BR livery in industry/preservation

[Ben B]

Hello

 

   I was looking through some pics on here, on another thread, of the British Oak loading point on the Aire and Calder Navigation.  They had a number of BR-blue liveried shunters, and I've seen pictures elsewhere of ex-BR locomotives, still in corporate livery (either blue or earlier green) with original numbers and logos, in private industrial use.

 

   When the KWVR was first preserved, steam locomotives were still (just) running on the mainline when they reopened, the Worth Valley had to deck-out their Ivatt 41241 and railbuses in their own house-livery; I was given to understand this was because BR apparently wouldn't let them run privately in British Railways livery.

 

   I just wondered if BR had rules against their pensioned-off machines wearing the official livery, as a clapped-out and filthy shunter slithering around a colliery wouldn't necessarily have given the best impression of the corporate image (particularly at the point when BR were still bothered about their 'look')?  Or did they turn a blind eye?

[LMS2968]

I'm not sure but I think it applied only to old-fashioned steam engines. Preserved ones would be in the public eye, and therefore drag the new-fangled British Rail back into pre-history, whereas 'a clapped-out and filthy shunter slithering around a colliery' wouldn't be in the public eye.

[Steamport Southport]

There wasn't any rules stopping preserved railways using BR livery. Any suggestion saying there was is an urban myth I'm afraid.

 

Notice that some of the Black Fives at Carnforth and the Lakeside & Haverthwaite got painted fictional liveries, but 44806 didn't.

 

Also worth considering that when formed some railways such as the K&WVR and DVR weren't originally "heritage" railways as they were planning to be railways running a proper service under their new name.  That's why they received fictional liveries. But not all locomotives did.

 

 

It was also that BR livery was very unpopular with visitors to preserved railways. If I had a pound for every time I was told that the Class 24 which was at Southport should be painted green I could have bought one. Worst comment was "Keeping it that colour is a disgrace and it should be scrapped!"

 

 

Jason

[LMS2968]

32 minutes ago, Steamport Southport said:

There wasn't any rules stopping preserved railways using BR livery. Any suggestion saying there was is an urban myth I'm afraid.

Really? It's what we told - by BR!

 

I have to agree with the last sentence regarding the 24, whatever colour it was, and I worked on them on goods trains in BR days.

[Wheatley]

I suspect that if it was BR policy then it was either a local one, or it was largely ignored. BR shunters sold into NCB service seem to have been sold 'as is' - it wouldn't have taken long to peel the stickers off if BR was that bothered. 

 

In the 1990s there was a policy on not letting steam charter passengers wander about on the track during water stops. My boss at the time decided that the way to deal with this at Garsdale was to ignore it and issue an instruction that Garsdale box was to block back to Kirkby Stephen to allow them to do exactly that not only with permission but protected by the block ! "They aren't trespassing if they're invited". He ignored the Regional Railways painting schedule for signalboxes too, which is why they are all maroon and cream to this day. 

Edited February 17, 2021 by Wheatley

[adb968008]

4 hours ago, Steamport Southport said:

 

 

Notice that some of the Black Fives at Carnforth and the Lakeside & Haverthwaite got painted fictional liveries, but 44806 didn't.

They painted it BR Green along with 44932 instead.

[adb968008]

Certainly didnt apply to BR Diesels, 40145 / D1041/ 55009/19 all entered preservation in Blue and stayed that way for some years... D1041 was even painted by BR before moving to Bury...(a naff job I recall.. the body side was all pitted and chipped but painted over ).

 

24032 had its BR logo painted out in 1976 when working at the NYMR, I believe it was only officially preserved 5 years back.. prior to that it was still owned by the Scrapyard they borrowed it from for 40 years.

Edited February 18, 2021 by adb968008

[russ p]

8 hours ago, adb968008 said:

Certainly didnt apply to BR Diesels, 40145 / D1041/ 55009/19 all entered preservation in Blue and stayed that way for some years... D1041 was even painted by BR before moving to Bury...(a naff job I recall.. the body side was all pitted and chipped but painted over ).

 

24032 had its BR logo painted out in 1976 when working at the NYMR, I believe it was only officially preserved 5 years back.. prior to that it was still owned by the Scrapyard they borrowed it from for 40 years.

 

There was some controversy with the 24, BR insisted on the logo and the 24 prefix removed i believe it was something to do with the scrapyard reusing it rather than the railway 

Not sure which part of BR objected to as locally there didn't seem to be a problem.  Cant remember it it went to grosmont under its own power but it certainly visited thornaby on at least one occasion and for tyre turning along with some coaches for the same.

D5500 also went to grosmont from York under its own power hauling the Q7 in about 78/79.

May have had something to do with the amount of local railwaymen that volunteered on the line at the time