NG/Std Gauge wagon ( Leek & Manifold style)

[Stubby47]

Hi all,

 

On my DM Four Mill Something thread, DonB posted this video link of the Leek & Manifold Railway, showing a NG wagon on which a Std gauge wagon is carried.

 

www.youtube.com/watch?gl=GB&hl=en-GB&v=dWZbZGGnE6E

 

Does anyone know of an RTR version of this, using 9mm NG and 16.5 mm Std gauge ?

 

Many thanks

 

Stu

[PaulRhB]

Only current one is by Liliput in HOe but there have been resin kits of the L&M ones.

L291907 & L291909 still around in a few shops and no doubt on eBay but out of stock at Bachmann.

Edited August 4, 2017 by PaulRhB

[RexAshton]

I know this is the wrong scale (bottom of page)but it would suggest a fairly simple scratch build based around a couple of bogies.

[Stubby47]

I know this is the wrong scale (bottom of page)but it would suggest a fairly simple scratch build based around a couple of bogies.

 

That was the next option, but I'll try & source one of Paul's suggestions first.

 

Thanks gents !!

[mcowgill]

You might run into problems with clearances on a Leek & Manifold style transporter wagon.  They were low slung vehicles with a raised centre section over the top of the bogies and lower platforms either side with flangeways and running surfaces that the wagons sat on.

 

 

I scratchbuilt one many years ago and ran into issues due to the conflict between needing an over scale upper body width to allow for bogie swing on model curves and the back-to-back clearance for the standard gauge wheels being narrow in 00 gauge.  I solved it by making it for EM gauge instead.

 

I blame that transporter wagon for a lot of future trouble, shortly afterwards my standard gauge modelling moved to EM and then P4, all because I messed about with the back to back on that wagon on the transporter!

 

Martin

[Stubby47]

Thanks Martin, the issue of a narrower (16.5mm) standard gauge is definitely worth thinking about.

 

The style of wagon shown does keep the centre of gravity low, plus for my purposes (Project #1 below) also keeps the overall height low (as I'll be using vans rather than opens).

[PaulRhB]

Metal wheels on the 16.5 wagon help and remove and weight you can get to if it rocks badly.

I found the Liliput one quite stable and they say it will go round 192mm radius on the Liliput site.

[Stubby47]

The standard gauge wagons will need to be 'normal' wagons, as the intention is to run them on-scene, then shunt on to the NG wagon. A NG Loco will then pull the wagon pair on to a hoist, to be lowered to a subterranean level, where they will be moved to a magazine store  (and at some point the operation will be reversed, bringing the wagon back up and on to the standard gauge track).

 

However, just thinking this through, I'm going to need several transporter wagons to make this work...

 

Without checking, I'm guessing the 192mm radius is similar to the Peco NG / N gauge points ?

 

The 192mm is far tighter curve than the Peco points.

Edited August 4, 2017 by Stubby47

[DCB]

A scratch build should not be too difficult, Just keep the centre raised portion to 14mm max and use black plasticard as the paint will get rubbed off in operation. Its too long for a 4 wheeler so it will need inside framed bogies and  It may be necessary to cut away the sides to give the bogie wheels clearance to swing, I am wondering how the L&M staff lubricated the axle bearings, were there covers? 

 

Subterranean storage sounds good.  Vertical lift?  Been planning one myself so empty wagons can enter the goods shed and loaded wagons can emerge.  Getting a smooth operation is challenging, started with an electric motor, now looking at hand operated through a system of levers.

[Nearholmer]

Clearances are an issue with the L&M wagon if you use 009/00; it is just about do-able, but:

 

You will need to make the the 009 parts with inside-bearings; choose the finest 009 wheels compatible with your railway (some are pretty "gross"); use a very thin material, 20 thou brass or similar, for the tunnel-like body of the wagon.

 

You might find that, even so, the amount of rotation you can get on the 009 bogies is minimal.

 

IIRC Centre Models used to make a kit, but that was a looong time ago, and their kits were a tad "interesting" to build!

 

Kevin

[Stubby47]

Subterranean storage sounds good.  Vertical lift?  Been planning one myself so empty wagons can enter the goods shed and loaded wagons can emerge.  Getting a smooth operation is challenging, started with an electric motor, now looking at hand operated through a system of levers.

 

Yep, the hoist will be using a motor.

 

I've done this before...

 

http://www.carendt.com/small-layout-scrapbook/page-101-september-2010/#wheal_tiny

 

http://forum.mtimag.co.uk/viewtopic.php?t=714&sid=0d753c49e9ffd9dde0401dc48327bbbc

 

http://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/blog/168/entry-1184-wheal-tiny-guttering-a-chimney/

A scratch build should not be too difficult, Just keep the centre raised portion to 14mm max and use black plasticard as the paint will get rubbed off in operation. Its too long for a 4 wheeler so it will need inside framed bogies and  It may be necessary to cut away the sides to give the bogie wheels clearance to swing, I am wondering how the L&M staff lubricated the axle bearings, were there covers? 

 

 

 

Thanks for the tips.

[Stubby47]

I've got a Parkside bogie wagon kit somewhere - I was hoping to adapt that somehow to make a suitable wagon.

[dhjgreen]

...its too long for a 4 wheeler ...

Would a 4 wheeler with steerable axles (as some 0 gauge) work?

[Killian keane]

Theres a 4mm example in use here briefly at 20:33, presumably, thats a 16.5mm gauge wagon its carrying also