London Road - LNWR 1907

[Jol Wilkinson]

Some progress on the wiring over the weekend. I still need to add connections to the two MERG Servo 4 pcbs and then then the D-dub sockets to the tag boards at each end. I also made the hole for the platform starter signal, which will be servo operated and mounted on one of the MSE "Retford" mountings.

 

This slightly out of focus photo shows progress so far, the cables will be tidied up when they are all in place.

Edited March 13, 2023 by Jol Wilkinson
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[Jol Wilkinson]

A progress update.

 

The track and wiring at the south end are finished. I extended one head shunt and one siding a bit so the next job at that end will be buffer stops, etc. However that will wait until the track at the other  (north) end is complete. 

 

This is the wiring under the RH section of the access bridge.

 

 

This is the completed section. The  baseboard propped up against the "library" is the Steam Shed (LNWR parlance for loco shed) section for the other end.

 

 

 

 

Today I have started laying out the location of the underlay, then I can start on making lots of plain track. I used C&L Flexitrack in the  storage sidings but found it under gauge so didn't want to risk that on the curves.

Edited April 16, 2023 by Jol Wilkinson
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[Coal Tank]

Looking good Jol

[Jol Wilkinson]

After a week sorting out a new computer (mainly declining Microsoft's attempt to tell me how I should live my life) I have laid the underlay for the new track and started making the first point for the Steam Shed area.

 

This R/H B7 follows my preferred "hybrid" approach, with ply and rivet at several places for strength and adjustment and plastic chairs elsewhere. So far the common crossing and straight stock rail have been fitted. The plain section to the left leads to the original layout.

 

[Jol Wilkinson]

The point for the engine shed area approach has been finished and installed, so now I have made a start on the 10M of plain track to go around to the "north" end of the storage sidings. The single rail on to the left is the end of three 1M pieces joined to lay out the curve for the two running lines, which I'll mark with pins. 

 

Flexitrack would have been easier but the pack I bought was under gauge which would have been worse when curved, so it's  down to making it. At least I can use 4 bolt chairs which is correct for the LNWR. I build the track on a jig which gives the sleeper spacing, but fit just one rail. This will be laid and then the other rail located with triangular track gauges to give widening. 

[Coal Tank]

Looking good Jol, Looking good 

[Coal Tank]

Jol...... Did the LNWR use three bolt chairs on 30ft raíl pannels? 

[Jol Wilkinson]

I don't know John. The Jack Nelson book only has details of a 4 bolt chair. Perhaps someone on the LNWRS Facebook group might know or a search on the LNWRS DMS site might show some relevant drawings.

[Hibelroad]

I’ve only ever seen 4 bolt chairs but Jack Nelson does say that “there were also 3 hole chairs used on lighter roads”. That doesn’t help with the original query but at least they did exist. At the time of 30ft panels wouldn’t the chairs be buried in the ballast so from a modelling perspective the type of chair would be academic?

[billbedford]

I have drawings of LNWR 2 bolt chairs for 85lb rail and 3 bolt ones for 95ib rail. 

 

I even have CAD for the 3 bolts so I can print them if wanted. 

[Jol Wilkinson]

The circle is closed - well, sort of. 

I have just finished the first rail at the north end of the layout, connecting the station approach to the storage siding. This is the inside rail of the inside of the two running lines.

 

As I am hand building the track, rather than use under gauge flexi-track, it is rather time consuming. I produce lengths of single rail fitted to ply sleepers with Exactoscale plastic chairs using the sleeper jig I had laser cut. A bit like a comb, it makes two 60'  panels with 24 sleepers per panel. I actually make a section long enough for each baseboard (just over a metre) and lay this to follow the curve required. I find this easiest way to get a smooth curve around the whole length.

 

I'll then add the second rail and chairs, gauged with triangular gauges for track widening (the first metre or so is done). I'll then add the inside rail of the outer running track, using simple home made spacing gauges to get the six foot way  required around the curve and then the other rail.

 

That will be all for a week or so as I am away for a few days this week including a visit to Railex at Aylesbury next weekend. However, progress hopefully should be a a little quicker after that, although Hilary has organised a holiday with friends on the IOW in early June and I also have to give the workshop it's annual coat of wood protection.

[Stan Owen]

Good Evening Jol

 

I had a long chat with John Redrup recently at the York Show and he brought me up to date both with the current status of the original London Road layout and your medical issue.  Seeing the photos here of how you have incroporated the "through-station" boards into your new layout my only response is that most of the able-bodied modellers I know would be very hard pushed to produce anything with the speed and quality of your work.

 

It is quite thought-provoking that the original London Road, built in my garage by John Redrup, Eric Ramsey, John Nellist and myself was started in 1983 so it has now reached its 40th birthday.  I do hope that John gets the layout out on the circuit again if only on rare occasions.  I regret never having seen your extended version of the layout but I'll certainly be visiting this forum to keep informed of your progress.

 

I was also interested in your use of MERG modules to drive the servos.  The club in Leicestershire to which I now belong started a layout based on the Great Central, near to where I now live, in 2007.  This "roundy-roundy" incoporates two stations, one being based on Quorn and Woodhouse, the other a model of Swithland as it would have been had the GC not decided to build the station at Rothley instead.  Just before lockdown, I and another club member were press-ganged into taking on this dormant project and wiring it, amongst many others things, to an operational condition.  We decided to use MERG modules but in our case driven via CBUS which has enabled us to dramatically reduce the number of wires between the control panels and the baseboards.  For example, Swithland has 22 turnouts and 23 track sections and yet the entire control panel to baseboard connection is carried by a single 15-way dsub plus a 4-pin XLR connector for the CBUS voltage and twisted pair.  As I gave up P4 cos the bits got too small and moved into 7mm, I do sometime wonder just how and why I took on part of the responsibility for an N-gauge (urgh) layout!

 

I'll close now Jol by wishiing you the very best and I look forward to following your progress on these pages.  Keep safe and keep up the good work!

 

Very best regards, Stan

[Jol Wilkinson]

Hi Stan,

 

great to hear from you. Sorry about the delay in replying but today has been rather busy with long phonically from various people and then Hilary monopolising the pc on her various charity activities. Tomorrow I have a S4 Area group daytime meeting but will get back to you in a  pm soon.

 

Jol

[Stan Owen]

Jol

 

No worries and good to chat with you.  I'm now retired and find I have far less free time than when I was working full time - I have no excuse now to duck out of all those household jobs I guess!

 

Very best regards, Stan

[Brassey]

Hi Jol, going right back to the beginning of this thread, can you remember if you had any instructions for the BM Whale tender conversion?  I’ve finally got round to building mine but have no instructions. Peter 

[Jol Wilkinson]

10 hours ago, Brassey said:

Hi Jol, going right back to the beginning of this thread, can you remember if you had any instructions for the BM Whale tender conversion?  I’ve finally got round to building mine but have no instructions. Peter 

Hello Peter,

 

the post on the LNWR Whale tender for the Precursor was on "LNWR London Road - Locomotives and rolling stock" thread. The photos are still there although later ones aren't.

 

I usually archive kit instructions in a folder but the ones from the Precursor kit aren't there. However, I found a set in the box for a BM Experiment 4-6-0. This was part built by a  late friend, Tony Osmond. I have attached scan of the single page of instructions. I also have another unbuilt Experiment kit with the Whale tender conversion, so will probably sell that one.

 

 

 

 

 

[Jol Wilkinson]

An update on London Road. All the track was nearly finished but a development has added some further work. Having finished the plain track running lines I decided to get the Steam Shed area done before I started the wiring. The rails leading to the loco shed were laid, on the assumption I would have to scratchbuild it.

 

I then stumbled over a laser cut kit for an LNWR Coal Hole and also discovered that a Webb Northlight Steam Shed kit is in the offing. So a quick rethink and I ordered the Coal Hole kit, but found I will have to modify it as the track spacing is too wide, the tank is wrong and there isn't a coaling facility for locos alongside the shed. This was done by pushing a wheeled tub onto a gravity operated, pivoted chute and tipping the tub up above the tender/bunker. I have drawn a template for the revised Coal Hole footprint  to work out the track alignment spacing. It is the white paper rectangle at the top of the picture.

 

 

The second track from the left with the unstained sleepers will have to be lifted and another point installed. The new line from this will run alongside the left of the Coal Hole so that locos can be coaled from the chute.The track from the left side of the point  in the foreground will slope up at 1 in 30 (as the prototype did) to feed the coal wagons into the building. The track from the left side of the further point will lead into the coal hole so that engines can be coaled directly from a wagon.

 

 

This shows the Cola Hole design. The raised track will enter from this end and extend for a short distance beyond. The kit appears to have been designed with RTR (Hornby?) track spacing in mind and is therefore too wide, as is the raised track section. However, is shouldn't be too difficult to adapt. The tank will need scratch building to reflect the LNWR design. However, it will be put to one side until the new track is made and installed and the rest of the layout wiring is done (this board is already wired as far as I can go).

[philip-griffiths]

Jol. Who is doing these kits please?

 

are you aware of the Townstreet plaster cast LNWR coal hole kit?  It has five brick ‘bays’ so may be too big. Had you thought about using something the size of Denbeigh shed coal hole?

 

regards. 

[Jol Wilkinson]

39 minutes ago, philip-griffiths said:

Jol. Who is doing these kits please?

 

are you aware of the Townstreet plaster cast LNWR coal hole kit?  It has five brick ‘bays’ so may be too big. Had you thought about using something the size of Denbeigh shed coal hole?

 

regards. 

 

Philip,

 

this is a MMR kit, a mix of ply and laser cut card.

 

I wasn't previously aware of the Townstreet Coal Hole which only appears in the new models section. It isn't referred to as a LNWR model and while the tank is more accurate than the MMR kit, the rest isn't, nor does it include the coal "chute" in the outside wall by the coaling stage.

 

The MMR kit is, I think, more adaptable than the Townstreet version. I am following the dimensions set out Jack Nelson's LNWR Portrayed.

 

I have also been studying LMS Engine Sheds, Vol. 1 - The LNWR. None of the kits available for Northlight engine sheds are near enough to F W Webb's design but I understand that anothe company is starting work on one.

 

Jol

[Brassey]

12 hours ago, Jol Wilkinson said:

Hello Peter,

 

the post on the LNWR Whale tender for the Precursor was on "LNWR London Road - Locomotives and rolling stock" thread. The photos are still there although later ones aren't.

 

I usually archive kit instructions in a folder but the ones from the Precursor kit aren't there. However, I found a set in the box for a BM Experiment 4-6-0. This was part built by a  late friend, Tony Osmond. I have attached scan of the single page of instructions. I also have another unbuilt Experiment kit with the Whale tender conversion, so will probably sell that one.

 

 

 

 

 

Thanks very much Jol. Sorry for posting in the wrong thread!

 

I too have an Experiment kit which also purportedly has a Whale conversion kit and between the 2 I have only one set of instructions to build the Cooke tender only. I’m also missing one Whale cast whitemetal top. I’ve contacted Brassmasters.  Don’t know if they’ll have one. Might mean my Experiment will have to run with a George tender. 
 

A little bird told me that John Redrup also has a Precursor kit. 
 

Be great to see both London Roads running.

[lezz01]

4 hours ago, Brassey said:

A little bird told me that John Redrup also has a Precursor kit. 
 

Be great to see both London Roads running.

He sure does. He also has a new website no longer hosted by the Scale4 soc.

 http://www.londonroadmodels.com/locomotives_pages/lnwr_locomotives.php

Regards Lez.

[Compound2632]

4 hours ago, Brassey said:

A little bird told me that John Redrup also has a Precursor kit.

 

Samson, Whitworth, and Improved Precedent, but no Precursor that I can see?

 

Nor a Whale Precursor, but there is a Precursor Tank.

[lezz01]

Sorry my bad.

Regards Lez.

[Brassey]

1 hour ago, Compound2632 said:

 

Samson, Whitworth, and Improved Precedent, but no Precursor that I can see?

 

Nor a Whale Precursor, but there is a Precursor Tank.

Now I didn't exactly say that LRM had a Precursor did I.  That's something that's been mis-concluded.   So to immediately quash any false rumors that LRM have one,  what I meant was that JR had acquired a Brassmasters kit of a Precursor.  Don't know if his has the Whale tender conversion kit.

[Compound2632]

6 minutes ago, Brassey said:

Now I didn't exactly say that LRM had a Precursor did I.  

 

No, indeed you did not, you clearly said John did. Also I was wilfully chosing to assume you were referring to a Webb Precursor rather than a Whale Precursor, which was naughty since the context had clearly been set by the discussion of Whale tenders. Also I was derailed by @lezz01's mention of the LRM website. At one time Brassmasters had a range of kits for Whale and Bowen-Cooke engines.

Edited August 2, 2023 by Compound2632