34theletterbetweenB&D Posted January 19, 2012 Share Posted January 19, 2012 Or 5; If the 3F is a commercial success, more classic British 0-6-0s may follow...! Bang on. The 'wallet vote' is far more significant than wishlist surveys. Provided I have the funds, my intention is to buy the C class too, and any other small 0-6-0 or modest 'black engines' they care to bring out. Bachmann explained their modus operandi in this wise: test a genre with a 'should be popular' type; if it sells, then there can be more. This is where the rubber hits the road for those of us who would really appreciate a good selection of 'small stuff' in RTR. Just so useful for mangling into 'other small stuff' for a start... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
D605Eagle Posted January 19, 2012 Share Posted January 19, 2012 I'd love to buy a few 3Fs and help prove that the small black 0-6-0 is a sale sucess...but Bachmann have got to make the damn things and put them in the Shops first! STILL waiting on me LMS 3F.... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
buffalo Posted January 19, 2012 Share Posted January 19, 2012 Me too! Still, it's my own fault really as I want them to appear in 1950-2 form, BR numbers but with the LMS still on the tenders. Renumbering the LMS version would take longer than putting the LMS transfers on the tender so I should have bought one of the BR versions anyway! Nick Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold papagolfjuliet Posted January 20, 2012 RMweb Gold Share Posted January 20, 2012 As a matter of interest, beyond extending the smokebox (for which it might be possible to butcher a Hornby 'James' body if the measurements are the same) and removing a coal rail from the tender, what would I have to do to a Bachmann 3F in order to turn it into a reasonable fasimile of one of the Midland & Great Northern examples? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
34theletterbetweenB&D Posted January 20, 2012 Share Posted January 20, 2012 Think you are just about there. Get as many photos together as you can, modify with their guidance. Then park it in a siding awaiting repair yet again, and build a J3 or J4 type to actually operate the trains... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Godders Posted January 20, 2012 Share Posted January 20, 2012 I'm tempted to say it is non- DCC sound effects. Seriously though, I wonder if one of the phosphor bronze wiper pickups has run off the wheel edge and into the spokes? Godders as Coachmann said above i had this exact same problem with a Bachmann crab which was brand new & i had that problem it is more than likely the pick up. As for the statements about it running well on DCC i think mine is a complete hulk on dcc i've tried alsorts to make it run sweet but i am finding this troublesome. Simon Thanks Guys Obvious when I was told, runs nicely needs running in and decoder Cheers Godders Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
buffalo Posted February 2, 2012 Share Posted February 2, 2012 It looks like another batch of the LMS version has arrived. Mine came today from Hattons as has been running in on the rollers. It's a very smooth runner and appears to be equally good in either direction. Another piece of good news is that the problem that some have mentioned where the front of the tender body was glued to the chassis does not affect this batch. At least, there was no glue on mine. Nick Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Belgian Posted February 3, 2012 Share Posted February 3, 2012 I remember that when I was a kid my Triang 'Jinty' and 'Nellie' were my favourite engines, despite my having a 'Princess' and another 'big' engine which I can't even remember. The one I really lusted after was the Triang Midland 3F tender engine - a friend had one and I was really jealous! Manufacturers (mainly Hornby/Triang) always seem to have over-estimated the appeal of the big 'glamorous' engines and under-estimated the lure of the little ones: hooray for Bachmann and their attention to the latter - it does mean they have many more suitable prototypes to tackle still. (It's noticable how many discussions about Hornby concentrate on the fact that they are running out of suitable 'glamour' prototypes!) JE Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Phil Posted February 3, 2012 Share Posted February 3, 2012 Of personal interest, a trio of 3Fs apparently spent a very short time at Bescot. 43189, 43760 and 43822 are on the list as allocated to Bescot on 1st January 1960. 43189 is on Jim Grindlay's list as allocated to 9G Northwich in 1959, wdn 11/60 and scapped 01/61 43760 is on Jim Grindlay's list as allocated to 5B Crewe South in 1959, wdn 04/62 and scrapped the same month . 43822 is on Jim Grindlay's list as allocated to 84G Salop in 1959, wdn 08/62 and scrapped 07/63 Cross referencing the Jim Grindlay information with Paul Bolger's BR Steam Motive Power Depots published by Book Law, Paul Bolger lists all three 3Fs as allocated to Bescot in 1959. After some research I have located a photograph taken by local railway historian of 43822 at Walsall. The subject of the camera was actually 70042 standing in Walsall station waiting to back onto the northbound "Pines Express", sometime between 1959 and 1961. Unfortunatley Jack wasn't so hot on dating his photographs, but stood behind 70042 is 43822 on a few wagons, presumably shunting the sidings on the upside of Walsall station. So there it is - proof as much as I am going to find, of 3Fs allocated to Bescot. There is actually another photo of Jack's - a going away shot of a pair of engines lifting a train of slack up the stiff gradient to Birchills power station. The locos are a Midland 3F, an LNWR 7F, brakevan and minerals - suggesting the train had come down from the Cannock line, or from Norton, run round in Walsall, then the assisting loco (3F) tied on the front for the lift up to the power station. Sadly no dates and no loco numbers !!! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jwealleans Posted February 3, 2012 Share Posted February 3, 2012 PGJ - I have asked the same question on here and on the LNER forum and no-one has given a definitive answer. Appearance would suggest that the two are very similar indeed and extending the smokebox would be the most onerous task. However I have not been able to compare major dimensions of the two locos and when I ran the idea past Malcolm Crawley at Wakefield he was quite sceptical. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Nickey Line Posted February 16, 2012 RMweb Gold Share Posted February 16, 2012 I have used the Bachmann 21 pin decoders, cv2 at 1, cv3 and cv4 at 10, cv5 at 30, cv54 at 15 and cv55 at 55. Picks up nicely at shunt speed (F3). I've found that my example runs just fine with back emf turned off - in fact with it on the loco is noisy and jerky, even with emf at minimum impact... am I alone in this? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
34theletterbetweenB&D Posted February 16, 2012 Share Posted February 16, 2012 Probably not. Just go with the settings that work best for the combination you are using. There's quite a lot of variability to be expected in low cost manufacturing, so experiences with the product will vary. Just beware the prescriptive types who believe that because settings x, y and z deliver the goods for them, this must work for everyone. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold TheSignalEngineer Posted February 16, 2012 RMweb Gold Share Posted February 16, 2012 So there it is - proof as much as I am going to find, of 3Fs allocated to Bescot. Don't forget that some were allocated to the old Walsall shed at Ryecroft before it became a DMU depot. They also lurked around Aston, and Saltley had numerous ones including Bachmann's 43762 before it gravitated down Lickey to Bromsgrove. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
bike2steam Posted February 16, 2012 Share Posted February 16, 2012 After some research I have located a photograph taken by local railway historian of 43822 at Walsall. The subject of the camera was actually 70042 standing in Walsall station waiting to back onto the northbound "Pines Express", sometime between 1959 and 1961. Unfortunatley Jack wasn't so hot on dating his photographs, but stood behind 70042 is 43822 on a few wagons, presumably shunting the sidings on the upside of Walsall station. So there it is - proof as much as I am going to find, of 3Fs allocated to Bescot. There is actually another photo of Jack's - a going away shot of a pair of engines lifting a train of slack up the stiff gradient to Birchills power station. The locos are a Midland 3F, an LNWR 7F, brakevan and minerals - suggesting the train had come down from the Cannock line, or from Norton, run round in Walsall, then the assisting loco (3F) tied on the front for the lift up to the power station. Sadly no dates and no loco numbers !!! Phil The far from perfect 'BRdatabase' gives the following dates at Bescot as ;- 43189 2/59 - 6/60 43760 1/59 - 6/61 43822 2/59 - 4/61 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
D605Eagle Posted February 17, 2012 Share Posted February 17, 2012 I've just been fitting extra pcikups to my 3Fs tender...what a nightmare it is to get the tender body off! I cannot see a way of getting the body off without braking off the part that is the small doors and tender hand brake column. Just my sodding luck I managed to wire up the two extra pickups the wrong way round and didn't find out until after I had glued said bit back in...Good job I only used a tiny bit of glue. At least its improved the locos ability to get over dead frogs. Jim Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Downendian Posted February 26, 2012 RMweb Gold Share Posted February 26, 2012 I wish I'd read this before attempting to fit a Bachmann 21 pin decoder today !! I removed the two screws at the rear of the tender as shown in Bachmann's diagram but the front of the tender body would not come apart from the chassis. I thought that the screw at the front of the chassis (which fastens the tender coupling pin) was also fastening the tender body. (WARNING - do NOT undo this screw !!! A supposed captive 10BA nut inside will fall out and it's a b......d of a job to reassemble) I (learning the hard way) undid that screw but the body still refused to come off. As 34C reported in more detail on another forum : ".... tender body removal: it was not as drawn on the service sheet, which shows the front platform of the tender with the railings and brake standard as part of the tender body. The platform proved to be cemented to the tender chassis, and had no connection to the removeable tender body. What happened on mine was that I took the two rear screws out, slightly lifted the rear of the tender while also pulling toward the rear to disengage the hook in lugs at the front. Nothing doing. Slightly more force was applied until there was movement, this enabled by breaking the cement bond securing the platform to the chassis. All easily made good. With small assembly variations, I expect that the body may well disengage on some specimens without dislodging the front platform, but now you know." So,I followed 34C's advice and used force - the tender body did come off but the brake standard platform also fell off. OK I'll have to glue it back on - something I believe I shouldn't have to do now that all new locos are designed to be "DCC Ready" Those who run with DCC and like to keep their models in perfect "as new" condition will be a bit horrifed by this I expect. Again, a beautiful sweet running model but slightly let down for me by the poor tender body design. Ian Ditto - and I'd wished I'd read this thread before starting chip fitting to one of my 3Fs yesterday afternoon, and mistakenly removed all three screws under the tender. Cue copious swearing etc, thankfully I was home alone at the time- must stick to the classic line the guys that install our lab equipment always used to say - did you RTFM? (Did you read the xxxxxxx manual?). The service engineers apparently always referred some customer phone calls as we've got another "didn't RTFM here". Anyhow I digress... The screw to the front of the tender (which adjusts the drawbar) was a pig to get back in, but I worked to a good solution eventually. First I removed the tender top by removing the two rearmost screws- (required gentle but firm wiggling until something "gave"). Then I moved the DCC socket out of the way (one screw) which restricts access the aperture for the captive nut was much more accessible. I held the nut in place with a pin in one hand and attached the 10BA bolt via a bluetacced jewellers screwdriver (another pair of hands would come in handy though). Great care and patience is required not to damage any of the intricate detail on the top of the tender, but job done. I agree with D605 extra tender pickups would help, otherwise performance with a Bachmann 36-554 chip is superb. Neil Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
AMJ Posted February 27, 2012 Share Posted February 27, 2012 I was at the KWVR yesterday and they are having an exclusive done featuring one of these locos that they had on a fund raising special in the early days. Lined splasher and head board included. Due 2012 some time.... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
coachmann Posted March 2, 2012 Share Posted March 2, 2012 Just thought the photos might be of interest to those who wondered if Bachmann might produce the smaller Midland 2F 0-6-0. I've not had the lid off the 3F and so don't know how high the motor is, but the 2F chassis in the foreground shows it would need to be pretty low to allow a 2F body on it. The lower picture shows a 4' 10" 2F and the Bachmann 3F... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
buffalo Posted March 2, 2012 Share Posted March 2, 2012 ...I've not had the lid off the 3F and so don't know how high the motor is... I have a 3F in pieces on the bench. From those photos, Larry, I doubt if it would be possible to fit the current Bachmann motor in a 2F. Ignoring the suppression chokes, the height of the top of the motor is about 22.5mm above the footplate, reducing to 20.5mm for the gearbox over the centre drivers. The motor fills almost all of the space inside the 3F firebox. Nick Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
coachmann Posted March 3, 2012 Share Posted March 3, 2012 I was suprised to discover the 3F is a whopper when seen against the 2F, so Bachmann would have to produce a new chassis. The smaller loco has that 'wow' factor and is a cutie from 00 Works... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
scots region Posted March 3, 2012 Share Posted March 3, 2012 Must... Resist.... pull of supermassive blackhole (midland Railway) too strong Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Belgian Posted March 4, 2012 Share Posted March 4, 2012 Just thought the photos might be of interest to those who wondered if Bachmann might produce the smaller Midland 2F 0-6-0. I've not had the lid off the 3F and so don't know how high the motor is, but the 2F chassis in the foreground shows it would need to be pretty low to allow a 2F body on it. The lower picture shows a 4' 10" 2F and the Bachmann 3F... Looking at your picture, Larry, of the 3F with the chassis alongside, it looks like it might be possible to fit a shorter motor in order to eliminate the 'skirt' under the boiler ahead of the firebox which seems to be the only thing that spoils an otherwise beautiful model. Does that seem feasible to you? (I haven't bought one - yet). JE Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
D605Eagle Posted March 4, 2012 Share Posted March 4, 2012 I was suprised to discover the 3F is a whopper when seen against the 2F, so Bachmann would have to produce a new chassis. The smaller loco has that 'wow' factor and is a cutie from 00 Works... What a massive firebox the 3F has in comparison. Without doubt if Bachmann did do that 2F, even if it ment starting from scratch, I'm sure it would sell well. Did they survive into the BR era? (seems to necessary to stand any chance of a model) Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
45568 Posted March 4, 2012 Share Posted March 4, 2012 Larry, Does the OO Works 2F have tender pick-ups fitted? I cancelled an order for one, but........mmmmmmmmmmmmm! Thanks in advance, cheers, Peter C. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold TheSignalEngineer Posted March 4, 2012 RMweb Gold Share Posted March 4, 2012 Did they survive into the BR era? (seems to necessary to stand any chance of a model) There wiere quite a few Midland 2F 0-6-0s around until the early 1960s. The final one lasted to about 1964. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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