danstercivicman Posted April 9, 2019 Author Share Posted April 9, 2019 (edited) I’ve been playing with the Sankey Scenics Headboards. Managed to get some Paint on it My daughter has been driving the Hunslet which she loves! Edited April 9, 2019 by danstercivicman 7 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
danstercivicman Posted April 9, 2019 Author Share Posted April 9, 2019 (edited) Night time and the 9:30pm Stranraer-Larne Boat Train and the 10pm N.Irishman simmer away. The parcels and perishable goods trains are in the centre road (awaiting their engines) and the late night local is simmering away in the bay... Just add the canopies, ferry and night... and some steam Please imagine the back scene as well... and the signal box! Edited April 9, 2019 by danstercivicman Spellings 7 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
danstercivicman Posted April 9, 2019 Author Share Posted April 9, 2019 (edited) I’ve also decided there will be no further loco or stock purchases (except a 6MT)... The next steps are all scenic If your wondering the Hunslet did some great shunting... then my daughter got bored so it decided to leave the Brake van and just randomly shunt the fuel oil wagon around!!! I had had to complete the shunting afterwards! Edited April 9, 2019 by danstercivicman 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
danstercivicman Posted April 10, 2019 Author Share Posted April 10, 2019 Has anyone got a Golden Arrow STD 6MT kit? Looks like you have to use the tender drive Britannia chassis but...it would give a 6MT... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Joseph_Pestell Posted April 10, 2019 RMweb Gold Share Posted April 10, 2019 Are Golden Arrow not still trading? The website shows the 6MT. http://www.goldenarrow.me.uk/products.htm#standard 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
danstercivicman Posted April 10, 2019 Author Share Posted April 10, 2019 That’s the one, just wondered if anyone had built one? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
danstercivicman Posted April 10, 2019 Author Share Posted April 10, 2019 It looks like it needs the older Tender Drive (non WR) Britannia. They have a horrid huge tender cab gap so in the past I’ve chopped that down (see my Hope Street thread). For improved running I can put the CD player motor I brought for the Class 110 into it which should give more power. The Golden Arrow body appears to fit on top. Then there’s painting decals and nameplates... Hmm... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
danstercivicman Posted April 10, 2019 Author Share Posted April 10, 2019 With both expresses departed the next trains to leave are the UP parcels and UP Perishable workings. The Incoming partially fitted empties arrives and the Hunslet sets to work as the last passenger working prepares to depart. 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pacific231G Posted April 10, 2019 Share Posted April 10, 2019 (edited) On 05/04/2019 at 10:08, St Enodoc said: Serious head still on. I think there's a difference. To me, "storage area" suggests a place where trains are stored between movements but not remarshalled - what US modellers call "staging". A "fiddle yard" is a place where you break up and reform trains, often by crane shunting. I don't think this is an official distinction - it just seems that way to me. There are plenty of names to choose from. I had a look back at some of our more illustrious predecessors. AFAIK the first layout to use such an arrangement to feed a terminus was the pre-war Maybank but a description of that once very famous 0 gauge layout in MRN in 1934 simply refers to " a depot for storing a number of trains, each on a separate road....mounted on a moving table or traverser" I'm only aware of one other pre-war layout that used off-stage storage sidings to feed a terminus and the idea didn't really take root until after the war. The first postwar example I've found was Peter Denny's first description of Buckingham in the last three months of 1948 in MRC and he described his three sidings ending in a turntable as a "marshalling yard" though later on he seems to have always referred to "storage sidings" including his "rotating storage sidings" .In his first article describing Charford in 1955 John Charman also referred to a "marshalling yard" but that was a fully fledged yard complete with a run round loop albeit "off-stage". Later developments of Charford had simpler ladder yards which he referred to in different articles as both storage sidings and hidden sidings as did Mac Pyrke with "Berrow". The first reference to fiddle sidings or a fiddle yard I've found were in two of Cyril Freezer's plans of the month in RM in 1961 so I suspect he may have coined the term then. These were both simple ladder yards and before then he'd always referred to exactly the same arrangement as "storage" or "hidden" sidings. Personally I like the term used by French modellers coulisse which in this context comes from the theatre meaning the wings either side of the stage to and from where actors make their exits and entrances. They do generally identify the terminus to coulisse format as a British idea but it didn't really appear there until the 1970s. Edited May 2, 2019 by Pacific231G 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
danstercivicman Posted April 10, 2019 Author Share Posted April 10, 2019 Good history info! One siding is St Enoch-Glasgow! One siding is Euston/Carlisle The smallest is Dunragit and the others are Dumfries, Carlisle and Glasgow The loco sidings represent Stranraer shed, the local depots and Carlisle Kingmoor. Hope that explains it! Have be a good day everyone more layout running later! 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pacific231G Posted April 10, 2019 Share Posted April 10, 2019 10 minutes ago, danstercivicman said: Good history info! One siding is St Enoch-Glasgow! One siding is Euston/Carlisle The smallest is Dunragit and the others are Dumfries, Carlisle and Glasgow The loco sidings represent Stranraer shed, the local depots and Carlisle Kingmoor. Hope that explains it! Have be a good day everyone more layout running later! Thanks Dan Does that mean that "crane shunting" is generally confined to locos with the regular trains remaining on the track? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Joseph_Pestell Posted April 10, 2019 RMweb Gold Share Posted April 10, 2019 23 minutes ago, Pacific231G said: They do generally identify the terminus to coulisse format as a British idea but it didn't really appear there until the 1970s. I was exhibiting such a layout in France in the early 90s - and it still seemed very strange to them then. 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
danstercivicman Posted April 10, 2019 Author Share Posted April 10, 2019 1 hour ago, Pacific231G said: Thanks Dan Does that mean that "crane shunting" is generally confined to locos with the regular trains remaining on the track? Basically yes... I have to crane shunt the locos and turn them on my custom hand powered turntable I then have to remove the sleepers from the four coach rake and that then becomes a semi fast for later in the day. The Stranraer-Larne Boat Train has the ER BCK removed (it goes to Newcastle) and that stock has a P3 BK added... it then gets reused for a train to St Enoch... Hope that explains it all. Eventually Peco loco lifts will be used.. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold The Johnster Posted April 10, 2019 RMweb Gold Share Posted April 10, 2019 I think of my railway in theatrical terms and the fiddle yard, a term I use probably because of my age and exposure to the term in magazines during the 60s and 70s, along with 'crane shunt', as off stage, with trains prepared for running on to the scenic section as 'waiting in the wings for their cue'. What we are doing when we operate our layouts is to a significant extent a theatrical activity, a performance for an audience even if it's only of one, ourselves. American modellers refer to fiddle yards as 'staging areas', which seems appropriate, but induces in me a vision of large layouts with multilevel operation and no space restrictions, something far removed from my small BLT. Terminology changes over time, and interestingly 'crane shunt' seems to have fallen out of use and not been replaced with an alternative description. I still use it, though, curmudgeonly old git that I am... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pacific231G Posted April 10, 2019 Share Posted April 10, 2019 3 minutes ago, Joseph_Pestell said: I was exhibiting such a layout in France in the early 90s - and it still seemed very strange to them then. Hi Jo Which layout was that? I've operated a few such layouts (mostly Giles Barnabe's) at shows in France and the idea of actually operating and shunting rather than simply running trains through scenery did seem to fascinate them. The first French shunting based layout I saw there was in 2008 at RailONorm at Pacy in Normandy and it was Olivier & Gaëlle Taniou's Somatfer. A small 4ft x 3ft 6in plus coulisse metal bashing works which they were operating with a card system. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Joseph_Pestell Posted April 10, 2019 RMweb Gold Share Posted April 10, 2019 4 minutes ago, Pacific231G said: Hi Jo Which layout was that? I've operated a few such layouts (mostly Giles Barnabe's) at shows in France and the idea of actually operating and shunting rather than simply running trains through scenery did seem to fascinate them. The first French shunting based layout I saw there was in 2008 at RailONorm at Pacy in Normandy and it was Olivier & Gaëlle Taniou's Somatfer. A small 4ft x 3ft 6in plus coulisse metal bashing works which they were operating with a card system. Hi David, It was a small LMS BLT which I called Downingham, for no better reason than it used the Prototype Models LNW Uppingham station building. The local club in Perpignan asked me to build it to exhibit at their home show. I think that I did 3 shows with it in all including one at Neuville-de-Poitou. Like the clever use of the old Jouef/Playcraft loco shed in the photo above. 1 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium St Enodoc Posted April 10, 2019 RMweb Premium Share Posted April 10, 2019 9 hours ago, Pacific231G said: I'm only aware of one other pre-war layout that used off-stage storage sidings to feed a terminus and the idea didn't really take root until after the war. David, I'm a long way from my old magazines at the moment but Gutland comes to mind - was that the one? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pacific231G Posted April 11, 2019 Share Posted April 11, 2019 (edited) 14 hours ago, St Enodoc said: David, I'm a long way from my old magazines at the moment but Gutland comes to mind - was that the one? A bit No. I've not come across Gutland, when was it published? The layout I was thinking of was the 3.5mm/ft scale Alheeba State Railway built by Aldo Cosomati, a commercial artist perhaps better known for the posters he designed for the London Underground group. Alheeba was described by Cosomati in the December 1933 and January 1934 MRN referring to it as the result of "a veritable lust of model making of all kinds.... houses, landscape, railway and ships". That was before the description of Maybank in August 1934 but Bill Banwell and Frank Applegate's layout had first been exhibited locally in November 1932 and at the MRC Easter exhibition in 1933. It's possible that Cosomati, who came to Britain from Italy after the First World War, built his layout first and was known to Banwell and Applegate but his description rather implies that it was fairly recent. As I've not found any earlier references to him as a railway modeller, it seems more likely that both layouts were under construction at around the same time. If as seems possible all three were MRC members the idea of an off-stage "rest of the world" may have been something being discussed but it didn't really become established, at least not in print, until the mid to late 1940s. As a scenic layout Alheeba inspired Johh Ahern. He says so in his book on modelling buildings, and you can certailnly see the ancestry of Madderport in the Alheeba harbour goods station. I don't know if that inspiration came just from reading Aldo Cosomati's description in MRN or from actually seeing the layout. Of course, John Ahern never used hidden sidings though I think he may have considered it when Madderport was first built as a stand alone terminus. Back to Stranraer. Sorry for the diversion Dan. Edited April 11, 2019 by Pacific231G 1 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium St Enodoc Posted April 11, 2019 RMweb Premium Share Posted April 11, 2019 51 minutes ago, Pacific231G said: A bit No. I've not come across Gutland, when was it published? The layout I was thinking of was the 3.5mm/ft scale Alheeba State Railway built by Aldo Cosomati, a commercial artist perhaps better known for the posters he designed for the London Underground group. Alheeba was described by Cosomati in the December 1933 and January 1934 MRN referring to it as the result of "a veritable lust of model making of all kinds.... houses, landscape, railway and ships". That was before the description of Maybank in August 1934 but Bill Banwell and Frank Applegate's layout had first been exhibited locally in November 1932 and at the MRC Easter exhibition in 1933. It's possible that Cosomati, who came to Britain from Italy after the First World War, built his layout first and was known to Banwell and Applegate but his description rather implies that it was fairly recent. As I've not found any earlier references to him as a railway modeller, it seems more likely that both layouts were under construction at around the same time. If as seems possible all three were MRC members the idea of an off-stage "rest of the world" may have been something being discussed but it didn't really become established, at least not in print, until the mid to late 1940s. As a scenic layout Alheeba inspired Johh Ahern. He says so in his book on modelling buildings, and you can certailnly see the ancestry of Madderport in the Alheeba harbour goods station. I don't know if that inspiration came just from reading Aldo Cosomati's description in MRN or from actually seeing the layout. Of course, John Ahern never used hidden sidings though I think he may have considered it when Madderport was first built as a stand alone terminus. Back to Stranraer. Sorry for the diversion Dan. Thanks David. I've seen that plan before on RMweb - possibly posted by your good self. End of digression - for now... 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
danstercivicman Posted April 11, 2019 Author Share Posted April 11, 2019 Haha no problems that’s a nice plan that’s been posted! Haven’t managed much today too many house chores to do 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
danstercivicman Posted April 11, 2019 Author Share Posted April 11, 2019 I’ve thought about building something like that plan once Stranraer is completed in 2025... It will run on the lower level and be based around ‘Port Patrick!’ I may have found a Clan then... 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
danstercivicman Posted April 15, 2019 Author Share Posted April 15, 2019 Sadly another Clan has passed me by on EBay... £180+ Wow! 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
danstercivicman Posted April 16, 2019 Author Share Posted April 16, 2019 With the Hornby Clans going for huge prices I’ve ordered the Golden Arrow body... Just need the relevant parts from the Hornby Britannia tender drive and then I should be able to construct the kit! I’ve also been reusing points from my minories layout to expand the fiddle yard. pics to follow 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
danstercivicman Posted April 16, 2019 Author Share Posted April 16, 2019 Not much to show... Points in the staging/theatre/assembly Thingy. Timetables Paint between the tracks! 3 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
danstercivicman Posted April 17, 2019 Author Share Posted April 17, 2019 (edited) Afternoon Freights getting ready for departure as lunchtime services from Glasgow St Enoch and the Dunragit DMU tick and simmer away... The medium radius staging area points will eventually be replaced with large radius ones but they do for now... The ECS is then placed into the siding so the Black Five can depart. Edited April 17, 2019 by danstercivicman 3 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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