Another lets have ago at Virgin

[royaloak]

The paper tickets are just an indication that that seat (s) is reserved.

The one you have with you is the one that matters, if of course you do have it with you

 

The situation you described with a replacement train is somewhat awkward though  - One hopes good sense will prevail....... Mind you the seats on HSTs are all laid out the same in each coach as far as I know.

Try sorting it all out on a 150 when the reservations were for a 158!!

If you just take the TS vehicles, there are 3 different seat arrangements in GWR HST sets.

[Dunsignalling]

The paper tickets are just an indication that that seat (s) is reserved.

The one you have with you is the one that matters, if of course you do have it with you

 

The situation you described with a replacement train is somewhat awkward though  - One hopes good sense will prevail....... Mind you the seats on HSTs are all laid out the same in each coach as far as I know.

Try sorting it all out on a 150 when the reservations were for a 158!!

A friend of mine had an odd experience on a GWR HST out of Paddington a few weeks ago. The coach (D, I think) that he had a reservation in, wasn't in the train, presumably having been taken out for attention.

 

He, and everyone else similarly affected, was suddenly and unexpectedly looking for a seat in an already fairly full train for a 2-hour-plus journey. Confusion ruled, and my pal has certain health issues that kick in if he has to stand for a long time. Fortunately, he cottoned on quickly to what had happened and managed to snap up the last unoccupied and unreserved seat in C.

 

John

Edited February 14, 2018 by Dunsignalling

[woodenhead]

That may be the rule (it would be nice to see it written somewhere).

 

However the impression staff have generally given when I've been on a train without the tickets on seats is that reservations are not applicable.

 

They will often say something like "There are no reservations on the train" rather than apologise for the lack of reservation tickets on the seats.

I don't think I've ever heard an announcement to say that people should give up their seats to someone who can show a reservation for them.

Generally when they haven't been able to apply the reservations I've heard the conductor/guard ask people to sit in their allocated seats to avoid more confusion.  Going to Warley I got a Bournemouth train from Manchester, unfortunately, the reservations loaded were for some other service with very odd journeys booked versus the service we were on - the guard apologised and asked we sit in our allocated seating, he repeated this several times before departure and during other stops as the service being a Saturday was full.

[caradoc]

In theory the problem with missing reservation tickets on trains should be solved by electronic displays such as those on Voyagers and Pendolinos, which (although difficult to read from any distance) cannot be removed or tampered with by passengers, and which should be able to be applied in an instant, even where a last minute set change has occurred. I say in theory, however, because I have lost count of the number of times I have joined a Pendolino at Glasgow Central where the reservations have not downloaded, meaning sitting in a seat with no idea if it has been reserved or not (being fortunate enough to have a staff pass, I never reserve a seat for myself). And if the reservations do then download, they cannot be seen while seated ! To be fair, the Senior Conductors do always make suitable announcements when these scenarios occur.

[woodenhead]

Maybe it is time to bring some glamour back to the railways, lets abandon this Ryanair free for all when you all pile onto a train and perhaps the train companies could call people on based on their seat allocations.

 

"Will all passengers with seat reservations in Coach A rows 16-31 please now come to the boarding gate" 

 

It's odd how we put up with this on most flights but when it comes to trains we all crush in and wouldn't contemplate a more selective approach to boarding - it would play havoc with scheduling though and would never work in practice

[Talltim]

All this could be solved with a couple of attendants per coach ...

[caradoc]

If people think fares are high now, wait till they have to pay for that level of service !

[Coryton]

Generally when they haven't been able to apply the reservations I've heard the conductor/guard ask people to sit in their allocated seats to avoid more confusion.  Going to Warley I got a Bournemouth train from Manchester, unfortunately, the reservations loaded were for some other service with very odd journeys booked versus the service we were on - the guard apologised and asked we sit in our allocated seating, he repeated this several times before departure and during other stops as the service being a Saturday was full.

 

Cross-country I presume?

 

I've heard that sort of announcement on Cross-Country (once, but then I rarely use them) but it didn't go so far as to say that reservations were still in force and that people were required to give up a seat to someone who could wave an appropriate reservation at them.

 

(On this occasion the train wasn't the expected length and the computerised reservation couldn't cope).

 

Maybe it is time to bring some glamour back to the railways, lets abandon this Ryanair free for all when you all pile onto a train and perhaps the train companies could call people on based on their seat allocations.

 

It's odd how we put up with this on most flights but when it comes to trains we all crush in and wouldn't contemplate a more selective approach to boarding - it would play havoc with scheduling though and would never work in practice

 

Indeed - it would be very hard to make this work for trains.

 

Then again...in Japan I've seen nice painted queuing areas on the platform for each door of a train so everyone is neatly in the right place when the train does arrive.

 

On the other hand, in China on a long distance train with an attendant at the door of each coach, I've seen an absolute free-for-all with people pushing and shoving to get through the doors despite the fact that all tickets come with a reservation (although in some cases, as with mine, it only entitled you to stand up in a particular carriage).

 

I was particularly amused by a journey from New York to Toronto and back some years ago. At New York it was a free for all as soon as the platform was announced ("reserved" in Amtrak parlance means you're entitled to a seat somewhere*, but not a particular one). At Toronto, for the return journey, it was made very clear where one should queue and once the train was ready to board people headed to the train in an orderly fashion.

 

* Except that like airlines they overbook but unlike airlines they let you on even though there aren't enough seats...

[rab]

Maybe it is time to bring some glamour back to the railways, lets abandon this Ryanair free for all when you all pile onto a train and perhaps the train companies could call people on based on their seat allocations.

 

"Will all passengers with seat reservations in Coach A rows 16-31 please now come to the boarding gate" 

 

It's odd how we put up with this on most flights but when it comes to trains we all crush in and wouldn't contemplate a more selective approach to boarding - it would play havoc with scheduling though and would never work in practice

Don't think many people would put up

with airline waiting times for trains.

[Reorte]

Don't think many people would put up

with airline waiting times for trains.

Some time in the future - your train is now half an hour faster. Now wait around for two hours before you can board it.

[Coryton]

Some time in the future - your train is now half an hour faster. Now wait around for two hours before you can board it.

 

Like Eurostar?

 

(Trains got faster with CTRL, overall journey times went went up when the check-in times were increased to allow stricter security...)

[ForestPines]

At Toronto, for the return journey, it was made very clear where one should queue and once the train was ready to board people headed to the train in an orderly fashion.

I recall Kings Cross, before the last rebuild, had lettered queuing points marked on the concourse, complete with shaded floor tiles indicating where the queuers should stand. It was greatly frustrating on my first visit, when I was only 5, but I can see how it was probably useful on a station with many passengers and little space for them to circulate in.

[Coryton]

I recall Kings Cross, before the last rebuild, had lettered queuing points marked on the concourse, complete with shaded floor tiles indicating where the queuers should stand. It was greatly frustrating on my first visit, when I was only 5, but I can see how it was probably useful on a station with many passengers and little space for them to circulate in.

 

I'd forgotten that. Quite an unusual arrangement.

[The Stationmaster]

Like Eurostar?

 

(Trains got faster with CTRL, overall journey times went went up when the check-in times were increased to allow stricter security...)

 

Not quite correct.  the only reasons security check times will change is either because of the capacity to carry them out (not as good at St Pancras as it was at Waterloo) or if Transec (or whatever they are now called) change their requirements for checks.  Apart from St Pancras being much less efficient at passenger handling that Waterloo - hence increased minimum turnround times in London for Eurostar trains - I would think it's a reasonable assumption that various terrorist incidents will have changed Transec's requirements and if they have done what  I would logically expect them to do it will take longer.

[The Stationmaster]

I'd forgotten that. Quite an unusual arrangement.

Although even into the late 1960s it also used to happen at Paddington. (Great way for certain folk to make Saturday overtime as a group were regularly recruited each Summer for the sole purpose of going along each queue and asking people why they were in that particular queue - those who thought they were queueing for a cuppa at the buffet were those most commonly found to have misled themselves!).

[Coryton]

Not quite correct.  the only reasons security check times will change is either because of the capacity to carry them out (not as good at St Pancras as it was at Waterloo) or if Transec (or whatever they are now called) change their requirements for checks.  Apart from St Pancras being much less efficient at passenger handling that Waterloo - hence increased minimum turnround times in London for Eurostar trains - I would think it's a reasonable assumption that various terrorist incidents will have changed Transec's requirements and if they have done what  I would logically expect them to do it will take longer.

 

I wasn't meaning to imply that the two were related - I'm pretty sure the check-in times were increased while trains were still using Waterloo.

 

But it did seem a shame that a fair chunk of the time saved very expensively by building a new railway line was lost by increased check in times. (Of course the new line also increases capacity, but - like HS2 - that's not how it was sold).

 

An obvious change was requiring all passengers to go through the security checks rather than some being waved past.

[The Stationmaster]

I wasn't meaning to imply that the two were related - I'm pretty sure the check-in times were increased while trains were still using Waterloo.

 

But it did seem a shame that a fair chunk of the time saved very expensively by building a new railway line was lost by increased check in times. (Of course the new line also increases capacity, but - like HS2 - that's not how it was sold).

 

An obvious change was requiring all passengers to go through the security checks rather than some being waved past.

 

The new line does indeed create capacity - but of course St Pancras can't handle that capacity.  When I was working with a signal engineer on the signalling for the original version of the new St Pancras I questioned certain parts of he specification as it was clear they would be impossible to meet on even the original Eurostar turnround times but the client (Union Railways) told us we had to work to those specs.

[Coryton]

The new line does indeed create capacity - but of course St Pancras can't handle that capacity.  When I was working with a signal engineer on the signalling for the original version of the new St Pancras I questioned certain parts of he specification as it was clear they would be impossible to meet on even the original Eurostar turnround times but the client (Union Railways) told us we had to work to those specs.

 

I was thinking more of the capacity freed up on the existing network than creating more capacity for trains using the tunnel.