Originally I was going to leave the interior blank, but when lit it really showed up as being blank grey card and looked wrong.  So I had to add a load of bits to make it look like a railway goods warehouse.  I added some painted up plaster cast packing crate stacks with the rest just being painted up scrap box items with some marked up with a black Sharpie pen for crate banding.

 

Really please with the outcome, but now I know I have to do interiors for all my future internally lit buildings.  But I think the effect is worth the effort?

 

The roof window furthest away on the right has been taped over on the inside with semi opaque sellotape to hide the fact that the end wall has not been pained and there were no packing items at this end.  It sort of creates the dirty, cobweb cover glass affect seen in this type of building.

 

 

 

 

Edited September 8, 2022 by Jaggzuk

[ess1uk]

Great looking building

[Fluo66]

Absolutely brilliant! Very atmospheric with the lights and interiors.

[melmerby]

 

The other issue I am having is glue.  I used some superglue (not a well known brand, but bought off a tool stand at a model show) to fix NEM couplings to some coach bogies, only to find they just snap off when hauling 3 to 4 coaches together in a rake.  Under test I have actually found the glue was pretty weak and to be honest did not stick.  Any advice on NEM fish tail pocket and gluing as liquid poly did not work on this type  of plastic.

The reason that liquid poly doesn't work is probably the same reason the superglue doesn't work i.e. it doesn't permeate the surface of this type plastic and therefore doesn't get a grip.

You need something that is what I would call a "tacky" glue. Wilko do contact adhesive in two varieties and I have found that these will stick coupling pockets to coach bogies. They take their time to go firm but do the job.

 

Keith

[LongRail]

Liquid poly doesn't work because the coupling is made of a different plastic for which this glue is designed Liquid poly works by melting the material and fusing them together.

Not all plastics are the same.

 

I think we tend to use superglue because it is easy to pick up this glue thinking it will stick everything but it is not suitable for a lot of applications. I for one am guilty of this

[melmerby]

Liquid poly doesn't work because the coupling is made of a different plastic for which this glue is designed Liquid poly works by melting the material and fusing them together.

Not all plastics are the same.

 

I think we tend to use superglue because it is easy to pick up this glue thinking it will stick everything but it is not suitable for a lot of applications. I for one am guilty of this

Liquid poly will still work, in a fashion, with materials it can "seep" into e.g. stick the right kind of plastic to wood. (If one would want to do such a thing!)

In this case the surface of the plastic will soften with some of the material leaching into the wood.

Mind you there are much better choices to do the job.

 

Keith

[Jaggzuk]

Cheers guys for the comments on glue.  I will try some of the ones I have just bought on spare couplings and some scrap bogies to see what works best before using for real on the rake of coaches I use the Superglue on.

 

I needed to fit NEM couplings on the bogies, as they are old Replica coaches and the original tension locks actually caused buffer lock on the R2 curves.

[andi4x4]

I have given up with superglue on anything that is not even remotely porous. Superglue only sticks one thing successfully - skin - as that is what it was originally designed for !  I have a selection of good quality superglues that are reserved for sticking appropriate materials ( including my fingers !     ), but tend to use solvent based welding type adhesives for most plastics and epoxy or latex based ( Copydex is very under-rated !) for everything else.

 

Have you considered the NEM pockets that have tiny screw holes in them ?  You would need some tiny screws though !

[Jaggzuk]

 

Have you considered the NEM pockets that have tiny screw holes in them ?  You would need some tiny screws though !

 

Not seen these, who makes them as my initial web search has drawn a blank?

[andi4x4]

These are what I was thinking about - made by Dapol, NEM pockets, supplied with TL couplings, but they can be removed and refitted with your choice of coupling - 

 

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/COUPNEM00-Dapol-OO-HO-Gauge-Nem-Coupling-00-Pack-Of-40-/251536996759?hash=item3a90c5f997:g:jCEAAOxyni9TFuHN

[Jaggzuk]

Well I can safely say I have never seen one of those, but they look really useful.  

 

So the tension hook coupling is a standard NEM type and can be pulled out form the socket?  And It looks like the bit with the hole has some form of plastic centering system; the two little L shapes lugs?

 

Do you know how well the NEM Kadee couplings work with this screw fixing from Dapol.?

[andi4x4]

I don't I'm afraid, I have never used Kadee couplings. I do have some rolling stock that needs the couplings replacing, and was planning to use these with the supplied TL couplings for my conversions.

 

As far as I am aware, these are a standard NEM pocket, so, should be compatible - a quick email to Dapol should confirm it though.

[Jaggzuk]

Saw these in Tesco and thought now that is useful packaging, I am now having to eat lots of cherries, but they are very nice :-)

 

The box is made from 3mm laser cut MDF all slotted together.  I did not measure the actual dims, but the base was about 300x200mm.

 

Will be very useful somewhere, building construction, wagon loads, landscape formers etc.

 

 

 

 

[Jaggzuk]

After having seen an article on making rolling stock storage using box files written by Chris Nevard in the Hornby magazine Issue 25 June 2009, I thought I would have a go.

 

Here's my first effort

 

My supplies were: 

• Foolscap box flies from WHSmith - 3 for £10 
• A pack of 5 sheets of A3 5mm foam mount board from Ryman - £14
• Tube of extra strong clear adhesive from Wicks - £3 (sets nice and quick)
• PVA glue
• Fleece Throw 2pk from B&M - £10 (this is 100% polyester and is actually quite thin)

The price of the parts for each box works out at approx £8.50 per finished box.

 

The method was pretty much as per the article but here is how I did it:

 

1. Removed the sprung document holder and flatten out the metal rivets.
2. Decide what stock the box will hold and the orientation within the box to make the best use of the space.
3. Cut the foam mount board in to strips - 37mm which was the width of my ruler and so it kept my cuts line parallel.  This height also allows enough of the stock to be proud so that fingers can get a grip to lift them out.  Approx one A3 sheet per box file.
4. Cut strips of fleece, enough to cover 2 sides and one end of the board strips.
5. Run a bead of extra strong clear adhesive (ESCA) along the full length of the foam strip at what will be the bottom edge and attach the fleece, allow to dry (5mins).  Do not use ESCA on the foam inner core as it melts it.
6. Run another bead of ESCA glue the full length of the foam board strip on the other side and wrap the fleece over so both sides and the top are covered.  Allow to dry.
7. Trim the fleece to the edge of the board.
8. For the strip of foam board to be glued to the box file I only attached the fleece to the top 10mm on the side facing the box.
9. Stick the first strip to the box side using ESCA.
10. Then glue each subsequent strip on to the base of the box file to form the cells.  I actually placed each piece of rolling stock in and then positioned each foam strip against the item to get a snug fit  Use PVA glue along the bottom edge of the foam board as the ESCA actually melts the foam as it is solvent based (very strong fumes too).
11. Use a bit of PVA on the strip ends where these touch another strip running at 90 degrees.
12. Allow to fully dry.

 

I am really please with the end result.  However, in reality the box file with 5 coaches and a wagon does not really save any current storage space compare to 5 red or blue boxes, but the ease with which stock can be got out and used make it all worth while.  Plus for wagons with home made loads, the manufactures boxes cannot be used, so the box file is prefect substitute.

 

As I positioned each foam strip against rolling stock to glue in place this created a nice snug fit which means that stock does not really roll about when the box is carried.

 

The best bit of this little trial is that the width of 6 pieces of 5mm foam board all covered with fleece actually created the perfect cell size to hold 5 Bachmann coaches in place with no rolling about - what I call a perfect unplanned fit!

 

Box of Bachmann coaches

 

Order of gluing foam strips:  left end, bottom of box, horizontal cell dividers, top of box, vertical against horizontal dividers, right end

 

 

Coach box with wagons to show how many fit.

 

 

I shall now do a proper boxes for wagons.

 

 

 

Edited September 8, 2022 by Jaggzuk

[Jaggzuk]

After a little play session with the boys there were some wagons that have been bugging me coupling wise, my POA/SSA scrap metal wagons.

 

These are Bachmann offering and came the usual tension lock couplings (TLC).  But these wagons out of the box derailed on my R2 curves.  After  a bit of an investigation it was found that the TLC was causing the wagon to jump the rails as there was not enough play with the hook for the radius.  The solution was to chop off the coupling two locating tabs either side and to loosen the central screw to allow it to pivot.  This soled the immediate problem and this is how they have been ever since ,

 

So back to tonight, the loose couplings have just annoyed me, so having already chosen to fit Kadee couplings to everything I have, I bit the bullet and had go at fitting some to these wagons,  Apart from using NEM Kadee already on a few items, this is my first effort of using the Draft Gear Box versions.

 

I think the one I have used is a No.5 with a 232 gear Box.  I am not sure of the coupler number as I picked up a box full of Kadee component bits a while back from house clearance  sale.

 

Anyway here is my process step photos.

 

The starting point, wagon with loose coupling, the two locating stubs are either side from the original coupling

 

 

Cutting the plastic stubs off with Xuron track cutters.  I then filed the stubs flat to the sole bar.

 

 

The Kadee parts

 

 

First option was to screw the Kadee draft gear box into the original couple screw hole.  But the coupling sit a bit too far forward of the buffers.

 

 

Looks ok, but would benefit from some weathering paint

 

 

Checking the Kadee is at the correct height and that the lopped metal bar underneath clears the bottom plate of the height gauge

 

 

The original large buffer coupling gap

 

 

The closer Kadee coupling, looks so much better.

 

 

But even better with the couplings installed at the correct location, but this required glue fixing of the gear box

 

 

 

The instructions for Kadee couplers is that where possibly the back face of the coupler should be level with the face of the buffers.  This meant I had to use liquid melt glue rather than a screw.  We will see how robust the glue is during play session and some heavy loads.

 

 

The result is fantastic, firstly it looks so much better being close coupled and secondly it is a breeze to uncouple and take the wagon off the layout, you just lift straight up!.  On with the rest of my old non NEM pocket stock now ha ha.

 

Some in info

From our own http://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/topic/24427-kadee-couplers/

Outside info http://www.modelrailforum.com/forums/index.php?autocom=custom&page=Kadee-Resources

 

Edited September 8, 2022 by Jaggzuk

[Pikey]

Does that definitely go round R2 curves with the buffers that close together?

[Jaggzuk]

Just and that surprised me too!  

 

The inner buffers were touching and the swing on the the Kadee in the draft box was almost fully to the side.  I ran the trucks round the the curve and while mid curve I tried to pull them away from each other.  The buffers separated by about 0.5-1mm.  So there was just a bit more play left in the Kadee.  Not sure if this would have been the case with a NEM pocket Kadee.

 

I also tested it on a reverse swing over a set of Peco Settrack points ans it was fine.

 

So for the next set of POA wagons I might bring the coupling face to be about 0.5mm in front of the buffer faces

[Pikey]

Perfect. They certainly do look a lot better closer together. Probably even more so with coaches