Comparison of features between ESU systems

[daveo2002]

 

If you can offer advice or information about the two ECoS DCC systems, please enlighten me!

I am looking at the differences between ESU ECoS and their new CabControl system (or PIKO equivalent). I currently run DC and am interested in making the switch to DCC. Approaching this as a novice trying to grasp the choices, is there anyone who could provide a comparison please?

 

I have read the user manuals for both 50210 and 50310 systems. The obvious difference is price, and the more so if one was looking to add a handheld controller to the ECoS as now seems possible. I am still unclear about the functionality though, specifically...

 

BASIC CONTROL

(a) The 50210 can keep 10 locos running simoultaneously. Can the 50310 run more than that?

The manual suggests unlimited locos if power etc is adequate.

(b) How important are the 28 functions controlled in the 50310 compared with the 20 in the 50210?

© Does the 50210 have any advantages in terms of programming decoders?

 

CONNECTIVITY

(d) Do the two systems have the same kind of scope to link with a PC for route control or automation?

(e) How necessary are the 5(?) ECoS extend DINS in the 50210 over the 2 DINS featured in the 50310?

(f) Accepting that the 50310 has an LNET port which is currently enabled, what benefit could this port add in the future?

 

LAYOUT CONTROL

(g) Without a PC linked, can the 50310 do DCC points neatly? E.g. Can it control routes and provide a visual map for the point/signal accessories?

(h) Similarly, without a PC linked, can the 50310 control a shuttle loco as the 50210 does?

(i) And also on that note, can the 50310 control a turntable as the 50210 does?

 

(k) Finally, with a PC connected and doing fancy clever bits, does the 50210 offer any advantage - or the 50310 any limitation?

 

Too many questions I know but to be honest any insight would be super useful.

Thank you.

[GoingUnderground]

If you can offer advice or information about the two ECoS DCC systems, please enlighten me!

I am looking at the differences between ESU ECoS and their new CabControl system (or PIKO equivalent). I currently run DC and am interested in making the switch to DCC. Approaching this as a novice trying to grasp the choices, is there anyone who could provide a comparison please?

 

I have read the user manuals for both 50210 and 50310 systems. The obvious difference is price, and the more so if one was looking to add a handheld controller to the ECoS as now seems possible. I am still unclear about the functionality though, specifically...

 

BASIC CONTROL

(a) The 50210 can keep 10 locos running simoultaneously. Can the 50310 run more than that?

The manual suggests unlimited locos if power etc is adequate.

(b) How important are the 28 functions controlled in the 50310 compared with the 20 in the 50210?

© Does the 50210 have any advantages in terms of programming decoders?

 

CONNECTIVITY

(d) Do the two systems have the same kind of scope to link with a PC for route control or automation?

(e) How necessary are the 5(?) ECoS extend DINS in the 50210 over the 2 DINS featured in the 50310?

(f) Accepting that the 50310 has an LNET port which is currently enabled, what benefit could this port add in the future?

 

LAYOUT CONTROL

(g) Without a PC linked, can the 50310 do DCC points neatly? E.g. Can it control routes and provide a visual map for the point/signal accessories?

(h) Similarly, without a PC linked, can the 50310 control a shuttle loco as the 50210 does?

(i) And also on that note, can the 50310 control a turntable as the 50210 does?

 

(k) Finally, with a PC connected and doing fancy clever bits, does the 50210 offer any advantage - or the 50310 any limitation?

 

Too many questions I know but to be honest any insight would be super useful.

Thank you.

 

Firstly, there is only one ECoS. Cabcontrol is never referred to an an "ECoS", even though most of us ECoS owners suspect that buried somewhere inside the CabControl base unit is the guts of the ECoS operating system or firmware.

 

I have the 50200 model, better known as the ECoS 2 and also the older black & white 50000 model, the ECoS 1. As they all operate equivalent versions of the ECoS firmware they are functionally identical to the latest ECoS 2.1, the 50210.

 

The CabControl is only on sale in the USA, Canada, and I think Australia. But, of course that doesn't stop anyone anywhere in the world buying one via the internet, provided the seller in N. America (or Oz) will sell them one.

 

The Cab Control is ESU's own version of the SmartControl Elemente (original version) that they make for Piko. Smartcontrol is on sale in Europe, including the UK.

 

I've looked through the CabControl manual, and as far as i can see, it and the Smartcontrol have more limitations than the ECoS.

 

Firstly, the ECoS has 2 controllers and the 7 inch LCD display. it can control all functions up t F27, or is it 28, I can't remember as i don't have any locos that go up that far. So ignore the up to F20, the manual is 4 years out of date, even though it is the latest English language version.

 

CabControl is really intended to control a single loco at a time, whereas the ECoS gives near instantaneous control of up to 5 locos per  cab/throttle, i.e. 10 locos.

 

Powering an unlimited number of locos? No I don't think so for either of them. the latest ECoS puts out 5 amps to the track, and I think so does the CabControl.. If your locos, carriage lights, accessory decoders, etc need more than that then you'll need a booster for either of them. You'll also need another brain to keep tabs on them all.

 

The ECoS will give much better control over programming decoders simply because of the larger screen.

 

ECoS also allows you to upload up to 240 thumbnails ( icons ) of your locos to your ECoS, There are over 10,000 such icons available to ECoS users, admttedly with many duplicates. CabControl limits you to its own built in icons, which are the same as the default/built in icons for the ECoS as far as I know.

 

ECoS has 3 (not 5) ECoSLink DIN sockets that you use for connecting ECoSBoost boosters, ECoSDetector modues, and the L.Net loconet throttle 7 occupancy detector adapter module. It can also be used to connect a very limited number of external throttles, a FRED or a now long sinc discontinued Maerklin hand throttle, sorry I can't remember the Maerklipart number, but you'd be lucky to find one.

 

If you need more than 3 ECoSLink ports, then you buy a ECoSLink Terminal module that plugs in to the ECoSLink Extend port and you connect the extra ECoSLink modules to the Terminal. You may need more ECoSLink Terminals if you want to site the modules more than a couple of feet away from the ECoS. The fifth DIN socket marked AUX is reserved for future use, and currently does nothing. You would also have to use ECoSLink Terminals with CabControl, subject to the same linitations as regards placement of modules, once you've used up all its ECosLink ports.

 

ECoS also has additional connectivity options that you haven't mentioned. It has an s88 port which can be used to connect Maerklin s88 modules, which I believe are used for occupancy detection. You can use that simultaneously with ECoSDetector modules. CabControl doesn't have an s88 port. ECoS also has a sniffer port that allows you to connect the track out of another DCC system to give you extra throttles. CabControl doesn't have a sniffer port.

 

The L.Net port on CabControl is, I believe currently NOT enabled, I hear that there are copyright issues over its use. I don't know if the L.Net module can be used in its place. ECoS needed a firmware update before it could use L.Net, but that oly applied to older ECoS models release before L.Net went o nsale. All new ECoS can sue the L.Net module out of the box. 

 

As far as i know, there s no equivalent of the ECoS's track plan diagram on the CabControl, You have to operate points from a list. 

 

CabControl can't do turntable control. ECoS only does it with a Maerklin turntable or equivalent as far as I know.

 

I don't think that CabControl offers shuttle train operation, whereas ECoS can control up to 6 shuttle trains simultaneously.

 

You can control an ECoS remotely from a laptop or tablet with a VNC client. The client puts a copy of the ECoS screen on your laptop or tablet, and if it has a touch screen you can contrl it as if you were touching the ECoS's screen itself. The ECoS needs to be connected to your home network, as does the tablet or laptop. or tablet. VNCclients are available often for free, for Windows iOS, OSX, Linux, and I think Android as well. Here's a photo of my laptop running a VNC client and projecting the screen to a 26 inch TV.

And here's a shot of a 7 inch tablet also running a VNC client, with a Mobile Control 2 handset linked to my ECoS as an extra throttle, as used by the CabControl/Smartcontrol next to it.

And another showing the ECoS track plan diagram on the tablet, and you can operate the points from the tablet.

The VNC client only lets you see and do what's on the ECoS's own screen. You can't, as yet, have one screen on the ECoS and a different one on the VNC client. 

 

The loco icons you see on the Mobile Control handset come from the ECoS, that's why it shows the London Underground S Stock icon as I uploaded that icon to my ECoS, and when I select that loco on the MV2 it displays the same icon as is linked to that loco in the ECoS. when used wit hthe CabControl the MC2 handset can only show the default CabControl loco icons. you can't upload ECoS icons to the MC2 handset on its own. 

 

ECoS is a multiprotocol digital system and can control not just locos with DCC decoders, but also ones with Maerklin MM and mfx ( equivalent to what ESU calls its M4 protcol, and also the old Trix Selectrix protocol) decoders simultaneously, provided the decoders don't get confused. CabControl does DCC only.

 

If you want a fixed console type controller, and can afford it, then my advice would be to go for the ECoS.

 

But whatever you do, go and try an ECoS and a SmartControl or CabControl first before you buy anything. What I like, you might hate.

 

ECoS and CabControl are not cheap, so whatever you do, don't buy in haste and repent at leisure. I did that with my first DCC controller with which I became dissatisfied, and replaced it with my first ECoS after a hands on session with various other DCC controllers. For me, ECoS is like an H&M Duette, but in colour and on steroids.

 

If youbuy a CabControl, and later decide to get an ECoS, you cannot use the CabControl base unit with an ECoS as an extra booster. but you could in theory use the handset with an ECoS instead of with the CabControl base unit. But I don't know of anyone who has done that.

Edited April 5, 2018 by GoingUnderground

[Ron Ron Ron]

Welcome to the forum.

Where do you live, because the CabControl system is only available in North America (and possibly Australia?) at the present time?

Hopefully it will be made available in European countries in due course.

 

As far as I can tell, it only differs from the Piko SmartControl in having a higher track power rating (CabControl 7 amp as opposed to SmartControl's 5 amps).

 

I'll try and answer your questions the best I can.

I'm open to correction if I've got it wrong.

(n.b. I'm a SmartControl owner, but it's been sat in its box for 3 months now).

 

 

 

BASIC CONTROL

(a) The 50210 can keep 10 locos running simoultaneously. Can the 50310 run more than that?   - I need to confirm it, but I don't think there's any difference in capability.
The manual suggests unlimited locos if power etc is adequate.
(b) How important are the 28 functions controlled in the 50310 compared with the 20 in the 50210?    -  50210 ECoS an also access 28 functions.
© Does the 50210 have any advantages in terms of programming decoders?    - More display screen Realestate, to display more options and fields at once.

CONNECTIVITY
(d) Do the two systems have the same kind of scope to link with a PC for route control or automation?      - Yes, the CabControl & SmartControl work with the same software packages as the ECoS.
(e) How necessary are the 5(?) ECoS extend DINS in the 50210 over the 2 DINS featured in the 50310?   - Just more ECoSLink sockets are included on the ECoS. If you want more on the CabControl, these can be added via an ECoSLink Terminal.
(f) Accepting that the 50310 has an LNET port which is currently enabled, what benefit could this port add in the future?   - The ability to connect with LocoNet devices e.g. Digitrax and Uhlenbrock handsets.

LAYOUT CONTROL
(g) Without a PC linked, can the 50310 do DCC points neatly? E.g. Can it control routes and provide a visual map for the point/signal accessories?   - CabControl has switch panels to control accessories. The CabControl Android app lacks the layout diagram capability. In theory, a third party app could provide this. 

(h) Similarly, without a PC linked, can the 50310 control a shuttle loco as the 50210 does?   - No shuttle feature.
(i) And also on that note, can the 50310 control a turntable as the 50210 does?    - I stand to be corrected... the ECoS turntable control functionality appears not to be available on the CabControl.

(k) Finally, with a PC connected and doing fancy clever bits, does the 50210 offer any advantage - or the 50310 any limitation?  - Well if it's PC software doing the fancy clever bits, I guess both systems will work with it just the same.

 

 

The ECoS and CabControl are basically the same core system, but the ECoS has more features.

 

..

Edited April 5, 2018 by Ron Ron Ron

[GoingUnderground]

ESU's website saus that CsbControl is available in Australia, but only through their USA brsnch.

[peterfgf]

Firstly, there is only one ECoS. Cabcontrol is never referred to an an "ECoS", even though most of us ECoS owners suspect that buried somewhere inside the CabControl base unit is the guts of the ECoS operating system or firmware.

 

I have the 50200 model, better known as the ECoS 2 and also the older black & white 50000 model, the ECoS 1. As they all operate equivalent versions of the ECoS firmware they are functionally identical to the latest ECoS 2.1, the 50210.

 

The CabControl is only on sale in the USA, Canada, and I think Australia. But, of course that doesn't stop anyone anywhere in the world buying one via the internet, provided the seller in N. America (or Oz) will sell them one.

 

The Cab Control is ESU's own version of the SmartControl Elemente (original version) that they make for Piko. Smartcontrol is on sale in Europe, including the UK.

 

I've looked through the CabControl manual, and as far as i can see, it and the Smartcontrol have more limitations than the ECoS.

 

Firstly, the ECoS has 2 controllers and the 7 inch LCD display. it can control all functions up t F27, or is it 28, I can't remember as i don't have any locos that go up that far. So ignore the up to F20, the manual is 4 years out of date, even though it is the latest English language version.

 

CabControl is really intended to control a single loco at a time, whereas the ECoS gives near instantaneous control of up to 5 locos per  cab/throttle, i.e. 10 locos.

 

Powering an unlimited number of locos? No I don't think so for either of them. the latest ECoS puts out 5 amps to the track, and I think so does the CabControl.. If your locos, carriage lights, accessory decoders, etc need more than that then you'll need a booster for either of them. You'll also need another brain to keep tabs on them all.

 

The ECoS will give much better control over programming decoders simply because of the larger screen.

 

ECoS also allows you to upload up to 240 thumbnails ( icons ) of your locos to your ECoS, There are over 10,000 such icons available to ECoS users, admttedly with many duplicates. CabControl limits you to its own built in icons, which are the same as the default/built in icons for the ECoS as far as I know.

 

ECoS has 3 (not 5) ECoSLink DIN sockets that you use for connecting ECoSBoost boosters, ECoSDetector modues, and the L.Net loconet throttle 7 occupancy detector adapter module. It can also be used to connect a very limited number of external throttles, a FRED or a now long sinc discontinued Maerklin hand throttle, sorry I can't remember the Maerklipart number, but you'd be lucky to find one.

 

If you need more than 3 ECoSLink ports, then you buy a ECoSLink Terminal module that plugs in to the ECoSLink Extend port and you connect the extra ECoSLink modules to the Terminal. You may need more ECoSLink Terminals if you want to site the modules more than a couple of feet away from the ECoS. The fifth DIN socket marked AUX is reserved for future use, and currently does nothing. You would also have to use ECoSLink Terminals with CabControl, subject to the same linitations as regards placement of modules, once you've used up all its ECosLink ports.

 

ECoS also has additional connectivity options that you haven't mentioned. It has an s88 port which can be used to connect Maerklin s88 modules, which I believe are used for occupancy detection. You can use that simultaneously with ECoSDetector modules. CabControl doesn't have an s88 port. ECoS also has a sniffer port that allows you to connect the track out of another DCC system to give you extra throttles. CabControl doesn't have a sniffer port.

 

The L.Net port on CabControl is, I believe currently NOT enabled, I hear that there are copyright issues over its use. I don't know if the L.Net module can be used in its place. ECoS needed a firmware update before it could use L.Net, but that oly applied to older ECoS models release before L.Net went o nsale. All new ECoS can sue the L.Net module out of the box. 

 

As far as i know, there s no equivalent of the ECoS's track plan diagram on the CabControl, You have to operate points from a list. 

 

CabControl can't do turntable control. ECoS only does it with a Maerklin turntable or equivalent as far as I know.

 

I don't think that CabControl offers shuttle train operation, whereas ECoS can control up to 6 shuttle trains simultaneously.

 

You can control an ECoS remotely from a laptop or tablet with a VNC client. The client puts a copy of the ECoS screen on your laptop or tablet, and if it has a touch screen you can contrl it as if you were touching the ECoS's screen itself. The ECoS needs to be connected to your home network, as does the tablet or laptop. or tablet. VNCclients are available often for free, for Windows iOS, OSX, Linux, and I think Android as well. Here's a photo of my laptop running a VNC client and projecting the screen to a 26 inch TV.

TV & Laptop.JPG

And here's a shot of a 7 inch tablet also running a VNC client, with a Mobile Control 2 handset linked to my ECoS as an extra throttle, as used by the CabControl/Smartcontrol next to it.

MC2 & Tablet 2.jpg

And another showing the ECoS track plan diagram on the tablet, and you can operate the points from the tablet.

MC2 & Tablet 1.jpg

The VNC client only lets you see and do what's on the ECoS's own screen. You can't, as yet, have one screen on the ECoS and a different one on the VNC client. 

 

The loco icons you see on the Mobile Control handset come from the ECoS, that's why it shows the London Underground S Stock icon as I uploaded that icon to my ECoS, and when I select that loco on the MV2 it displays the same icon as is linked to that loco in the ECoS. when used wit hthe CabControl the MC2 handset can only show the default CabControl loco icons. you can't upload ECoS icons to the MC2 handset on its own. 

 

ECoS is a multiprotocol digital system and can control not just locos with DCC decoders, but also ones with Maerklin MM and mfx ( equivalent to what ESU calls its M4 protcol, and also the old Trix Selectrix protocol) decoders simultaneously, provided the decoders don't get confused. CabControl does DCC only.

 

If you want a fixed console type controller, and can afford it, then my advice would be to go for the ECoS.

 

But whatever you do, go and try an ECoS and a SmartControl or CabControl first before you buy anything. What I like, you might hate.

 

ECoS and CabControl are not cheap, so whatever you do, don't buy in haste and repent at leisure. I did that with my first DCC controller with which I became dissatisfied, and replaced it with my first ECoS after a hands on session with various other DCC controllers. For me, ECoS is like an H&M Duette, but in colour and on steroids.

 

If youbuy a CabControl, and later decide to get an ECoS, you cannot use the CabControl base unit with an ECoS as an extra booster. but you could in theory use the handset with an ECoS instead of with the CabControl base unit. But I don't know of anyone who has done that.

Thank you for a very informative article.

Peterfgf

[GoingUnderground]

An update on the number of loco icons for the ECoS. There are over 16,000, not 10,000, covering locos, carriages, trams, etc., from all over the world. If you csn photograph it and can edit the image to the required dimensions, then you can have it on your ECoS. The S Stock that you see on the photos that I included in my earlier post are photos that took at home and edited of the Bachmann model. But it could be of the actual 1:1 loco such as mine of the Metropolitan MetroVic Bo-Bo Sarah Siddons.

[daveo2002]

Thank you for the replies gentlemen, very much appreciated.

 

I live in the UK, West Midlands. I will definitely heed your advice to try first - these are so expensive - and I am not in any mad hurry.

 

Money no object, the 50210 together with laptop, tablet and handheld throttle looks a tough act to beat and I like the idea of starting with the 50210 and slowly adding the extra kit. More fun and less intimidating than getting various new boxes and 3rd party software talking from the outset. I also like the idea of having a core unit which can do most of everything. That seems a more resilient prospect,long term, than (for example) a 50310 aided by laptop and 3rd party software. It would be frustrating to have railway time interrupted by windows updates or future software incompatibility. Although I accept a competent Microsoft customer would probably not have too many problems there. 

 

Thank you again for the information. I hadn't appreciated how much development ESU had continued to make to the 50210. The photographs are inspiration to continue saving a few more half crowns.

 

David

[GoingUnderground]

If you're thinking of buying an ECoS, go to the ESU website, click on the support tab, and then on Tips & Tricks. On the Tips & Tricks page you will find an item labelled ECoS. Click on that and you will find s series of articles on how to use the features of the ECoS introduced since the publication of the most recent manual.

 

ESU release between 1 and 3 updated versions per year of the ECoS firmware, which is its operating programme, or "app" as it might be called these days. The updated versions fix bugs, and add new features or capabilities. For instance user created loco icons was added in firmware 3.3.0, and the remote control capability in firmware 4.0.0.

 

The latest firmware version is 4.2.2, which was released in January this year. Users install the updates themselves at home, using a computer to download the updated firmware from the ESU website, and then connect their ECoS to the computer and inststall the update from their web browser.

 

There is no fixed frequency or cycle for these firmware updates.

 

I would imagine that ESU will have a similar firmware update plan for the CabControl base unit, the "ICU" as it seems to use much of the ECoS firmware. The update process is a little different, as according to the CabControl manual, any new firmware for the CabControl base unit would have to be downloaded on to a USB memory stick and installed from there. The CabControl handset is a Mobile Control 2, ("MC2") handset. It is a handheld Android tablet with built in WiFi which has a powered throttle knob. Updating the MC2 handset is done either via a PC, or I believe updates are available via the Google Play store.

 

I see you say that you're in the West Midlands, so if you wanted a CabControl you would have to try to buy a CabControl over the internet from a US or Canadian retailer, or buy a Piko SmartControl Elemente from a UK or continental Europe retailer. Piko have announced a new SmartControl Lite which is a totally different and cheaper product to the original SmartControl, now called SmartControl Elemente.

 

Please be aware that once you buy a main DCC controller, you will tend to be tied in to its makers peripherals, and ESU is no exception. In addition to ESU's ECoSBoost boosters snd ECoSDetector occupancy detection modules which use the ECoSLink ports, you can use peripherals that use s88, and additional boosters from other makes, and if you get the L.Net module you csn also use Loconet throttles and occupancy detection, with ECoS. But you can't use peripherals that use Xbus oe Xpressnet to connect to a base unit as there is NO ECoSLink adapter module that would allow them to connect to an ECoS, or CabControl, or SmartControl.

 

All loco and accessory decoders should work without problems with ECoS and CabControl/SmartControl. You may have see reports of problems with Hornby TTS decoders with ECoS, but the fault seems to be with certain batches of the TTS decoders as the same problems have been reported by folks who use other makes of DCC controllers as well, and were cured by sending the decoders back to Hornby to have their firmware changed.

Edited April 7, 2018 by GoingUnderground

[Phil Bullock]

Dave

 

If you like the add on option another one is to link a wireless router to ECoS to create a network and have an app on a smart device eg JMRI throttle app

 

Works well with our 50210 - a darn sight cheaper that ESU's own hand held throttles

 

CHeers

 

Phil

[Guest]

ESU did verified that the ECoS with the latest version can now handle with 31 functions in the DCC mode.

There is also software for the new Loksound 5.

[daltonparva]

I use my android phone and tablet as 2 remote controls with my ECoS, choice of 2 free downloadable apps.

Edited May 18, 2019 by daltonparva