Guidance with DCC controller options

[WIMorrison]

Nigel, I disagree with you view on the apps based products. They will not stop working because the phone or device gets old, they will continue to work exactly as they do at initial release in the same way that a dedicated device will continue to operate even when updated firmware is available.

 

The advantage of software based control is that it is device independent this reducing the development and support costs as all the manufacturers need to worry about is the functionality of the software, they don’t have to design and manufacture the hardware.

 

But like everything there is space for both, many people detest the thought of using a phone or tablet requiring dedicated hardware whereas other are ambivalent and will choose whatever is best for their use.

 

Personally I use all as they all provide different capabilities each one with a merit

[Midnight-Freight]

Thanks again for your continued help and suggestions. At the moment I'm leaning heavily towards giving the sprog a go. The more I read about app based control the more it starts to appeal, and obviously the low cost is appealing too.

 

So my next question is... From what I've read the Sprog II should be capable of running a small layout with up 4 locos?  I am currently only at 2, however one of those has a TTS decoder. I wouldn't expect to get beyond 4 locos anytime soon however they could also end up with sound decoders. I'm thinking I may just as well go for the Sprog 3 now to future proof myself a bit?

[Izzy]

 

I am sure that if you were to contact Sprog they would advise with regard to II versus 3 (Andrew Crosland uses RMweb and might well reply to this thread). I have run 4 n/2mm locos at once using a II, the total current draw (in command station mode it will give this) being just 250ma, but what 4 sound fitted 4mm ones might draw I don’t know. Perhaps someone else will.

 

Izzy

[Ron Ron Ron]

Thanks for the info and link. I'll try and speak to them at some point as they list the Multimaus with 10779 digital base station for £89.95 whereas the one I linked to earlier came with 10764 amplifier. Not sure if it's effectively the same thing or not but I was of the understanding you needed the amplifier.

 

 

There must be an error , because the 10779 isn't a command station. 

It's a "Braking Generator", which is an optional add-on module, used to automate the slowing down and starting up of locos.

Something I wouldn't concern yourself with at this stage of the game.

 

The 10764 is indeed what Roco call an "Amplifier".

This is what you need (i.e. must have) to go with the MultiMaus handset to create the MultiMaus DCC system.

 

Brand new MultMaus systems are no longer sold separately

They are only available by buying the individual components (handset, amplifier, power supply etc) to make the complete system up, .....or (the usual channel) by buying a complete (brand new) system split from a Roco digital "Start Set" (i.e. a Train Set).

 

 

Note:

Roco and Fleischmann no longer supply any train sets with a MultiMaus system.

Their digital train sets only come with a z21 + MultiMaus handset.

Therefore the "split from train set" source of MultiMaus systems, is beginning to dry up and prices are rising to reflect that.

 

 

 

.

Edited August 15, 2018 by Ron Ron Ron

[Midnight-Freight]

There must be an error , because the 10779 isn't a command station. 

It's a "Braking Generator", which is an optional add-on module, used to automate the slowing down and starting up of locos.

Something I wouldn't concern yourself with at this stage of the game.

 

The 10764 is indeed what Roco call an "Amplifier".

This is what you need (i.e. must have) to go with the MultiMaus handset to create the MultiMaus DCC system.

 

Brand new MultMaus systems are no longer sold separately

They are only available by buying the individual components (handset, amplifier, power supply etc) to make the complete system up, .....or (the usual channel) by buying a complete (brand new) system split from a Roco digital "Start Set" (i.e. a Train Set).

 

 

Note:

Roco and Fleischmann no longer supply any train sets with a MultiMaus system.

Their digital train sets only come with a z21 + MultiMaus handset.

Therefore the "split from train set" source of MultiMaus systems, is beginning to dry up and prices are rising to reflect that.

 

 

 

.

I assumed it must be an error as that's what I found when I looked up the part number. I'll hold off going down the Multimaus route for the moment.

[Sir TophamHatt]

A couple of "cons" you omitted are......

the low power output  (not a problem for a small number of locos on a modestly sized layout)

and the lack of a dedicated  programming track output (an approved NCE workaround is available at extra cost)

And this is the reason why I chose the Gaugemaster Prodigy Advance 2.

 

I see many people praising the NCE, but for the added protection and extra power output (without spending extra money to get it!) was the deciding factor for me. I think I spent about £100 on my set - not sure if it defaultly comes with the blue screen, or whether that's the updated screen but mine has it anyhow.

 

Didn't even know about the separate programing track business either!

Edited August 16, 2018 by Sir TophamHatt

[Izzy]

Intrigued by just how much current 4 sound locos might draw I today hooked my Sprog II up to the small 4mm/P4 layout I have to see. I have never really thought about it having a Gaugemaster/MRC PA2 with it's 3.5amp output as my main system (which is fitted with a 5 din plug and used with which ever layout I want to use).

 

With one loco running and three others just sitting with their sound on - I couldn't really have more than one actually moving at once since it's not that big and wouldn't be logistically feasible - I couldn't get the current draw to exceed about 200ma. A single loco seems to use between 30-50ma idling, and up to 150ma moving, but adding more idling doesn't seem to push up the draw by what I had expected. These readings come from the Sprog Slot monitor.

 

I presume these figures would increase when the locos were all moving under heavy load, but it does seem that the 1amp Sprog II might be quite good enough for small layouts even with sound locos.

 

Izzy

[Phil S]

A flat, level layout, without (tight) corners is quite a low current consumer  - but add in a tighter curve (constant speed around a curve requires acceleration into a new direction) or a gradient  or contact with a buffer stop can increase the current considerably.

 

As well as our 00 and H0 layouts, we operate G Scale - indoors and out: The INDOOR modular layout can operate 3 'heavy' sound fitted LGB locos with ease on a single Roco 10764 Amplifier 3.2A / 18V SMPS 4A on the level OR, as we had to in a marquee last year (and possibly again in September) on a noticeable gradient !! - the only problem occuring when the 3-car Allegra EMU stalled on a buffer stop - which tripped the Roco's overload protection.  

 

For those rejoicing in their new A level results, they can calculate the Sine of various common gradients to see how much extra is needed to overcome gravity 8-)

 

Our loft (00) layout has 4 power districts of 3.2A (for historical reasons - it was going to be 2 x 5A with ZTC) and each usually only takes about 250mA, and a loco about 250-500mA - BUT LED Coach lighting can increase that considerably to over an Amp.  I'e never got anywhere near the 3A as only 1 loco can actually run in each district (between stations) - unless a derailment has occured (when PSXs then cut their power leaving the accessory bus to rectify the point setting).   On a gently sloping garden LGB, we can have 5 or 6 sound locos active with 3 trains running and only reach 5-6 Amps ( which is why it has a Massoth Dimax controller ( <8A or <12A models available ). Howeever - the caveat is that many 'american'/USA locos take much larger currents - eg 5A when a dual motored LGB railcar takes only 800mA for the same incline.

[Crosland]

I am sure that if you were to contact Sprog they would advise with regard to II versus 3 (Andrew Crosland uses RMweb and might well reply to this thread).

 

Officially, I am on holiday

 

A SPROG II should be fine for 4 OO locos, including sound. If your needs grow you can always dedicate it to programming.

 

Andrew

[Midnight-Freight]

Officially, I am on holiday

 

A SPROG II should be fine for 4 OO locos, including sound. If your needs grow you can always dedicate it to programming.

 

Andrew

Thanks for the info. My layout is only end-to-end so there's no long trains running at high speed. I would say worst case scenario would be 4 altogether with lights and sound activated and 1, maybe 2 shunting around so sounds like the Sprog II will do the job.