Garage guttering

[sb67]

I've got a old concrete panelled garage and I've got to fit guttering along one side. I'm reluctant to drill into the concrete panels as they're pretty old and the last thing I want to do is shatter them. Another challenge is my neighbours garage is too close to be able to get along the side so I've only got access to each end. 

Does any body know if you can get gutter brackets that would hook over the top of the garage panels so the gutter would hang under the eaves or has anybody had a similar problem and overcome it? I've had one builder round but he said he wasn't sure if there was such a thing.

Be grateful for peoples thoughts.

 

[chuffinghell]

42 minutes ago, sb67 said:

I've got a old concrete panelled garage and I've got to fit guttering along one side. I'm reluctant to drill into the concrete panels as they're pretty old and the last thing I want to do is shatter them. Another challenge is my neighbours garage is too close to be able to get along the side so I've only got access to each end. 

Does any body know if you can get gutter brackets that would hook over the top of the garage panels so the gutter would hang under the eaves or has anybody had a similar problem and overcome it? I've had one builder round but he said he wasn't sure if there was such a thing.

Be grateful for peoples thoughts.

 

could you attach the brackets and guttering to a plank of timber and fix the timber at each end on the side with your neighbour?

[chris p bacon]

Without seeing it, it does sound similar to something I did about 25 years ago.

 

It was only a section about 2M long so entailed 3 brackets, what I did was to get some metal strips from the merchants (they're called lateral restraint straps) these have a multitude of holes stamped in them, I cut them into shorter lengths then bent them in a vice so they hooked over the concrete panel, the holes then enabled me to bolt a regular gutter bracket to them and the various holes enabled a fall as I used a lower hole on each succesive bracket.

Alternatively if the piers that joint the panels stick out and preclude that method you can use the same brackets to fix a piece of fascia with the brackets mounted on them. 

 

out of interest are you able to use the roof of your neighbours for access ? if it's an old flat felt roof use a board and dust sheet to protect the felt while you work.

[sb67]

Thanks guys, that has given me a couple of ideas and got me thinking. 

My neighbours garage has an apex roof so I'm not able to use that. I'll google those straps. 

I'm trying to stop water ingress at the base of the panels and I recon the gutter would help massively. 

[polybear]

I've got a precast concrete shed that is 45+ years old; I've drilled holes in panels numerous times (in fact four holes in the past 2-3 weeks).  No issues at all - stay away from panel edges, start with a small bit and work upwards.  I'd not drill a post though.

Another option may be to use (if you have them) the bolts that go thru' the centre and corner posts that secure the metal plates inside the garage which retain the panels in position.  As for water ingress at the base of the panels, try squirting bitumen mastic sealer (it comes in tubes used in a mastic gun) into the gaps)

HTH

[sb67]

Thanks Polybear. The guttering will be at the edges of the panels so I am a bit reluctant to try that.  There's a bit of degradation at the base of some panels so I was going to repair it with cement before anything else. 

[chris p bacon]

3 hours ago, sb67 said:

I'll google those straps. 

I'm trying to stop water ingress at the base of the panels and I recon the gutter would help massively. 

 

They're like this

https://www.screwfix.com/p/sabrefix-roll-edge-restraint-strap-bend-500-x-100mm-5-pack/85398

There are heavy and light duty, you only want light duty as the heavy are a b*gger to bend.

 

If you've got water ingress at the bottom of the panels make sure the gap between buildings is clear of crud and cr@p, any build up will keep it damp and encourage the concrete panel to start spalling (crumbling)  If it's already started doing that, do you have enough room to reach in and place a triangular fillet of cement along the bottom ? this will help push the water away from the panel. If not then the guttering will certainly help.

 

[34theletterbetweenB&D]

3 hours ago, sb67 said:

...I'm trying to stop water ingress at the base of the panels and I reckon the gutter would help massively. 

 

33 minutes ago, chris p bacon said:

 ...do you have enough room to reach in and place a triangular fillet of cement along the bottom ? this will help push the water away from the panel. If not then the guttering will certainly help.

My Pa had much the same problem at altitude in West Yorks. where the rain it do rain.  A good new sectional concrete garage (with gutters!) had been put up on a good concrete slab that ran to the boundary wall, by the previous owner. With a six inch gap to the neighbour's 6' high wall all along one side so access was 'difficult'. (What inspector allowed that and much else I would like to know.)

 

Mr Bodgeit went all along the inside base drilling holes at 3" intervals, then squirting in expanding polyurethane foam, then a fillet of cement over the top inside. That stopped water ingress from that side, and external cement fillets and cutting two ground level drain channels in the runway fixed the other three sides. (The whole lot on a sloping hill side site with copious water running down the road and then down the runway to the garage site.)

[polybear]

8 hours ago, 34theletterbetweenB&D said:

 

My Pa had much the same problem at altitude in West Yorks. where the rain it do rain.  A good new sectional concrete garage (with gutters!) had been put up on a good concrete slab that ran to the boundary wall, by the previous owner. With a six inch gap to the neighbour's 6' high wall all along one side so access was 'difficult'. (What inspector allowed that and much else I would like to know.)

 

Mr Bodgeit went all along the inside base drilling holes at 3" intervals, then squirting in expanding polyurethane foam, then a fillet of cement over the top inside. That stopped water ingress from that side, and external cement fillets and cutting two ground level drain channels in the runway fixed the other three sides. (The whole lot on a sloping hill side site with copious water running down the road and then down the runway to the garage site.)

 

I *think* I'm correct in saying that both the Garage (classed as a temporary structure, as it is a prefab) and also the wall fall outside the interest of Buildings Control.

 

When originally built, my shed had some form of bitumen tape (maybe 10"+ wide) applied as a strip inside the shed, in an L-shape between floor and wall to act as a seal.

[34theletterbetweenB&D]

24 minutes ago, polybear said:

I *think* I'm correct in saying that both the Garage (classed as a temporary structure, as it is a prefab) and also the wall fall outside the interest of Buildings Control...

I am sure you are right. Having only owned property in a tightly controlled creation of Sir Ebeneezer Howard where everything is controlled: acceptable boundary hedge plant species, colour of front door, window frame design, chickens verboten, no part of a garden shed or other temporary structure to be closer than one yard to the property boundary; I think you get the sense of it...

[sb67]

On 20 June 2020 at 10:33, chris p bacon said:

 

They're like this

https://www.screwfix.com/p/sabrefix-roll-edge-restraint-strap-bend-500-x-100mm-5-pack/85398

There are heavy and light duty, you only want light duty as the heavy are a b*gger to bend.

 

If you've got water ingress at the bottom of the panels make sure the gap between buildings is clear of crud and cr@p, any build up will keep it damp and encourage the concrete panel to start spalling (crumbling)  If it's already started doing that, do you have enough room to reach in and place a triangular fillet of cement along the bottom ? this will help push the water away from the panel. If not then the guttering will certainly help.

 

 

Thanks Chris. I'll get one of those strips and see what I can do. There is a bit of crumbling at the base on the inside. Would I just use a normal cement mix to patch repair that?

[chris p bacon]

2 hours ago, sb67 said:

There is a bit of crumbling at the base on the inside. Would I just use a normal cement mix to patch repair that?

 

You want a fairly strong mix so rather 4:1 I'd use 2:1 (sand to cement) Use a mortar sand rather than a sharp sand which has stones in.

It wouldn't hurt to make up a PVA mix (50/50 with water) and paint the bottom of the panels, this will knock down any dust and help the mortar take to the panel. 

[sb67]

On 21/06/2020 at 14:01, chris p bacon said:

 

You want a fairly strong mix so rather 4:1 I'd use 2:1 (sand to cement) Use a mortar sand rather than a sharp sand which has stones in.

It wouldn't hurt to make up a PVA mix (50/50 with water) and paint the bottom of the panels, this will knock down any dust and help the mortar take to the panel. 

 

Thanks Chris, is the stuff easy to mix? I was thinking about getting a bag of ready mixed stuff where you just add water? 

[tomparryharry]

25 minutes ago, sb67 said:

 

Thanks Chris, is the stuff easy to mix? I was thinking about getting a bag of ready mixed stuff where you just add water? 

 

As Dave has said, the PVA-water mix is straightforward, just 50/50 by size. There are DiY shops, where you can indeed buy smaller quantities of ready mixed mortar. using the liquid mixture instead of 'normal' water will, or should, give you a good stiff mix. Beware however, of accelerated drying times. Get the repair area ready to receive the mixed mortar before you mix it up. 

[chris p bacon]

1 hour ago, sb67 said:

 

I was thinking about getting a bag of ready mixed stuff where you just add water? 

 

30 minutes ago, tomparryharry said:

There are DiY shops, where you can indeed buy smaller quantities of ready mixed mortar. using the liquid mixture instead of 'normal' water will, or should, give you a good stiff mix. Beware however, of accelerated drying times. Get the repair area ready to receive the mixed mortar before you mix it up. 

 

Yes you can get 'Mortar mix' bags such as this

https://www.wickes.co.uk/Wickes-Patch-Repair-Mortar---12-5kg/p/222709

 

[sb67]

Thanks guys. Do you have any experience of Tanking Slurry? I was thinking of painting that over the repairs and all along the join at the base then a concrete fillet over that? 

[chris p bacon]

I've never used it. If a buildings that wet I wouldn't buy it......unless it was a swimming pool...

 

Probably a bit of overkill on a garage.