Great Southern Railway (Fictitious) - Signalling the changes...

[Skinnylinny]

(Just noticed the little girl and boy behind the coach with only their legs visible makes it look a little like a train from the Flintstones!)

[Skinnylinny]

And I forgot to list one project on the list of laser-cutting projects. A parcel arrived today, from Derek at Progress Products... The condensed milk van will be re-drawn in coarse-scale '0' soon, hopefully with fixtures to fit a tinplate roof. 

 

[Annie]

Wow!  This is great news.  I am sooooooo looking forward to these.

[RedGemAlchemist]

Wow!  This is great news.  I am sooooooo looking forward to these.

I second that notion!

[Skinnylinny]

So, more lasering. This time it was a test cut of the bodyshells:



All three first-cut chassis have been assembled, and I've made a few alterations to the design to give a little more sideplay on the centre wheels. I'm also pondering whether I should make the chassis from 0.8mm plywood instead of card, to give a little more rigidity. I'll probably order a sheet to do a test cut with. It might make the kits a little more expensive, but should also give better running qualities.

 

Hopefully I should be able to test-assemble these and see how they go in the next few days...

[Skinnylinny]

Thank you for the words of encouragement!

 

Perhaps not putting a price on reliability, so much as trying to make sure these kits stay firmly in the "affordable" range of prices! The aim for these card kits is decidedly for them to be cheap enough that people won't be afraid to make a mess of one or two! That being said, I'm considering putting something on the website along the lines of "If you make a mess of any kit, I'll replace up to 5 parts free of charge" or something, to make them even less scary! Given that I'll be offering the Push-Pull set as one kit of 3 coaches, and they'll be more fiddly than the Stroudleys, that guarantee might come in handy!

Edited June 6, 2018 by Skinnylinny

[Skinnylinny]

Well, I assembled the bodies for these coaches today, and I have to say the tab-and-slot made construction a breeze! It's not possible to build these out of square without seriously mangling the parts, as everything's held in alignment by other parts during assembly. Despite having no buffers or couplings yet, I decided to try a few propelling movements on the club's 0-16.5 layout "Talybont", and the 6-wheel chassis, while a bit floppy up in the air, seems to hold the road rather nicely, even with the P at full speed on the controller. 

 

 

 

 

 

I stress that these are still first-builds, and there are a few refinements to be made, but for now, the next step is to cut out the detail overlays. I'm really excited for these to be finished, they're going rather well!

[Edwardian]

Brilliant, Linny, and good to see.

 

That change in scale still plays with my head, though.

[Kelly]

These look excellent. Great work. Given the right diagrams done, some of them could potentially be used for some of the earlier EMU conversions.

[Nick Holliday]

It'll be a while I'm afraid... The current state of play is:

 

Future Plans

• Railmotor?
• Generic 4-wheel coaches
• LBSCR balloon push-pull coach?
• NBR bogie coaches
• LBSCR Craven coaches

An impressive and ambitious list. The problem with railmotors is the 3D nature of parts of them, although the fully enclosed ones like LSWR etc. are less of a problem.

 

You are virtually there with generic four wheel coaches.  The LBSC ones are almost identical to those on several other lines of a similar age.  The main differentials are the grabrails, which are not included, so using a different pattern from LBSC would immediately give a different tinge to the ensemble http://www.roxeymouldings.co.uk/category/63/4mm-scale-etched-accessories-by-roxey-mouldings/ gives a few alternatives, or something from Shapeways perhaps as discussed elsewhere. It's a shame that those who cut and carve Ratio and Hornby plastic bodies tend to leave the grabrails as they are, which scream Midland or Great Western. The only change that needs to be made to provide a full range of generic coaches is to deal with the brake third.  The large guards lookout howeever is rather too characteristic of the LBSC, although other lines had similar, if less flamboyant, ones, so perhaps a semi-freelance design, based on the same  principles as the Brighton used, but with alternative lookouts such as side duckets or perhaps a birdcage, might find favour.

 

As for further LBSC coaches, is it possible to avoid too much duplication?  I suspect many modellers will have already stocked up on Branchlines and Roxey kits, if they are Brighton fans, and, in fact, Worsley Works have already produced side and end etchings for all the rest of the purpose-built railmotor coaches. Perhaps the balloon coaches that were converted to pull-push use after Grouping might be a more fertile area, since the Mallard range hardly scratched the surface of the wide variety of the Balloon Carriages, which tended to be built in very small batches. Maybe even the City Limited please? Similarly with the Craven coaches, as 5&9 already have quite a range available, which have been augented by some recent etchings from EBM, and as they supply the fittings needed to complete your kits, it might be seen as biting the hand that feeds you.

[sem34090]

Not all of us have/can/will be able to afford Roxey/Branchlines/Worsley kits. Linny's offer a realistically priced alternative.

 

At any rate it's up to Linny what is made and what isn't!

[Regularity]

What a model is made from, and how much it costs, is irrelevant: people have been making superb models using metal, wood, card, styrene and the pickings from Captain Ahab’s teeth for decades.

 

The only thing that matters is the quality of the workmanship that went into producing the finished result.

[Skinnylinny]

I don't like to think that I'm competing with existing kit manufacturers too much - the Roxey mouldings coaches are lovely, but I personally would struggle to build them and finish them to a standard I'd be happy with. I've built one of their kits (a very nice birdcage brake van) but the amount of time and effort it took, as well as financial outlay, put a train of their kits outside my price range and time capabilities. If I really sat down and had a go at it, I could probably have the 3-coach push-pull done in a long evening (or at least, once it's in production, anyway!). 

These will never be as nice as metal models, but I'm hoping that they're good enough and easy enough to inspire beginners into kit-building their own rolling stock. I know I'd rather start out with a £9 card coach and PVA glue or a £10 Parkside kit with liquid poly than a £33 Roxey Stroudley which will need soldering! If your skills and money run to the metal kits, I'm very happy to recommend them, but these are pitched at those who wouldn't be buying them anyway.

[Edwardian]

An impressive and ambitious list. The problem with railmotors is the 3D nature of parts of them, although the fully enclosed ones like LSWR etc. are less of a problem.

 

You are virtually there with generic four wheel coaches.  The LBSC ones are almost identical to those on several other lines of a similar age.  The main differentials are the grabrails, which are not included, so using a different pattern from LBSC would immediately give a different tinge to the ensemble http://www.roxeymouldings.co.uk/category/63/4mm-scale-etched-accessories-by-roxey-mouldings/ gives a few alternatives, or something from Shapeways perhaps as discussed elsewhere. It's a shame that those who cut and carve Ratio and Hornby plastic bodies tend to leave the grabrails as they are, which scream Midland or Great Western. The only change that needs to be made to provide a full range of generic coaches is to deal with the brake third.  The large guards lookout howeever is rather too characteristic of the LBSC, although other lines had similar, if less flamboyant, ones, so perhaps a semi-freelance design, based on the same  principles as the Brighton used, but with alternative lookouts such as side duckets or perhaps a birdcage, might find favour.

 

As for further LBSC coaches, is it possible to avoid too much duplication?  I suspect many modellers will have already stocked up on Branchlines and Roxey kits, if they are Brighton fans, and, in fact, Worsley Works have already produced side and end etchings for all the rest of the purpose-built railmotor coaches. Perhaps the balloon coaches that were converted to pull-push use after Grouping might be a more fertile area, since the Mallard range hardly scratched the surface of the wide variety of the Balloon Carriages, which tended to be built in very small batches. Maybe even the City Limited please? Similarly with the Craven coaches, as 5&9 already have quite a range available, which have been augented by some recent etchings from EBM, and as they supply the fittings needed to complete your kits, it might be seen as biting the hand that feeds you.

 

For my part, I would welcome 48' and 54' Brighton bogie coaches.

 

I am fairly confident that I will be able to make coaches to a reasonable quality using Linny's kits, and I know I can afford a couple of 4-5 coach rakes in this medium. I can also afford the odd catastrophic mistake!

 

I cannot say any of this with regard to the traditional etched brass alternatives. however. For me, it wouldn't be duplication.

 

With regard to the Cravens, I looked at the Hayling Island coaches.  I recall I could identified the types, but, IIRC, did not see them among the types produced by 5&9 Models (which I am more comfortable in trying).  I think there is virgin territory for Craven, but forgive me if I have this wrong, I have not researched this to any extent!

 

I think balloon trailers are a must - IIRC, between 1906-1910, pretty much all surviving Terriers were given over to motor train work. The necessary companions for an umber Terrier.

  

I agree about the railmotor; not worth investing time in until a means of producing the motive power unit is identified.  With the sole exception of the LNWR railmotor, all companies seem to have small and fiddly valve gear, making them some of the less accessible prototypes for many of us.

[sem34090]

Unfortunately price is relevant when you are skint.

 

Brass coaches are lovely - If you can afford a rake of five Billinton 48ft bogies from Roxey then that's loverlay. 

 

Unfortunately for a fair few of us here the cost of an etched kit is offputting, not just because we don't all have the money, but because we feel we're going to c0ck it up all too easily and be £30< out of pocket, which is a lot when you haven't got it.

[Regularity]

Unfortunately price is relevant when you are skint.

 

Price is only relevant to what you are using as your starting point.

 

It is irrelevant to the finished model: that is the result of the workmanship that goes into it.

 

Money allows you to start from a different place, in effect you spend the money to save time. A good etched brass kit for a coach (for example) means that in the hands of an experienced worker a model of quality can be produced more quickly than if starting from raw materials, but that very experience that turned a good kit into a superb model came through time and mistakes.

 

This is only a problem if you have neither time nor money, in which distressing circumstances model railways are not likely to feature high on your list of priorities.

 

As I said, what a model is made from is not the issue. How much care goes into producing the model is. Learning to cut close to a line and file an edge smooth and true is a core skill that does not come in a kit, and can only be acquired and honed through doing it again and again and again. Some are able to acquire this with less practice, it seems, but there is no excuse for not practicing until you are confident with basic tools and materials. People decide that they “can’t” do something a long while before they have had a chance to train themselves, and ergo they “lack the ability”. It’s true. They do lack the ability. As long as that’s the ability to persevere even if it takes a lot longer than expected.

 

I am not sure what the issue is here. You seem to be finding fault with someone who fundamentally agrees with you. Be careful: having typed this, I wonder why I bothered to take the time to do that. I may not do so again.

[Edwardian]

Guys, trust me on this; price is relevant when you're skint!

[BlueLightning]

I think the biggest and most important point here, that everyone seems to be missing is:

 

Linny is making these carriages for Linny!! The fact we can buy them is a bonus!! Maybe the reason there are so few new small manufacturers is stuff like this, so how about we all let Linny get on with it. If you don't want to buy them you don't have too, I have a wish list I would love to give Linny, I however will not as this is not why Linny is doing it!!!

 

and I'm out,

 

Gary

[Edwardian]

Linny is making these carriages for Linny!!

 

Don't tell Linny that!

 

Not when Linny is so successful at making coaches for me!

[Skinnylinny]

Don't tell Linny that!

 

Not when Linny is so successful at making coaches for me!

 

Don't worry, the Billinton Bogies will happen! I just need to get the Push-Pull set done, then they and the second horsebox are the next 4mm scale jobs on the list...

[Edwardian]

Don't worry, the Billinton Bogies will happen! I just need to get the Push-Pull set done, then they and the second horsebox are the next 4mm scale jobs on the list...

 

You star!

 

Thank you.

[Skinnylinny]

I now have the laser cutter reliably engraving (!) the thin card I use, which gives me the ability to have textured door vents, and to engrave the door edges.

 

 

The beading on the ends of the coaches will, as mentioned above, be available either plain or with card representations of the alarm gear. Having assembled this, it *is* possible but it is rather fiddly. Some may prefer to produce their own from bits of wire and plasticard, but I'll probably still include it (assuming there's space to spare on the cards), as it doesn't look too shabby and it only appears on coach ends that are butting up against either another coach or the bunker of the P.

 

 

Put the two bits above together on a coach and the result is not bad at all!

 

 

[sem34090]

Bloomin' marvellous!

[Compound2632]

That panelling doily is really fine - it looks better than the photos I've seen of Silhouette-cut panelling but I've not seen either in the flesh. I'd be interested to see how well round-cornered panelling turns out.

 

I assume that laser cutting isn't a suitable technique to for plasticard?

[Skinnylinny]

Laser cutting sadly won't work with plasticard - it melts rather than cutting. It does manage curved paneling quite well - have a look back at my Stroudley coaches. The cutter manages curves down to about 1/4mm diameter quite happily (I used those for the droplights)

 

The end paneling on the Stroudleys comes out even thinner at about 0.3mm wide (Vs 0.6mm on these SECR ones.

Edited June 10, 2018 by Skinnylinny