WCRC - the ongoing battle with ORR.

[johnofwessex]

2 hours ago, didcot said:

I have and had back background checks carried out prior to starting my apprenticeship. They even sent a a "special policeman" to interview one of the guys who supplied a reference. 

We also used to get spot checks at the gate by the Civil Nuclear Constabulary. We also had several hoax bomb threats that had people out of cars and mirrors underneath before entering site.

More recently some travellers set up camp, but they were gone in in less than a morning. Your not going to argue with armed Police. 

 

Dungeness Station, last time I was there had a list of numbers to call in the shop, one of which was the Police at the Power Station who were willing to turn up if needed, ie some gobby Chav suddenly finds himself facing two nice gentlemen with machine guns.

[stewartingram]

Years ago now, I went with my best mate (sadly now deceased) on one of our trainspotting day trips, in his car.

Now D (I won't reveal his name) was working at the then RAF Oakington, in charge of building maintenance. I think he was MoD, not a contractor. His workmate was in a similar post at RAF/USAF Alconbury, and he decided to call there on the way past for a very quick chat about something. We pulled up at the gatehouse, where a USAF guy, complete with gun, (and I was assured by D that they were loaded) checked our credentials. I showed my local constabulary id (I was in the Home Office working at Police HQ on their comms). All well so far, we were waved in.

D had been to this office many times, and parked outside for 5 mins, and then we were off. "Look at those, I'm going for a few pics" he said, as we diverted off to some parked trucks, on the edge of the runway area. Don't forget we are on an armed USAF military base, in a period when security was tight (recent IRA activity etc). Off he goes, without a care, complete with camera taking pics of these military vehicles! Luckily no one came after us.

[Northmoor]

All military security (and probably similarly in other fields) changed once mobile phones gained cameras.  It always used to be instructed to switch them off but this became unenforceable; nowadays there are more instructions about people never being unaccompanied etc.

 

Anyway, I am contributing to a serious thread drift.......

Edited December 28, 2023 by Northmoor

[The Stationmaster]

6 hours ago, didcot said:

I have and had back background checks carried out prior to starting my apprenticeship. They even sent a a "special policeman" to interview one of the guys who supplied a reference. 

We also used to get spot checks at the gate by the Civil Nuclear Constabulary. We also had several hoax bomb threats that had people out of cars and mirrors underneath before entering site.

More recently some travellers set up camp, but they were gone in in less than a morning. Your not going to argue with armed Police. 

At one time I was doing a job which had securty implicataionsnad after I'd been doing it for some months 'they' syudden;y realised that I should have been 'Positively Vetted' before being allowed to do it.  It was all then compley ted very rapidly although I suspected that as I had dealt with some more 'specialised' members of BTP on various matters in the past they knew me and that probably smoiothed things alo,lnf.

 

However even with that rating when I was WR Freight Planning Officer one of my staff dealt with some extremely 'sensitive' traffic (it was always accompanied by armed personnel although exactly what the train carried varied so I understand) not even I was allowed access to certain of the details.  Quite what we were supposed to do if he ever went sick or whatever appeared not to have been thought about as nobody else in the office had any contact details for the offices he worked with.

[Aire Head]

8 hours ago, Bucoops said:

 

Having MP5/M16/Whatever the literal weapon of choice was,  trained in your general direction whilst sniffer dogs and so on go through your vehicle (which is full of tools that could be considered weapons!) was always great for the anxiety

 

I did some work a few years ago at RAF Menwith Hill and the sniffer Dog would get thrown into my car every morning while I chatted to the two MP7 toting chaps accompanying him. One Monday as the dog was thrown into the back of my car I realised with a chill up my spine that a tin containing blank ammunition was under my seat. Dog completely ignored it but I confessed to my sin to be on the safe side and was told it happened more often than you'd think given that everyone goes shooting around that neck of the woods.

[Stoke West]

8 hours ago, The Stationmaster said:

At one time I was doing a job which had securty implicataionsnad after I'd been doing it for some months 'they' syudden;y realised that I should have been 'Positively Vetted' before being allowed to do it.  It was all then compley ted very rapidly although I suspected that as I had dealt with some more 'specialised' members of BTP on various matters in the past they knew me and that probably smoiothed things alo,lnf.

 

However even with that rating when I was WR Freight Planning Officer one of my staff dealt with some extremely 'sensitive' traffic (it was always accompanied by armed personnel although exactly what the train carried varied so I understand) not even I was allowed access to certain of the details.  Quite what we were supposed to do if he ever went sick or whatever appeared not to have been thought about as nobody else in the office had any contact details for the offices he worked with.

Would that have been on a  Riverside or  possibly Friary to Severn Tunnel Junction with the personnel passing in brake vans ( with ammunition boxes strapped on the outside ) in the consist , seen it twice two years following , in October 

[adb968008]

I have a collection of mugs and hats from various interesting places.

 

Anyways.. my boss from the states wants to visit this super secret customer. We ask if a yank could get through security, without any clearance levels and remarkably they say yes, subject to some details provided, name, address, role, passport, date and shoe size.

 

Yes shoe size. 
 

He remarks why, to which we say, well its all hi tech.. fingerprints, retina scans can all be overcome, but you cannot change the size of your feet, or your weight that easily, so they will scan your foot.

The big day comes, we arrive, turn in our tech, walk through the scanners, wait in the secure area.. then they let us in, the boss bless him says what about the feet scanning ? We look and laugh, as he recalls what we said weeks earlier and was excited to see this tech in action.

 

At which point we say, nah, thats rubbish, your going onto a building site, we need shoe size for steel toe capped boots for you.

 

 

Edited January 4 by adb968008

[adb968008]

On 27/12/2023 at 20:51, MarkC said:

It's often said that the worst-painted house in a street belongs to a decorator, the dirtiest to a cleaner, so... 😉

 

Mark

Ive a very messy model railway…..so i must be…

[The Stationmaster]

5 hours ago, Stoke West said:

Would that have been on a  Riverside or  possibly Friary to Severn Tunnel Junction with the personnel passing in brake vans ( with ammunition boxes strapped on the outside ) in the consist , seen it twice two years following , in October 

No.

[Bernard Lamb]

On 28/12/2023 at 14:27, Bucoops said:

I've had to access to quite high security areas at times, be it HMG, HMP, RAF, and a particular favourite, USAF. 

 

Having MP5/M16/Whatever the literal weapon of choice was,  trained in your general direction whilst sniffer dogs and so on go through your vehicle (which is full of tools that could be considered weapons!) was always great for the anxiety. What cracked me up on some sites was when the person escorting me wasn't allowed somewhere but I was - "just go and fetch key number 25 from that rack over there then bring it back then we can go and open area 51 which I will have to watch through the window". Very weird.

 

I'm amazed I haven't had to sign the Official Secrets Act. 

A favouite of mine was Upper Heyford. One day, after several hours with two US Marines covering every step I took, I had finished my job, in the armoury on that occassion, hence the extra close surveilance, and was being driven back to the gate house. My civilian driver drove as near as he could to an open hangar and I got a glimpse of the stealth bomber. The story was that it had flown in the night before and the RAF did not know it was here. I asked my MOD contact and he said that we knew it was there but would not tell the Yanks that we could follow it. Allies but not exactly close friends.

I always found it interesting that different establishments had different security levels and procedures. Not always in line with the general perception of the importance of the site. 

Re your comment on who could go where. I was involved with a construction  job that had a high level of vetting. A friend of mine just happened to be installing some equipment in the same building. His Gemany boss was interested in visiting the site to see how the equipment performed in service. He was most upset when he was denied accesss.

Bernard

[Siberian Snooper]

On 28/12/2023 at 23:05, The Stationmaster said:

At one time I was doing a job which had securty implicataionsnad after I'd been doing it for some months 'they' syudden;y realised that I should have been 'Positively Vetted' before being allowed to do it.  It was all then compley ted very rapidly although I suspected that as I had dealt with some more 'specialised' members of BTP on various matters in the past they knew me and that probably smoiothed things alo,lnf.

 

However even with that rating when I was WR Freight Planning Officer one of my staff dealt with some extremely 'sensitive' traffic (it was always accompanied by armed personnel although exactly what the train carried varied so I understand) not even I was allowed access to certain of the details.  Quite what we were supposed to do if he ever went sick or whatever appeared not to have been thought about as nobody else in the office had any contact details for the offices he worked with.

 

There used to be a MoD freight train that regularly parked in the loop at Keyham station, a member of P&DMRC and a chief in the navy photographed it and built a model of it. He submitted it as an entry for a competition at the Bristol show, and the sh1te hit the fan. Said train had accommodation for armed security staff, I will say that the sensitive bit of the train had lots of wheels and used to regularly derail on one of the curves in the yard, until they relaid it with staggered joints. These days they use commercial equipment.

[Michael Hodgson]

On 28/12/2023 at 14:27, Bucoops said:

I'm amazed I haven't had to sign the Official Secrets Act. 

 

I've signed it dozens of times, and always wondered what difference a bit of paper made to whether or not I might disclose something I shouldn't.  Not that anything I dealt with would have been of much interest to the bad guys.

[Stoke West]

1 hour ago, Siberian Snooper said:

 

There used to be a MoD freight train that regularly parked in the loop at Keyham station, a member of P&DMRC and a chief in the navy photographed it and built a model of it. He submitted it as an entry for a competition at the Bristol show, and the sh1te hit the fan. Said train had accommodation for armed security staff, I will say that the sensitive bit of the train had lots of wheels and used to regularly derail on one of the curves in the yard, until they relaid it with staggered joints. These days they use commercial equipment.

There was an exercise with that at Avonmouth

[The Stationmaster]

On 30/12/2023 at 09:31, Siberian Snooper said:

 

There used to be a MoD freight train that regularly parked in the loop at Keyham station, a member of P&DMRC and a chief in the navy photographed it and built a model of it. He submitted it as an entry for a competition at the Bristol show, and the sh1te hit the fan. Said train had accommodation for armed security staff, I will say that the sensitive bit of the train had lots of wheels and used to regularly derail on one of the curves in the yard, until they relaid it with staggered joints. These days they use commercial equipment.

That's the one but I can't tell what it was carrying as I'd have to arrest myzelf. or worse..

On 30/12/2023 at 10:37, Stoke West said:

There was an exercise with that at Avonmouth

Are you sure that it was't something else.  There was no need at all for that train to get anywhere near Avonmouth (except running up or down Filton Bank) and I doubt those with an interest in it would be very keen to send it down there.  

 

Something at Avonmouth would probably more likely be a flask wagon with no particular worries about security - 0unless you're into discarded overalls and gloves.

[Stoke West]

38 minutes ago, The Stationmaster said:

That's the one but I can't tell what it was carrying as I'd have to arrest myzelf. or worse..

Are you sure that it was't something else.  There was no need at all for that train to get anywhere near Avonmouth (except running up or down Filton Bank) and I doubt those with an interest in it would be very keen to send it down there.  

 

Something at Avonmouth would probably more likely be a flask wagon with no particular worries about security - 0unless you're into discarded overalls and gloves.

Didnt have the high security middle bit but had support coaches that go with it to simulate it

[adb968008]

On 30/12/2023 at 09:56, Michael Hodgson said:

 

I've signed it dozens of times, and always wondered what difference a bit of paper made to whether or not I might disclose something I shouldn't.  Not that anything I dealt with would have been of much interest to the bad guys.

So i signed something similar for the UAE government, a decade back.

Forgot all about it, life moved on, next job, project etc.

 

I turned up at Tel Aviv airport in 2019, whereby immigration took me to one side and asked me about it…, you can imagine my surprise.

 

Some secrets are obviously not so secret.

We seem to have drifted a long way from Carnforth.

Edited December 31, 2023 by adb968008

[Siberian Snooper]

Not quite, the train with many wheels probably passed through Carnforth on occasions.

 

 

[adb968008]

I wonder, if Chilterns Mk3’s could be a useful lifeline to wcrc… sliding door, cdl fitted, retention tanks all done and ready to scrap…. 

 

much easier to fit a few Polish airpumps to the steam fleet than fit all that lot to 100 mk1’s..

 

Certainly would do the job on many S&C jobs etc, which is the bulk of the none-WHL work… theres at least 2 x10 rakes +5 spares there they could get, even take the DVTs and put generators in etc.

Edited December 31, 2023 by adb968008

[adb968008]

4 hours ago, The Stationmaster said:

That's the one but I can't tell what it was carrying as I'd have to arrest myzelf. or worse..

Are you sure that it was't something else.  There was no need at all for that train to get anywhere near Avonmouth (except running up or down Filton Bank) and I doubt those with an interest in it would be very keen to send it down there.  

 

Something at Avonmouth would probably more likely be a flask wagon with no particular worries about security - 0unless you're into discarded overalls and gloves.

Are we talking about this…

 

both flickr/not mine

 

of which its modern equivalent is this…

https://www.accurascale.com/products/kua-nuclear-flask-carrier

 

Theres a zillion pictures of it.

Edited December 31, 2023 by adb968008

[Siberian Snooper]

I couldn't possibly say!!

 

 

[The Stationmaster]

And I definitely cannot say what it might, or might not, have carried

[adb968008]

I’m sure torpedos and missiles werent built on the quayside.

 

😀

[rodent279]

This is possibly one of the most glorious examples of thread drift on RMWeb!

[jjb1970]

I was on a container ship field testing a containerised vertical launch SAM system. We all had to sign the official secrets act etc, which seemed stupid when the forward hatch covers were empty save for two containers, one of which had a radar radome and the other had a mushroom farm of missile cells obvious to all the container drivers and stevedores in the ports we visited and with BAE - Lockheed on the boxes.

[adb968008]

1 minute ago, jjb1970 said:

I was on a container ship field testing a containerised vertical launch SAM system. We all had to sign the official secrets act etc, which seemed stupid when the forward hatch covers were empty save for two containers, one of which had a radar radome and the other had a mushroom farm of missile cells obvious to all the container drivers and stevedores in the ports we visited and with BAE - Lockheed on the boxes.

It could always be smoke and mirrors.

yours may have been a placebo and the real test in the bland unknown.

(see my earlier post about the boots).