Hornby Class 56 - 2021

[Chris56057]

Just been browsing the Hornby website and have noticed that the two models of the 56 due to be released Winter 2021 have been moved back to Winter 2022-23.

https://uk.Hornby.com/products/br-class-56-co-co-56086-era-7-r30082

[atom3624]

Do you think it's possible they have been allocated 'x' amount of production time, and knowing this, have shuffled things around, to ensure 2007 Prince of Wales gets produced on time - before the 1:1 is in action?

 

Just a thought.

 

Al. 

[Chris56057]

1 hour ago, atom3624 said:

Do you think it's possible they have been allocated 'x' amount of production time, and knowing this, have shuffled things around, to ensure 2007 Prince of Wales gets produced on time - before the 1:1 is in action?

 

Just a thought.

 

Al. 

If that is the case, it would be a shame. Sometimes it feels like the D&E stuff gets pushed back in favour of the steam stuff.. 

Edited December 18, 2021 by Chris56057

[scottrains29]

Hopefully they are upgrading the 56 due to the upcoming competition (Cavalex and the Bachmann 69). Hornby have said they are upgrading their HST due to (as yet unannounced) competition so I wouldn't be surprised if they are looking at their other models too.

 

Adding servo operated roof fans, flush fan grills, improving lighting functions and using the 21 pin socket (as used on their sound fitted versions) would be easy improvements to start with.

Edited December 19, 2021 by scottrains29

[Hilux5972]

4 hours ago, scottrains29 said:

Hornby have said they are upgrading their HST

They haven’t officially released anything. 

[adb968008]

On 19/12/2021 at 06:56, Hilux5972 said:

They haven’t officially released anything. 

Neither has any of the competition, if there was any intention.

Edited December 27, 2021 by adb968008

[mdvle]

On 18/12/2021 at 12:46, atom3624 said:

Do you think it's possible they have been allocated 'x' amount of production time, and knowing this, have shuffled things around, to ensure 2007 Prince of Wales gets produced on time - before the 1:1 is in action?

 

It could also have been shuffled for something else that gets announced on the 10th in reaction to what they think competitors are doing/thinking of - like perhaps Lion getting not just announced but into stores, or something else.

 

A long shot may also be that order numbers are not where Hornby would like as the market waits on the Cavalex model (either to buy it, or to wait for some buyers to sell off their Hornby ones, or really outside chance Hornby announces an all new 56 on the 10th)

[adb968008]

7 hours ago, mdvle said:

 

A long shot may also be that order numbers are not where Hornby would like as the market waits on the Cavalex model (either to buy it, or to wait for some buyers to sell off their Hornby ones, or really outside chance Hornby announces an all new 56 on the 10th)

Hornbys priced theres at £207.. Cavalex is offering “under £200”

it could be there is a Mexican stand off here.

 

Bringing Hornbys release forwards to now, may result in poor sales, as suggested above, the market waits.

But…

 

Playing the waiting game, Hornby could choose to rain on Cavalexs parade and do a cheap one nearer to Cavalexs release.

 

tbh I think the Hornby model isnt bad, i’m happy to wait and see, and compare based on their merits. I’m not jumping in the “latest and greatest” boat just because its there.

 

 

 

Edited December 28, 2021 by adb968008

[atom3624]

Indications are that the Cavalex 56 will raise the bar in many aspects those more familiar will define - see the specific thread for details also.

 

I have an older Super Detail EWS Hornby 56, which has had its faults, purchased used from a 'major retailer in the Merseyside area', but continues to perform as well or better than nearly anything I've purchased since - super smooth, relatively quiet, very large haulage capacity, can crawl well, and also achieve non-prototypical speeds (leaving spare capacity) - all very admirable attributes.

 

Personally I love the opening doors and rotating fans - I know many aren't that keen.  The fans have shown no indication of compromising the performance of my example.

Put mildly, I think the Hornby model offers a huge amount to the modeller, and all well-proven now.

Al.

[Melly]

On 19/12/2021 at 01:21, scottrains29 said:

Hopefully they are upgrading the 56 due to the upcoming competition (Cavalex and the Bachmann 69). Hornby have said they are upgrading their HST due to (as yet unannounced) competition so I wouldn't be surprised if they are looking at their other models too.

 

Adding servo operated roof fans, flush fan grills, improving lighting functions and using the 21 pin socket (as used on their sound fitted versions) would be easy improvements to start with.

 

My guess is that the crazy - bonkers decision to release the marginal interest Floyd livery has resulted in a glut of unsold 56's with retailers. Accordingly they've delayed the production of other Class 56 to free up production slots for other items.  Meanwhile, Cavalex will roll out the liveries that Modellers have been wanting but Hornby ignored: Original railfreight Grey, BR Blue etc. 

[adb968008]

10 minutes ago, Melly said:

 

Meanwhile, Cavalex will roll out the liveries that Modellers have been wanting but Hornby ignored: Original railfreight Grey, BR Blue etc. 

Hornby could very easily stop ignoring them, in the face of competition… like the Terrier, 66 (and to a certain point the 91).

 

 

[mdvle]

3 hours ago, atom3624 said:

Indications are that the Cavalex 56 will raise the bar in many aspects those more familiar will define - see the specific thread for details also.

 

It's not so much what has been promised, but until a company releases it's first loco they remain an unknown quantity.

 

Releasing a goods wagon is easy compared to releasing a reliable loco, and so while I am happy to see people supporting Cavalex there is some wisdom in waiting and seeing.

 

(it's not that I expect Cavalex to fail, just that it is a big jump for any company).

Edited December 28, 2021 by mdvle

[adb968008]

Rather than focus on the merits of an unknown one…

 

What are the flaws in the Hornby one (besides lack of the “right” paint on the “right” variant ?)

[Zunnan]

14 minutes ago, adb968008 said:

Rather than focus on the merits of an unknown one…

 

What are the flaws in the Hornby one (besides lack of the “right” paint on the “right” variant ?)

 

That awful close coupling mech for starters, and while on the performance sapping features there were the useless elastic band driven fans. Visually, I never liked the naff opening cab doors which don't seat properly when closed and there was no attempt at the different cab fabrications, just a token gesture on the lights and horn grille. Then there is Hornbys good old insistence on dinosaur age 8 pin DCC functionality. As much as I want a banger blue and LL Grid, I just can't bring myself to pre order them from Hornby. I've owned the Red stripe grids, but considering its a favourite class of mine I found they got scant little use and were eventually sold on in the hope that Cav can do a proper Grid. At least they're not as bad as the Dapol or Farish N gauge models and are an improvement on the old Mainline model, so they have that going for them I suppose.

[NickL2008]

Don't forget the awful "Sunken" roof grills, and those awful plastic handrails, and the cab Ariel's just looked awful as well, and on later examples the lifting covers are missing as well, all small things but if Hornby wish to stay competitive with the Cavalex model they should (but probably won't) address these issues

 

NL

[atom3624]

Love the opening doors, and the rotating fans - power sapping?

Any more power and mine will out-haul my Hattons 66 and Dapol 68 !!

 

It's faster than them as well if needed, and at least as smooth on the slow crawl - fantastic performer.

 

Love 'gimmicks' when they work, and mine do!

OK, I've a couple where the doors don't quite close properly (Class 50 for example).

 

Al.

[Zunnan]

4 hours ago, atom3624 said:

Love the opening doors, and the rotating fans - power sapping?

 

Love 'gimmicks' when they work, and mine do!

OK, I've a couple where the doors don't quite close properly (Class 50 for example).

 

Not power sapping, performance sapping; they're not quite the same thing. The band drive basically kills any benefit you get from the flywheels, for what exactly? The effect is not worth the performance tradeoff, perhaps if they spun at a more realistic speed, or consistently...but they don't. As a result of the band drive my two Grids both cogged awfully until I stripped out the fan drive. If that was the only problem I'd have persevered. As harsh as it sounds, I'd rather put my faith in an unknown quantity and have no class 56 until it materialises.

[atom3624]

I must have a strange exception.

 

Power sapping? Performance sapping?

 

I see no discernible difference between my 56 and my 60 - one with, one without.

 

Flywheel effect?  Slam on the anchors and hope it rolls on a few cm or so?  Very crude treatment that - OK, I know you didn't write that.

Band cancelling out the smoothing of the 'smoothed motor'? - again no difference between my 56 or 60, so no argument there from my evidence.

 

Not noticed any dirt in the grilles either, and I hardly operate in an electronics manufacturers!  Mine's on the floor in my garage, for now - until major bills are paid off including the mortgage!

You've observed and justified your opinions - I can see no reason to remove with mine, and heartily enjoy 'the gimmick' - we'll go our separate ways at that.

Al.

Edited December 30, 2021 by atom3624

[markw]

It's the inconsistent running of the fan drive that gives random feedback to the controller, if you are not using a feedback controller it has little affect on the running.

[atom3624]

2 hours ago, markw said:

It's the inconsistent running of the fan drive that gives random feedback to the controller, if you are not using a feedback controller it has little affect on the running.

Thanks Mark.

There had to be something - I've read of so many 'abstainers' to this gimmick which I love!

 

I'm running with an old HM2000 - Googling it's operation, mine's the older type (pulse modulation?) pre silicon controlled rectifier.

 

Some reports state the HM2000 affects coreless motors, others say doesn't - not saying the 56 is, but it seems a bit of a minefield the transformers / controllers out there.

 

Thanks for the discussion.

Al.

[Zunnan]

I think the last time I used a feedback controller was more than 20 years ago, though my Model D is admittedly at least that old nowdays. I experienced the same poor running qualities with the model W we use at the club for the N gauge layout and also my backup combi, though admittedly I didn't bother chipping them for DCC. Oddly enough, I've had a few class 31s which have essentially the same belt derived fan drive and I never had the running so affected with them. Mazak rot aside, they ran fine, and I didn't have the same problem with the close coupling mech either; it was just the 56.