Signals - Present-Day Semaphore, Lights and Repeaters

[phil-b259]

On 06/05/2023 at 15:56, Mike_Walker said:

 

 

 

CJ13, the home approaching the station from the Crewe direction used to be a LMS U/Q arm on a LNWR post until it too suffered from rot.  It's replacement is this superbly over-engineered specimen.  Whereas the old one was in the 6' beyond the bridge, this has a gantry structure which looks capable of supporting the QE2 whilst the arms are GWR lower quadrant - well, Shrewsbury is now in NR's West & Wales region.  Look closely and you'll see the arms are actually supported by two 4" posts fishplated together; presumably it was thought the traditional single post is insufficient today.

 

 

And talking of over engineered signals how about T26 at Truro which appeared in the background further up the thread.   Here it is in close up.  It was installed when the Falmouth branch was upgraded and allows trains to depart in the Down direction from the Up platform but I've never seen the like anywhere else.  At least it makes cleaning the arm and lenses easy and safe, you'd really have to work hard to fall off that!

 

One needs to remember that the railway industry does NOT have an exemption to the legislation called  'Working at Height Regulations' 

 

Working at Height is regarded by said legislation as anywhere where you may be able to fall 1m or more (so if you are working on the ground but next to a hole 1.2m deep then you are actually 'Working at height' and the regulations kick into play).

 

Said regulations say the preference is to lower (or raise) whatever you are working on down (or up) to ground level where it may be worked on safely (hence why NR likes fold down signals) but if that cannot be done then the regulations expect substantial railings (and kickboards) to stop people (or tools) from falling and the use of those 'mobile working platforms' so as to avoid the need for ladders. If this is not possible then climbing harnesses must be used - but ONLY if the structure has sufficiently strong fixtures which you may attach yourself too. If a structure lacks this then it must NOT be climbed. 

 

Both the signals pictured are more than 1m above the ground so as 'new builds' they naturally require all the railings plus a stout and secure platform from which a worker can carry out their tasks.

 

Edited May 8, 2023 by phil-b259

[St. Simon]

50 minutes ago, ruggedpeak said:

Central Wales 18/08/2021 at Marsh Brook crossing (with the vertical wigwags!). Semaphores either side of the LC.

 

 

 

Hi,

 

Just done the scheme plan to convert those to Colour Lights :)

 

Simon

[Mike_Walker]

I accept that, but I can show you many signals installed since T26, both semaphore and colourlight which do not have such a platform arrangement.  For example the two which were installed at the London end of Banbury's down platform in connection with the Reading works.

[ruggedpeak]

2 minutes ago, St. Simon said:

Hi,

 

Just done the scheme plan to convert those to Colour Lights :)

 

Simon

Simon,

 

Surely sad face!!

 

😢

[Michael Hodgson]

1 hour ago, The Stationmaster said:

So for example ST Erth's Up Inner Home Signal seen below in my September 2022 photo has gained a ladder cage, modern handrails in profusion, plus the 'idiot proofing' number plate for those who don't know it's actually the Inner Home Signal

 

 

This is a photo of the same signal I took in the Summer of 1993 and it was almost certainly unchanged fro the day it had been erected and had probably killed or injured nobody in the intervening decades.  it actually looks like a proper Western tubular steel post bracket signal in every detail with the second design of enamelled signal arms.

 

 

 

 

 

 

Another significant difference form the earlier photo is the new fence at the end of the platform and the removal of the barrow crossing.

The barrow crossing had presumably ceased to be needed anyway, but the signalman and station staff may well have had good reason to use the ramp for access to the box.  Of course that sort of thing isn't allowed any more for safety reasons, but a signalman should be in a position to know whether there's any danger from approaching trains, and station staff should be able to work it out by reference to the signal.

[The Stationmaster]

26 minutes ago, Michael Hodgson said:

Another significant difference form the earlier photo is the new fence at the end of the platform and the removal of the barrow crossing.

The barrow crossing had presumably ceased to be needed anyway, but the signalman and station staff may well have had good reason to use the ramp for access to the box.  Of course that sort of thing isn't allowed any more for safety reasons, but a signalman should be in a position to know whether there's any danger from approaching trains, and station staff should be able to work it out by reference to the signal.

There is, and was I believe, a separate  crossing over the branch to access the signal box,  In addition there is a new path from the station building with enough lighting along ot to shame Blackpool installed more recently which probably cost a fortune.  But the Signalmen don't appear to use it as they park opposite the 'box and only use the crossing there.  More expenditure overkill.

[phil-b259]

8 minutes ago, The Stationmaster said:

There is, and was I believe, a separate  crossing over the branch to access the signal box,  In addition there is a new path from the station building with enough lighting along ot to shame Blackpool installed more recently which probably cost a fortune.  But the Signalmen don't appear to use it as they park opposite the 'box and only use the crossing there.  More expenditure overkill.

 

What about signalmen (or visitors) who don't drive?

 

More widely, adequate lighting for staff is generally a big problem for staff (and it should help with preventing those trips and fall incidents which the RIDOR people get very concerned about) - particularly as ever more stuff gets pushed into the overnight period so the principle of providing a well lit walking route is a sound one even if it may be a bit OTT in this particular case

Edited May 8, 2023 by phil-b259

[The Stationmaster]

On 07/05/2023 at 11:04, Rugd1022 said:

More Worcester and Droitwich Spa...

 

 

 

 

 

One of my photos of Droitwich Spa's Down Main Intermediate Home Signal 30 years ago.  This signal replaced what had originally been a 3 doll timber bracket structure which at one time had the third arm to repeat the Inner Home Signal's two available routes as well as the route into the Down Loop.  I do have a very poor scan of the signal in that state having acquired a photo of it in an auction lot alas it's not good enough to post.  But together I do have some stages in the hostory of that particular signal.

 

[The Stationmaster]

9 minutes ago, phil-b259 said:

 

What about signalmen (or visitors) who don't drive?

 

More widely, adequate lighting for staff is generally a big problem for staff (and it should help with preventing those trips and fall incidents which the RIDOR people get very concerned about) - particularly as ever more stuff gets pushed into the overnight period so the principle of providing a well lit walking route is a sound one even if it may be a bit OTT in this particular case

Definitely OTT as the path is also well illuminated by thelatform lights on one side and some of tha e carpark lights on the other side.  Here it is. coml;ete with hand rails pn each side - until you get to the far end where it has no hand rails and no lights (did they run out of money?)

 

[Mike_Walker]

Interesting that that photo shows the present arrangement where the bay was slewed a couple of years ago to lengthen it to take 4-car units which also widened the platform.  As part of this work, the bay starter had to be resited but you will note it still has its original ladder and hoop arrangement whereas all the other signals at St. Erth have been modernised.   Just proves there are exceptions for every rule.

 

Good news for lovers of "real" or "proper" signals, St. Erth is not included in the current Cornish resignalling scheme.

[The Stationmaster]

If you haven't got anywhere else to put a signal save money and bolt it to the signal box.  LNWR stop signal, presumably originally the Up Starting signal(?), at Dolau (Central Wales Line) 1967.

 

Sorry about the poor quality but I was still using Kodak film at that time and I thinl the train it was taken from had just started to move.

 

 

 

[phil-b259]

24 minutes ago, The Stationmaster said:

Definitely OTT as the path is also well illuminated by thelatform lights on one side and some of tha e carpark lights on the other side.  Here it is. coml;ete with hand rails pn each side - until you get to the far end where it has no hand rails and no lights (did they run out of money?)

 

 

 

Possibly related to a risk assessment in where a slip / trip could easily land you in the path of a train arriving into the frequently used bay platform (as opposed to a rarely used siding).

 

 

[eastglosmog]

Apologies for the quality of this one - it was taken with a box brownie back in 1967. The signals at the end of Marchwood loop on the Fawley Branch, they date from 1960 when the loop was lengthened:

This was taken from the southeastern end of the loop, at the Pumpfield Farm footpath crossing.  As far as I know, there have been no changes to the signals since I photographed them.

Edited May 8, 2023 by eastglosmog
Added location taken from, which I had forgotten

[KeithHC]

On 05/05/2023 at 21:41, Michael Hodgson said:

 

Four aspect colour light signal with four feathers and call-on at Gloucester on the line from South Wales, reading to the platforms and through roads.

 

This type of feather shares the centre bulb with a row of four more bubs for each of the four routes; some other designs of feather would have completely separate rows of 5 bulbs.

Wow thanks for these photos. I have walked behind this signal for years and wondered what it looked like.

 

Keith

[Mike_Walker]

Just a thought...  Does anyone know if there is/was ever a signal with all six "feather" positions used?  The old "Nelson's Hat" on the Up Westbury approaching Reading had 5 but I'm not aware of any with 6.

[Northmoor]

On 05/05/2023 at 19:05, Claude_Dreyfus said:

I think we need a photo thread on present-day (or in use over the last 10 years or so) signals.

 

I don't know whether the OP wants to expand the remit of the thread, but while I find the historic photos equally interesting, it isn't what he originally proposed/requested (see above).

[melmerby]

Are there still any instances of a semaphore home signal with a colour light distant beneath it  (on the same post)?

 

I remember may years ago one such on the Rugeley line heading towards Birmingham, now long gone.

[iands]

Another selection from Gilberdyke.

 

Gilberdyke's G53 'off', Down Goole.

 

Gilberdyke's G52 and Oxmardyke's O9R with passing 158905. The two disc signals are G31 and G32 on the Up Hull.

 

 

[St. Simon]

56 minutes ago, melmerby said:

Are there still any instances of a semaphore home signal with a colour light distant beneath it  (on the same post)?

 

I remember may years ago one such on the Rugeley line heading towards Birmingham, now long gone.

Hi Keith,

 

I don’t believe so, there used to be one in Scotland somewhere a few years ago, but that was removed, and even then I think the colour light head was not in use.

 

Simon

 

 

[Rugd1022]

This one always makes me chuckle like a naughty school boy...

 

[Michael Hodgson]

7 hours ago, KeithHC said:

Wow thanks for these photos. I have walked behind this signal for years and wondered what it looked like.

 

Keith

Photos were tqken from the public footpath

[TheSignalEngineer]

9 hours ago, The Stationmaster said:

If you haven't got anywhere else to put a signal save money and bolt it to the signal box.  LNWR stop signal, presumably originally the Up Starting signal(?), at Dolau (Central Wales Line) 1967.

 

Sorry about the poor quality but I was still using Kodak film at that time and I thinl the train it was taken from had just started to move.

 

 

 

There was a very unusual gantry at New Street No.5 box.

https://www.warwickshirerailways.com/lms/lnwrbns_str1911.htm

The box was destroyed in an air raid in 1940 (my Grandad was sheltering in Suffolk Street tunnel when the bomb dropped) but the gantry remained. A new wooded box was built in the same position and operational in only three weeks.

[Claude_Dreyfus]

13 hours ago, Northmoor said:

I don't know whether the OP wants to expand the remit of the thread, but while I find the historic photos equally interesting, it isn't what he originally proposed/requested (see above).

Whilst I did start up this thread, I do appreciate these things take on a life of their own and I cannot be too prescriptive in which course it takes, I wanted to try to keep the scope as up-to-date as possible (ideally reflecting what is around and about now, but in reality anything this century). 

 

Older pictures are interesting, and certainly have their place here in terms of providing comparison or context, but I personally would rather the thread did not become overrun with them as it dilutes what I feel the thread is trying to achieve...i.e. showing those interesting survivors, various quirkiness as well as the 'bread and butter' we all take for granted.

[2251]

7 hours ago, TheSignalEngineer said:

There was a very unusual gantry at New Street No.5 box.

https://www.warwickshirerailways.com/lms/lnwrbns_str1911.htm

The box was destroyed in an air raid in 1940 (my Grandad was sheltering in Suffolk Street tunnel when the bomb dropped) but the gantry remained. A new wooded box was built in the same position and operational in only three weeks.

There really were some oddities at old New Street. No 3 deserves that over-used word, "unique":

 

https://www.warwickshirerailways.com/lms/lnwrbns_str1848.htm

[iands]

Some more from Gilberdyke.

 

Gilberdyke's G14 (on the left), Up Hull towards Selby, and the back of G48 (on the right) on the Down Hull. G48 has obviously been renewed, hence the, as previously commented on other examples up-thread, 'over-engineered' appearance. 

 

The same two signals, but photographed from the opposite side.

 

And a close up shot of G48 above the bushes.