Panic buying

[PhilJ W]

53 minutes ago, boxbrownie said:

If there are indeed unions covering the HGV drivers they ain’t doing a very good job it appears, wages and conditions seem poor.

It is easier to organise trade union activities when the employees are all in one place. By its very nature truck driving is difficult if not impossible to organise.

[PhilJ W]

Someone might not be working for Morrisons for much longer.

[Ron Ron Ron]

I just switched through a few TV news channels, after the 10 o'clock news ended.

On Euronews, they had just finished reporting on the UK filling station shortages and went on to report on the growing EU wide lorry driver shortage.

 

The main focus of the report was on the Netherlands, with interviews from a lorry driver's union guy and another driver.

It confirmed the same story that was reported on BBC Radio 5 Live, yesterday morning, that there was the same problem of low wages, poor conditions and an over reliance on cheap Eastern European EU...and non-EU drivers, being paid below the minimum rates.

 

On both the BBC and Euronews reports, Dutch drivers are saying that EU and national laws are being widely flouted and the authorities are not interested and are turning a blind eye.

Apart from paying below the minimum rates, drivers hours limitations are routinely ignored and little enforcement is being applied.

The drivers from non-EU Eastern European and Balkan countries, would normally not be eligible to free movement.

 

A dutch driver speaking on the BBC report, blamed multinational corporations and big industry for the state of the haulage industry in Europe.

 

 

.

[Ron Ron Ron]

In case it was missed....

 

On 27/09/2021 at 14:42, Ron Ron Ron said:

There is no doubt some exaggeration of the driver shortage statistics, which isn't entirely unexpected from our media.

Only 2 or 3 months ago, the press reports were that the shortage was up to 76,000....now the nice big round figure of 100,000 looks more juicy.

 

Let's have a look back in time.... (click the links to read the articles)

 

 

December 2014 - Food Manufacture (industry news)  ...long before the referendum and long before 90% plus of the UK population was even aware of the "Brexit issue".

HGV driver shortage could cripple food industry.

 

October 2015 - The Guardian ...again, months before the Brexit debate really got going.

Lorry driver shortage 'could put Christmas deliveries at risk'

 

September 2015 - Daily Mirror

The trucker is becoming an endangered species as lorry driver shortage hits the industry

 

October 2019 - Logistics UK

HGV driver shortage climbs to 59,000

 

January 2021 - 9 months ago (this year)

The UK truck driver shortage in 2021

 

 

 

 

.

 

.

 

 

 

...

[Sidecar Racer]

11 hours ago, SamThomas said:

Most of the "up to date" filling stations need the pump to be activated after the staff check the ANPR, so there is still a little manual input.

 

I expect that there will be a certain element that will think it does not apply to them, but it would certainly help to quell the queues, at least to come extent.

 My local Asda is totally unstaffed fully self serve card only . Pumps are activated

after checking the card so I don't think ANPR would have any effect .

[Ron Ron Ron]

I see that the Office for National Statistics have released some figures...

 

Despite varied press reports of 14,000, 15,000, 20,000 and 30,000, the ONS says that fewer than 10,000 European lorry drivers have left the UK following Brexit, representing just one in five of all those who left the profession since the referendum.

That's still a lot though, on top of the large number of UK drivers who have left the job in that time.

 

The DVSA have confirmed the reports that the number of LGV tests being taken, plummeted from March 2020.

 

 

.

Edited September 28, 2021 by Ron Ron Ron

[big jim]

4 minutes ago, Ron Ron Ron said:

 

 

The DVSA have confirmed that the number of LGV tests being taken, plummeted from March 2020.

 

 

.

no s**t Sherlock, wonder why? 

[Ron Ron Ron]

4 minutes ago, big jim said:

no s**t Sherlock, wonder why? 

 

That's an official confirmation. Not just another press report.

We all know why.....or at least we've learnt or been finding out over the last few weeks.

[Andy Hayter]

20 minutes ago, Ron Ron Ron said:

I see that the Office for National Statistics have released some figures...

 

Despite varied press reports of 14,000, 15,000, 20,000 and 30,000, the ONS says that fewer than 10,000 European lorry drivers have left the UK following Brexit, representing just one in five of all those who left the profession since the referendum.

That's still a lot though, on top of the large number of UK drivers who have left the job in that time.

 

The DVSA have confirmed the reports that the number of LGV tests being taken, plummeted from March 2020.

 

 

.

 

I'd love to know how they got those numbers.

 

Since the UK had no registration system for where people lived - which would have picked up foreign nationals, I doubt they can say with certainty.

 

It might be through surrendered HGV licences but that will depend on a number of factors. 

How good are other countries/ regional authorities at returning the surrendered licence to the UK?

Given the UK was leaving the EU is it possible that some countries or local authorities just did not bother?

What happens if a driver returns to his home country and decides to not take up driving there preferring some other profession?

What happens if the driver simply has not surrendered his licence and continues to drive on his UK one?  I know a lot of car drivers living in France are still driving on UK licences  although there, there is agreement that allows that to happen.

[boxbrownie]

[boxbrownie]

10 hours ago, PhilJ W said:

It is easier to organise trade union activities when the employees are all in one place. By its very nature truck driving is difficult if not impossible to organise.

The Americans did it back in the 40’s very successfully 

 

[boxbrownie]

10 hours ago, Sidecar Racer said:

 My local Asda is totally unstaffed fully self serve card only . Pumps are activated

after checking the card so I don't think ANPR would have any effect .

Our old ASDA in Essex was the same (that was six years ago, and that had been converted a few years before that) which is why the ANPR at modern stations puzzled me.

[Guest]

5 minutes ago, boxbrownie said:

Our old ASDA in Essex was the same (that was six years ago, and that had been converted a few years before that) which is why the ANPR at modern stations puzzled me.

 

Probably some fraud related reasons. Sure you put a card in the machine but is it yours?

 

Plus if it's one of those stations near an airport they'll want you bill you if you stay there more than ten minutes.

[TheQ]

6 minutes ago, boxbrownie said:

Our old ASDA in Essex was the same (that was six years ago, and that had been converted a few years before that) which is why the ANPR at modern stations puzzled me.

Probably for disputed charges, where someone says" I didn't fill up there that day"!!

[boxbrownie]

6 minutes ago, TheQ said:

Probably for disputed charges, where someone says" I didn't fill up there that day"!!

But there is a huge difference between an ANPR camera system and just a CCTV system which I thought most had, why would a petrol station need ANPR technology? There is no link between your car registration at DVLC and your credit card (not officially anyway!) the station would know what time the purchase was made and just look back at the time stamp on the CCTV to read the plates for the police, although most “splash and run” use false plates.

We were always having the cops bring in really bad images on CCTV to see if we could identify the make/model of vehicles.

[Fat Controller]

35 minutes ago, boxbrownie said:

The Americans did it back in the 40’s very successfully 

 

Salvador Allende's (democratically-elected) government in Chile was brought down by a lorry-drivers' strike in the mid 1970s.

Several French governments have changed policies after similar strikes in the past couple of decades.

 

[Guest]

12 minutes ago, boxbrownie said:

But there is a huge difference between an ANPR camera system and just a CCTV system which I thought most had, why would a petrol station need ANPR technology? There is no link between your car registration at DVLC and your credit card

 

You don't need a link with the DVLA for ANPR. It's just grabbing the characters off the plate. As a side effect it confirms your plate is visible.

It's starting to get used in motor retail where it looks up your plate as you drive in and matches that with your customer record.

[SamThomas]

15 hours ago, hayfield said:

 

The simple fact is, most people using the filling stations are insuring they have sufficient petrol for the foreseeable future, a few are in desperate need due to empty tanks. Others may have extremely good reasons why they need fuel. Its a temporary problem which apparently now is showing signs of getting better. Big brother is not required, which is unfortunate for the clip board brigade. Jobsworths are the last people we need to inflame the situation further

 

 

My idea was a simple way of cutting the queues down - most people do not need to fill empty tanks on a daily basis unless they are on a long journey & then there is also the possibility of working round that.

 

Unfortunatly, if people continue with their current behavior we may end up with big brother.

 

BTW, I thought jobsworth's used tablets thesedays.

[SamThomas]

16 hours ago, Graham108 said:

I can't see the unions putting up with that

A point worth some thought.

 

During one of the Firefighters strikes senior officers removed (without warning to prevent sabbotage) appliances that were "on the run" for private companies to use.

IIRC these appliances were subsequentyly blacked.

[SamThomas]

15 hours ago, Titan said:

Wonder if they would follow this one?

 

 

Why, why, why did you post that !

Now, I have to find a copy to watch................

[alastairq]

3 minutes ago, SamThomas said:

A point worth some thought.

 

During one of the Firefighters strikes senior officers removed (without warning to prevent sabbotage) appliances that were "on the run" for private companies to use.

IIRC these appliances were subsequentyly blacked.

Probably find something in employment contracts regarding so-called 'blacking' of vehicles?

 

As I said above, today, in the event of a firepeeps strike, the military would use the proper fire appliances that are currently in storage [Home Office]...which are yesterday's appliances that have been bumped by new machines.

[SamThomas]

3 minutes ago, alastairq said:

Probably find something in employment contracts regarding so-called 'blacking' of vehicles?

 

As I said above, today, in the event of a firepeeps strike, the military would use the proper fire appliances that are currently in storage [Home Office]...which are yesterday's appliances that have been bumped by new machines.

Relativly easy to "black" a vehicle by way of finding a fault with it on the daily walkround (admittedly not quite so easy on a well maintained fleet).

[Mad McCann]

54 minutes ago, Fat Controller said:

Salvador Allende's (democratically-elected) government in Chile was brought down by a lorry-drivers' strike in the mid 1970s.

Several French governments have changed policies after similar strikes in the past couple of decades.

 

I think it probably had more to do with the CIA tbh.

Davy.

[Fat Controller]

1 minute ago, Mad McCann said:

I think it probably had more to do with the CIA tbh.

Davy.

They almost certainly bankrolled the strike.

 

[SamThomas]

Part of my "routine" when delivering to filling stations requires me to go into the secure "staff" side of the paydesk.

All of the filling stations that I deliver to have ANPR as part of their CCTV system. This is linked to a national database that records "drive aways". Yes, it's still manual, but the pump is not activated until the clerk checks the screen).

Some of these filling stations are relatively small with 6 or so pumps, so the bigger (& fuel company owned) ones could very well have more advanced technology.

I really don't know what security arrangements are in place at unattended pumps/stations apart from the card companies security algorithms.