Renovating the Replica Railways ex-LMS open coach

[teeinox]

I model late 50s/early 60s Western Region and at that time the Western Region had quite a few ex-LMS coaches on its books which it used on internal trains mixed with ex-GWR coaches.  Ex-LMS coaches also frequently appeared in the South-West on inter-regional trains, either as complete sets or as portions coupled to ex-GWR stock.  So I felt I needed some Stanier coaches to form an LMS “Inter-Corridor” set to represent a portion through working.  It consists of four coaches, a BSK, CK, SK and BSK.  The CK is a Bachmann “Porthole”, the rest are Hornby Stanier period III.

 

But as Jenkinson and Essery tell us, the LMS built almost as much open (in LMS parlance “vestibule”) as compartment stock.  While I suspect that to provide adequate luggage capacity it was mainly compartment stock that went to the South-West, I still hankered after a vestibule coach to complete my collection of typical LMS types.

 

Suitable models of LMS vestibule coaches are hard to find.  Both Hornby and Bachmann offer vestibule coaches, but of rare types built in tiny numbers.  That left only one R-T-R candidate, the venerable late 1980s Replica Railways 12222, a model of the D1915 excursion vestibule coach.  They were common enough; the LMS built over 370 of them.  So, one being on offer at the bargain price of £19 including postage, I took the plunge.  On unpacking, the coach appeared to have never been used.  Intriguingly, inside the box I found this tiny slip of paper:

 

                                                                              

 

The provenance of this model has been discussed on this forum, and the problems Replica Railways had with Kader, who manufactured this model, are well documented on the Replica Railways web-site under “Company history”.  However, the involvement of Dapol is a new one to me.  Can anyone shed any light?

 

Here is a side-view of the model:

 

 

The body moulding is rather good, apart from the strangely huge roof ventilators.  But the lack of flush windows stands out.  The paintwork finish is good, though the lining below the cantrail is crude and that below the windows is too low.  The interior is a fine moulding, though warped and fractured in places.  The underframe is not bad; most trussing is there, the most visible parts of the brake gear are present, but the dynamo is just terrible.  As for the wheels, they are plastic and undersize, and the tension lock couplings have to go.

 

Here is a photo of the coach end:

 

 

The roof is nearer a 3-arc than the proper Stanier elliptical shape, and it is slightly too low.  There are moulding lines across the buffers and headstocks.  The gangway connectors look reasonable, but the outward bowing of their sides is a problem which needs a solution.

 

Dismantling the coach was not easy.  The body is held onto the chassis by three spigots on each side and it took a lot of heart-stopping bending of the body to release them without damage.  But as a bonus, the trauma caused the rather cloudy glazing to fall out.  So, here is the kit of parts I had to play with, including a blow-up of one of the huge roof ventilators:

 

 

In deciding what alterations to make, I had to think what my aims were for what is a 30 year-old model.  I settled on producing a layout coach upgraded enough to look acceptable running with the Hornby coaches.  And its role would be as a strengthener, which meant that it would be at the end of the rake where the differences in lining and roof profile would not be so noticeable.  I was also reluctant to replace components unless absolutely essential because this was to be a minimum cost project.  It was going to be a case of what I could do simply, with the help of what the bits box might provide!  So read the next instalment to find out how I got on.

[Steamport Southport]

If memory serves me right it was one started by Airfix and was meant to go with the LMS Dining Car.

 

I'll have a look in the Hammond - Model Train books if there is any information. Found it!

 

LMS Period 3 Vestibule 3rd (mixed origin) 1990

 

Airfix had planned to add this to their series of Stanier Period 3  coaches but it had not reached production stage when Airfix went into liquidation. Hayes redrew the roof and Kader made it for him.

 

12221 LMS 9174

12222 BR M9245M - not made

12222 BR M9088M

 

 

Jason

Edited April 23, 2022 by Steamport Southport

[andyman7]

22 minutes ago, teeinox said:

On unpacking, the coach appeared to have never been used.  Intriguingly, inside the box I found this tiny slip of paper:

 

                                                                              

 

The provenance of this model has been discussed on this forum, and the problems Replica Railways had with Kader, who manufactured this model, are well documented on the Replica Railways web-site under “Company history”.  However, the involvement of Dapol is a new one to me.  Can anyone shed any light?

 

 

 

9 minutes ago, Steamport Southport said:

If memory serves me right it was one started by Airfix and was meant to go with the LMS Dining Car.

 

I'll have a look in the Hammond - Model Train books if there is any information.

 

 

 

Jason

The LMS Vestibule 3rd and Dining Coach were Airfix models that had been tooled but not issued when Airfix was taken over by Mainline Railways (Palitoy). They were not issued by Mainline and when Palitoy's parent group disposed of its toy and hobby interests Dapol bought the remaining stock and the ex-Airfix tooling. So the issue of this model by Replica had to be facilitated through Dapol. I'm not sure why Dapol didn't just issue the model itself - it did do so with the Dining Car, but possible some work was required that Replica were willing to fund.

The Replica version is the only time the model was actually issued. It never reappeared in the Hornby range (which is where the ex-Airfix tools ended up) or in the Bachmann range (which is where the Palitoy/Mainline tools ended up).

[Butler Henderson]

Hornby acquired the ex Airfix tools from Dapol or rather some of them and that is rather an complicated story in itself. This tooling having never appeared in the Dapol range be it either through actually being produced or as was more common a simple repackaging of an alraedy produced model could it be the tooling remains with Replica if it still exists.  The Palitoy tools ended up with Bachmann because they owned  by Kader.

[markw]

I don't  think Airfix could have done any tooling for these, they appear to have an underframe based on the Palitoy LMS p1 coaches and body shape and roof vents from the collett sunshine stock, presumably Airfix research was used  for the interior and arrangement of the windows.

[andyman7]

35 minutes ago, markw said:

I don't  think Airfix could have done any tooling for these, they appear to have an underframe based on the Palitoy LMS p1 coaches and body shape and roof vents from the collett sunshine stock, presumably Airfix research was used  for the interior and arrangement of the windows.

They definitely did some of the work even if just the drawings, it's very likely that to complete the job the parts bin got raided

[BernardTPM]

I agree the style of tooling and assembly method (types of clips, etc.) is very much Mainline rather than Airfix. Visually they're not the same as those on the other Airfix Staniers. That's in contrast to the LNER N2 tooling which looks Airfix, even though it was never sold as such.

[Butler Henderson]

According to Pat Hammond in British Model Trains Catalogue the N2s had been produced (by Sanda Kan), but arrived in the UK after Airfix had gone into receivership. Regarding this topic there is a comment that "Airfix had started work on the Stanier all 3rd with Cheong Tak and the 12-wheel diner with Sanda Kan. Palitoy did consider them but passed on them. Replica had the all 3rd completed and released of them, probably through Cheong Tak while Dapol released the 12-wheel diner through Sanda Kan." Dapol acquired the rights to use the Sanda Kan tools.

Edited February 7 by Butler Henderson

[teeinox]

20 hours ago, markw said:

I don't  think Airfix could have done any tooling for these, they appear to have an underframe based on the Palitoy LMS p1 coaches and body shape and roof vents from the collett sunshine stock, presumably Airfix research was used  for the interior and arrangement of the windows.

Many thanks for this information: it explains a lot.

 

I immediately had a look at my Collett Sunshine coach.  You are absolutely right.  The roof profile is the same and the same roof ventilators too.  Neither right for an LMS coach.  What a strange decision!  Saving on tooling costs, I suppose.

 

Body shape, too, pretty much the same, as well as the type and position of the door furniture.