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Great Southern Railway (Fictitious) - Signalling the changes...

Skinnylinny
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Nick Holliday

Nick Holliday

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Exactly like that, in fact. It's good to see that the design seems to be variable in a way that includes my bodge to get things more easily buildable. 

 

In the meantime, I have given up on writing instructions for this evening - I'm about half way through the instructions that should cover three of the kits, and today has been a very long day with the Trans Pride Scotland march in Edinburgh - and have had a look at some of the drawings that have been sent to me by Edwardian of this parish. Using my previous Stroudleys as a basis for panelling etc, I've managed to produce this much of the design for a D.158 48' Brake 3rd.

 

post-189-0-07333500-1522769622_thumb.png

 

I still need to have a long, hard think about how to tackle the bogies, but that is a project for another day!

These 48' coaches were built in seven coach close coupled sets for suburban use.  A full set usually comprised a brake third - nine compartment 2nd/3rd composite - eight compartment 1st/2nd - seven compartment first - another 1st/2nd composite - another 2nd/3rd composite - third brake, although I don't expect many modellers will manage the whole lot.  Unfortunately, I think the third brake as shown here was a one-off, D 159, No. 1269, which had only six compartments. Most of the other brakes, to D 158, had seven compartments, with just three blank panels bettwen the last window and the guard's doors. In addition, there were around 29 of these sets, and at least 20 of them, built by the BirminghamRailway Carriage and Wagon Company, were equipped with toplights, fitted with coloured glass, above each of the carriage windows, making them look very different from the earliest Brighton built sets.

post-189-0-24809900-1522769879.png

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Skinnylinny

Skinnylinny

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That's extremely useful to know, and shows I definitely need to acquire the book of bogie coaches. The perils of blindly following drawings...

The Dia. 159 as drawn above (with 6 comparments) could indeed be easily modified into a Dia. 158 (7 compartments) - the drawing I have simply states "Add one more compartment for Dia. 159" (!) so knowing there were three panels after that will make that possible. It does indeed look to be the case that the Dia. 159 was a one-off, so I think the 158 would be much more useful.

The 48' first I have a drawing for seems to only have six compartments, being Dia. 49, I believe. 

Do we know what colour the coloured glass in the toplights would have been?

 

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Edwardian

Edwardian

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That's extremely useful to know, and shows I definitely need to acquire the book of bogie coaches. The perils of blindly following drawings...

 

The Dia. 159 as drawn above (with 6 comparments) could indeed be easily modified into a Dia. 158 (7 compartments) - the drawing I have simply states "Add one more compartment for Dia. 159" (!) so knowing there were three panels after that will make that possible. It does indeed look to be the case that the Dia. 159 was a one-off, so I think the 158 would be much more useful.

 

The 48' first I have a drawing for seems to only have six compartments, being Dia. 49, I believe. 

 

Do we know what colour the coloured glass in the toplights would have been?

 

 

 

OK, when I have a mo, I will scan you the chapter on Billinton bogie carriages, which covers the 48' stock, but not the block sets, and the one on carriage stock constructed between 1907 and 1924.  This should get you the 54' stock you need.

 

I agree that the book would be a sensible purchase, but these two sections of it will tide you over with this project until you bag a copy.

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Skinnylinny

Skinnylinny

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That's very kind of you, thank you. I'll be on a bit of a hiatus from drawing this week as I'm quite busy, and getting the instructions finished for the Stroudley four-wheelers is my priority, to allow a general release in about a week.

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Nick Holliday

Nick Holliday

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That's extremely useful to know, and shows I definitely need to acquire the book of bogie coaches. The perils of blindly following drawings...

The Dia. 159 as drawn above (with 6 comparments) could indeed be easily modified into a Dia. 158 (7 compartments) - the drawing I have simply states "Add one more compartment for Dia. 159" (!) so knowing there were three panels after that will make that possible. It does indeed look to be the case that the Dia. 159 was a one-off, so I think the 158 would be much more useful.

The 48' first I have a drawing for seems to only have six compartments, being Dia. 49, I believe. 

Do we know what colour the coloured glass in the toplights would have been?

 

One of the authors of the books on LBSCR four and six wheel coaches is, I believe, well on the way to producing more volumes to cover the bogie stock, so it might be worth waiting for that to come out.

As for the colours, Gould gives blue for first class, red for second and yellow for third, although that was soon to changed to white frosted glass with the class designation etched in, replacing the numbers on the doors. These top lights were later removed and replaced with solid panels.

Seventeen of these sets remained as close-coupled until completely rebuilt as Southern third rail electric stock, whilst others, from around 1910 were fitted with long buffers for use as mainline stock, a few being radically converted as LBSC overhead stock at around the same time

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Edwardian

Edwardian

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One of the authors of the books on LBSCR four and six wheel coaches is, I believe, well on the way to producing more volumes to cover the bogie stock, so it might be worth waiting for that to come out.

As for the colours, Gould gives blue for first class, red for second and yellow for third, although that was soon to changed to white frosted glass with the class designation etched in, replacing the numbers on the doors. These top lights were later removed and replaced with solid panels.

Seventeen of these sets remained as close-coupled until completely rebuilt as Southern third rail electric stock, whilst others, from around 1910 were fitted with long buffers for use as mainline stock, a few being radically converted as LBSC overhead stock at around the same time

 

Thanks, Nick.  That's a must-have volume.

 

I hope it's soon.

 

In the meantime, I have not yet addressed my mind to the question of suitable buffers, underframe and roof fittings for these Billinton types. I don't think Roxey sells components separately.

 

Do they exist in the accessories market, I wonder, or should we be teeing up a friendly 3D print expert? 

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Nick Holliday

Nick Holliday

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The 48' Billinton coaches are produced, in brass, by Branchlines, so it might be worth contacting them, as they sell bits and pieces on their exhibition stand. Roxey are responsible for producing three types of the later 54' coaches, so their fittings etc. may be different. Branchlines also do a couple of 54' third brakes, so they might have fittings for these ones, too.

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Nick C

Nick C

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Just found this topic, and I'll be following with interest as I'm modelling the Isle of Wight, so I'd certainly be interested in some of the 54' stock - the problem with the island is that almost all of the ex-Brighton coaches were modified when thye were sent over, so they were all different! (and some were unique...) - presumably the use of laser cutting makes modifications to make different diagrams pretty easy? Just a case of adjusting the CAD for the sides?

 

The Gould bogie coaches book is still available new from the current owners of the Oakwood Press - http://stenlake.co.uk/book_publishing/?page_id=131&ref=848&section=Oakwood

 

When I got mine the secondhand copies were going for £16-20 when it's new for £13...

Edited by Nick C
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Skinnylinny

Skinnylinny

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Thanks for the comment :) Indeed, once I've drawn up a set of ends, a lot of the work is copying and pasting the compartments and moving the panelling and windows about! Thanks for the link, I'll grab a copy of that on my next pay day!

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sem34090

sem34090

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I think it's safe to say that Linny here has done far more than any kit manufacturer to bring cheap, realistic, and relatively simple coach kits to the model railway market.

 

You are to be very highly congratulated, Sir!

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Skinnylinny

Skinnylinny

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Awww shucks! Wait until you've tried to build one before you call it simple! My plan is to get everything ready this weekend for a release of the Stroudley 4-wheel coaches to sale next week. The instructions are likely to come by email, rather than being printed, mainly as a means of saving money - if buying four 3rd-class coaches, you don't need four sets of printed instructions! Plus, having them on the computer means you can zoom in if any of the drawings are unclear. Final price for the card kits is £9 plus postage at £3 per order - orders of 4 or more will drop to £8.50 a coach. 

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Edwardian

Edwardian

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What are the parts needed to complete a kit? I'm thinking wheels, bearings, buffers, couplings etc.

 

Roof fittings?  Dart/MJT produce the oil lamp covers and bungs.

 

Damn!  I knew there was something else I needed from their stall at York!

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Skinnylinny

Skinnylinny

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Parts needed to complete are:

- 14mm Mansell wheels + pinpoint bearings (I get mine from www.hamodels.net, though you can use Hornby 14mm wheels but they don't run as well in the kit)
- Stroudley buffers + rooftop oil lamps (from 5and9models.co.uk)
- Stroudley-pattern grab handles/door handles (nice etched brass ones available from www.roxeymouldings.co.uk )
- Couplings of choice - I would recommend against 3-links as the coach chassis is only held together with PVA glue so you run the risk of pulling the chassis apart. I may yet draw up something to stick on the bottom of the chassis to mount an NEM box at the right height

Glazing will be supplied but needs cutting to size by the buyer.

Also required: Paint, PVA glue, superglue, transfers.

Also worth noting - the brake 3rd is a bit more fiddly due to the need to form the guard's lookout ducket - I'd recommend building one of the non-brake coaches first to get used to the construction before moving on to the brake.

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Skinnylinny

Skinnylinny

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I do hope these will not be "posts to UK only" when they go on sale.

Fortunately Brexit hasn't happened yet! If you drop me a PM on here, I'd be happy to work out the most affordable way to get them to France. :) Fortunately, being a flat-pack card kit, they're fairly easy to post. I don't know what La Poste will do with "Do not bend"-marked envelopes though!

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Skinnylinny

Skinnylinny

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Incidentally, a website is slowly coming together for these coach kits - see my signature for a link - and I will be hosting the instructions for these coaches on the website, to save printing many sets of instructions! The instructions for the D41 1st/2nd class composite are up on the website now, and I'll hopefully have the D43 and D44 done tomorrow, if not the D45 as well.

 

https://linnyslaser.wordpress.com/

Comments very welcome!

Edited by Skinnylinny
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