Smart Meter = smart move?

[SamThomas]

On 13/03/2022 at 12:36, 57xx said:

 

Economy 7.

Indeed, nothing high tec here, let alone "smart".

[SamThomas]

On 13/03/2022 at 12:40, hayfield said:

 

You must have spent far more time than I have in reading meters and sending the information. I may well have spent more time analysing the information, but since the installation of the smart meter except when I had a faulty gas meter (nothing to do with the smart operation which was both working and alerted me to the problem)

 

I have neither read any of my meters or forwarded the readings since these were installed and if I wish can find out the exact information as of the day before, or I can just wait for the next bill and check my payments are covering my usage. However prior to the smart meter I was always receiving estimates and had to faff about obtaining the data, send it and wait for an amended bill. Not very smart and a big time waster

With respect, you have a commendable faith in the technology being 100% correct.

 

I can (if I want to) access as much information and probably more with a few mouse clicks regarding my utilities.

[SamThomas]

On 14/03/2022 at 17:44, 57xx said:

 

That is how my Dad's works. When first installed it wouldn't communicate with the electric meter and he spent 6 months trying to get the supplier to fix it whilst it also read 0 gas consumption.

Looks like "smart" meters have at least one advantage.

[SamThomas]

On 15/03/2022 at 10:07, Sir TophamHatt said:

While I'm no fan, Elon Musk has it right with the Tesla cars.

Apparently, you can set them to pre-warm before getting in.  While combusion engines work differently, there is no reason why a separate heater couldn't have been included with any engine to warm the interior of a car before getting in or defrosting windows or whatever.

Been available on diesel Range Rovers for the past 20 years.

Not cheap to run but doable with the money your "smart" meter will save you - nothing beats wafting down the road looking down on the plebs in their elcectric mice & sticking a finger up towards Geta.

 

To clarify for those devoid of a GSOH - this comment is TIC & not to be taken seiously.)

 

ps. I don't like Elon Musk either.

Edited April 5, 2022 by SamThomas

[SamThomas]

On 15/03/2022 at 10:22, Sir TophamHatt said:

Remember, people didn't have a NEED for a smart TV, but that's all you can get now and millions enjoy the benefits.  Yet the beginning of digital saw pixelated pictures and generally awful reception.  Rare to get that these days.

Not in the summer is you live accross the channel from our French friends.

 

We have a "smart" TV & it's used simply as a monitor so hopefully not too much spying on us.

[hayfield]

14 hours ago, SamThomas said:

We have a non"smart" meter for the main house & solar panels have a non "smart" meter to measure the power generated.

Once a quarter we provide a reading from the solar panels meter on line & in less than 7 days the FIT payment in in our nominated bank account.

Currently recieving 22.5p/kwh for what we generate if we use it or not.

 

So, "old meters" can in fact work perfectly well with solar panels.

 

Can work certainly, however things have moved on and now certainly things can work better using latest technology

 

Certainly the FIT scheme is very beneficial, however those of us who have bought panels after it stopped have to look for the best options out there, having smart meters allows us to join schemes which requires them and usually these do give better terms. Plus as the recent events have shown trouble free meter readings and much faster data

[hayfield]

14 hours ago, SamThomas said:

With respect, you have a commendable faith in the technology being 100% correct.

 

I can (if I want to) access as much information and probably more with a few mouse clicks regarding my utilities.

 

Not only faith, but in practice it showed up quickly a fault in the older tech part in my system

 

As for accessing info, without a smart meter the information will only be as good as the last meter reading sent. Smart meters do it every 15 mins 

[Reorte]

34 minutes ago, hayfield said:

 

Not only faith, but in practice it showed up quickly a fault in the older tech part in my system

 

As for accessing info, without a smart meter the information will only be as good as the last meter reading sent. Smart meters do it every 15 mins 

Another reason to be put off them!

 

I'm all for the absolute minimum amount of information being gathered and recorded that's absolutely necessary to do the job (applies to most things, ). I have extremely negative opinions about more than that.

Edited April 6, 2022 by Reorte

[hayfield]

7 minutes ago, Reorte said:

Another reason to be put off them!

 

I'm all for the absolute minimum amount of information being gathered and recorded that's absolutely necessary to do the job (applies to most things, ). I have extremely negative opinions about more than that.

 

You like all things do not have to take notice of them, but it gathers the same information but in shorter automated intervals.

 

I for one am glad I don't have to read the meters anymore,  I can monitor my energy use as little or as often as I want. 

 

The simple fact is I found a fault, which if left to mount up would have cost me hundreds of additional unplanned £'s, I noticed the fault, reported it immediately and planned for the additional cost and in the end ended up paying less than anticipated by being alert and honest

[boxbrownie]

Well, they came a fitted the new smart gas meter to replace our faulty meter which I told them about last August!

 

Didn't take very long and seemed to go well, they had to fit a transmitter unit in the electric meter cupboard (outside) as our electric meter is still the original dumb meter type.

 

They gave us the monitor for viewing usage and this morning it seems to be still dumb……gas has been used, but no reading on the monitor, otherwise it all went great 😁

 

[admiles]

2 hours ago, boxbrownie said:

Well, they came a fitted the new smart gas meter to replace our faulty meter which I told them about last August!

 

Didn't take very long and seemed to go well, they had to fit a transmitter unit in the electric meter cupboard (outside) as our electric meter is still the original dumb meter type.

 

They gave us the monitor for viewing usage and this morning it seems to be still dumb……gas has been used, but no reading on the monitor, otherwise it all went great 😁

 

 

Pretty "paperweight"! 😛

[PhilH]

3 hours ago, Reorte said:

Another reason to be put off them!

 

I'm all for the absolute minimum amount of information being gathered and recorded that's absolutely necessary to do the job (applies to most things, ). I have extremely negative opinions about more than that.

Alternatively anything that puts me more in control of my energy use through knowing exactly the cost of what I am using is ok by me. At least there won’t be any nasty surprises when the bill comes in, I’ll already know the worst.

[SamThomas]

3 hours ago, hayfield said:

As for accessing info, without a smart meter the information will only be as good as the last meter reading sent. Smart meters do it every 15 mins 

    If I'm that interested/bothered/sad enough I can access that information with a couple of mouse clicks & that information is live & to the second without the benefit of a so called "smart" meter.

 

If you like a good read I recomment a book called "Black Out" by Marc Elsberg - a work of fiction but it puts a whole new light (excuse the pun) on not only "smart" meters but the way we foolishly depend & trust I.T.

[Reorte]

30 minutes ago, PhilH said:

Alternatively anything that puts me more in control of my energy use through knowing exactly the cost of what I am using is ok by me. At least there won’t be any nasty surprises when the bill comes in, I’ll already know the worst.

If I'm using something it's turned on, if I'm not it's turned off. Can't really see how there's much that can be meaningfully changed, certainly not enough to outweigh my intense dislike of being monitored.

[PhilH]

11 minutes ago, Reorte said:

If I'm using something it's turned on, if I'm not it's turned off. Can't really see how there's much that can be meaningfully changed, certainly not enough to outweigh my intense dislike of being monitored.

I think it’s useful, as I said, to know how much something is costing me if it’s switched on. I think that there will be those who won’t realise exactly how much the world has changed when it comes to energy costs and will be dismayed when their monthly or quarterly bills come in.

As far as information monitoring is concerned I have long ago accepted that half the world knows more about me than I do myself, and that it is impossible to control where that information ends up or how it is used.

[Reorte]

13 minutes ago, PhilH said:

I think it’s useful, as I said, to know how much something is costing me if it’s switched on. I think that there will be those who won’t realise exactly how much the world has changed when it comes to energy costs and will be dismayed when their monthly or quarterly bills come in.

As far as information monitoring is concerned I have long ago accepted that half the world knows more about me than I do myself, and that it is impossible to control where that information ends up or how it is used.

 

The latter part is why I regard the world as having already tipped over the dystopian edge (not that things can't be far, far worse). The former? Well, the bills are the bills. I might be dismayed but there won't be much I could actually change.

[hayfield]

40 minutes ago, SamThomas said:

    If I'm that interested/bothered/sad enough I can access that information with a couple of mouse clicks & that information is live & to the second without the benefit of a so called "smart" meter.

 

If you like a good read I recomment a book called "Black Out" by Marc Elsberg - a work of fiction but it puts a whole new light (excuse the pun) on not only "smart" meters but the way we foolishly depend & trust I.T.

 

The fact is I rarely look at my smart meter, but I do look once a day at the output from both my power generation and my use of both the energy I produce and the energy I import. Simply I am trying to buck the trend and reduce my energy costs (which I have done) rather than just stick my head in the sand like many others. 

 

One simple fact is that my total electrical energy use has reduced substantially (by 30%) since I have been taking an interest in the subject over the past 7 months, that is before the savings from solar power

 

The latest rise in gas prices is now making me think about my use of gas and whether additional smart devices can be of benefit

[hayfield]

58 minutes ago, PhilH said:

I think it’s useful, as I said, to know how much something is costing me if it’s switched on. I think that there will be those who won’t realise exactly how much the world has changed when it comes to energy costs and will be dismayed when their monthly or quarterly bills come in.

As far as information monitoring is concerned I have long ago accepted that half the world knows more about me than I do myself, and that it is impossible to control where that information ends up or how it is used.

 

Smart meters have nothing to do about big brother, simply send meter readings !!!  You are spot on about being much better off being forewarned about future bills. Simply my gas cost has nearly doubled  since it went up on the 2nd, the only benefit is as we are entering the warmer period consumption will decline, its October onwards which will be the real issue if prices remain very high

 

 

[Reorte]

3 minutes ago, hayfield said:

 

Smart meters have nothing to do about big brother, simply send meter readings !!!  You are spot on about being much better off being forewarned about future bills. Simply my gas cost has nearly doubled  since it went up on the 2nd, the only benefit is as we are entering the warmer period consumption will decline, its October onwards which will be the real issue if prices remain very high

Sending meter readings automatically at frequent intervals is too much Big Brother for my tastes.

 

"Smart" meters combine two things I intensely dislike - further monitoring (I dislike that for its own sake, not because of any fears about misuse of the data) and further automation and piling in more technology on things that worked fine without it. As we get more and more of such stuff I just find the world becoming increasingly ludicrous, and it's very depressing to see people cheering it on; the more they try to defend it the more depressed and cynical I get about people.

Edited April 6, 2022 by Reorte

[hayfield]

1 minute ago, Reorte said:

Sending meter readings automatically at frequent intervals is too much Big Brother for my tastes.

 

"Smart" meters combine two things I intensely dislike - further monitoring (I dislike that for its own sake, not because of any fears about misuse of the data) and further automation and piling in more technology on things that worked fine without it. As we get more and more of such stuff I just find the world becoming increasingly ludicrous, and it's very depressing to see people cheering it on.

 

I can accept adding extra layers of information/data. But its not its an automated way of sending your meter readings. Octopus knew exactly how many units I used at the old rate and at the new rate as my system sent the data automatically at midnight

 

Where it comes to how much energy I personally use makes no matter, its the effect of what is happening on the grid and when. 

 

Now I have just had a quote for storage batteries, whilst on the face of it prices have dropped, for me I don't feel its enough for me to spend on it, however if it gets worse I will have to revisit the situation

[trevora]

1 hour ago, hayfield said:

 

 

 

 

Now I have just had a quote for storage batteries, whilst on the face of it prices have dropped, for me I don't feel its enough for me to spend on it, however if it gets worse I will have to revisit the situation

I have had batteries for a month now and so far not had any power from the grid so only costing me £0,08 per day standing charge

I know that come the winter it will be different

but IF i can find a offpeak supply then maybe half price overnight could mean no daytime rate power will be needed

[Jonboy]

7 minutes ago, trevora said:

I have had batteries for a month now and so far not had any power from the grid so only costing me £0,08 per day standing charge

I know that come the winter it will be different

but IF i can find a offpeak supply then maybe half price overnight could mean no daytime rate power will be needed

Can I ask what size solar array and batteries you have? We are due to move soon and I am hoping to get Solar installed in the new property but not sure how much battery capacity would be worthwhile.

[hayfield]

19 minutes ago, trevora said:

I have had batteries for a month now and so far not had any power from the grid so only costing me £0,08 per day standing charge

I know that come the winter it will be different

but IF i can find a offpeak supply then maybe half price overnight could mean no daytime rate power will be needed

 

My solar panels were fitted under the Essex CC Solar Together scheme, at the time of quotation a set of batteries would have cost me £5000 and with the solar panels would have met 80% of my old usage 3600 kwh. As the panels cost me £2600 at the then price structure assuming average inflation and normal degradation the capital expenditure would have been repaid after 9 odd years, the cost of batteries seemed not to be as cost effective

 

What I have found, even though I have only been through the less productive months of the year the estimates on generation have been quite conservative, plus it was based on a retail cost of 16p per kwh and export fee of 3p per kwh. Well now the figures are 29p retail and 7.5p export. The break even point is now very much earlier

 

I have recently had a quote under the latest scheme for batteries, a 4.3kw system would cost me £3613, that would allow me to use 1063 extra kwh a year

 

I assume the calculation is saving me £310 pa  but I would loose £80 in export  payments (net £230 pa)

 

I think I may have to look into this a little as I may not have given all the info they require, the cost is cheaper but the benefits are much lower

[trevora]

1 hour ago, Jonboy said:

Can I ask what size solar array and batteries you have? We are due to move soon and I am hoping to get Solar installed in the new property but not sure how much battery capacity would be worthwhile.

I have 2kw west & 2kw east facing and GivEnergy 3kW AC Coupled Bundle with 8.2kWh batteries

As the solar was put in 2013 batteries cost about £4250

If done with solar same inverter could be used saving some

[hayfield]

Sorry to restart this topic but there were comments about variable pricing at peak hours and I thought I would share my experiance

 

Well last Tuesday Octopus trialled a system where they paid you for reducing your consumption during a peak hour, here is my experience (one of a series of trials funded by the energy generator)

 

I received an email yesterday with the results of the first trial, it stated I saved 0.767kWh and earned 1384 OctoPoints – worth £1.73

 

As it happened the only changes we made were not to use the oven between 5 & 6 pm (I had planned to cook a Chinese meal anyway on our gas hob) and only use the family room for light and watching TV, so no real hardship at all

 

The system said we saved 73% of our normal usage (during that hour). Octopus customers saved in total 108mwh during the test

 

Looking at it we used 0.767 kwh less power saving us 27p, our total net cost of electricity that day was £2.04, on the negative side we may have used 3p worth of extra gas. The additional plus is we will get £1.73 back. A few months back there was a big outcry from some on the Smart Meter thread about the negative side of this method of protecting/saving energy with this technology. OK £1.73 is not much on its own but when added to all the other little benefits Smart Meters, DDI payments, and solar power etc it all adds up

 

On that day my gross power costs were £2.21 take off all the benefits of solar power and the Octopoints  my net cost of Electricity on that day reduced to £0.31p . Well worth changing cooking method (or timing ) during times of stress on the system, if it either stops power cuts or saves the generator spending millions on additional power costs must be worth the slight inconvenience

 

Rather than looking at how little it affects us individually, look at the group, saved peak time usage by 108 mega watt hours. Octopus reported "it was equivalent to effectively shutting down an entire gas power station throughout the Session" Now with little effort one companies customers were able to do this think what the network could do in times of emergency !!  We are in difficult times so perhaps have to do a little more to help others