Unknown H0 Freight Cars identification.

[BR60103]

NMRA RP for axle length (HO) is 1.035".

 

The couplers you asked about are called NMRA or X2f.  Both names are inexact. They were developed by an NMRA committee in the 1950s, but never approved by the membership. The X is for experimental, 2f is a sequence. They were released into the world with no fees or licensing requirements. This meant that all the manufacturers jumped at the chance for a standard coupler. I heard that almost none of them match the original dimensions. The original springing method (integral plastic) was not always used. 

The Airfix version was noticeably larger and not compatible.

The NMRA coupler can be made to work with Hornby Dublo couplers by trimming off the horn, but a lot of functionality is lost.  

The uncoupling ramps were an afterthought.

Because of the sideways springing, wheels get forced against the rails and the oversized flanges pick at rail joints if the couplers are truck mounted.

 

 

 

[long island jack]

9 hours ago, melmerby said:

110 & 33"

 

What about axle length?

I've noticed they aren't all the same. I assumed 1" (25.4mm") was standard but some aren't!☹️

i've never had issue with axle length, but i've only replaced wheels in Athearn, Roundhouse and Walthers cars, and 110 x33" fit them all

[doctor quinn]

2 hours ago, long island jack said:

i've never had issue with axle length, but i've only replaced wheels in Athearn, Roundhouse and Walthers cars, and 110 x33" fit them all

Same here, even with Con-cor and Life-Like - I think all manufacturers use the NMRA standard. One thing I noticed with Athean 4 bay center flows is that Kadees are a bit low with 33" wheels but bang in with 36" wheels ( which are correct for 100t cars)

[long island jack]

1 hour ago, doctor quinn said:

Same here, even with Con-cor and Life-Like - I think all manufacturers use the NMRA standard. One thing I noticed with Athean 4 bay center flows is that Kadees are a bit low with 33" wheels but bang in with 36" wheels ( which are correct for 100t cars)

don't tell him all the secrets, we had to learn the hard way!!!😁

[melmerby]

17 hours ago, BR60103 said:

NMRA RP for axle length (HO) is 1.035".

Kadee quote 1.018" for theirs.

[melmerby]

I've converted all theabove wagons to metal wheels.

I'm baffled by the tank cars, a couple had replacement metal wheels but 3 still had the original plastic, all were scalle 33" wheels but the lettering on the end of the tanks quite clearly says 36" wheels, hardly surprising as a tank full of water would, including the chassis/tank, be well over 75 tons.

 

I've bought some more S/H cars, this time from Hattons, before they close in the UK, all have plastic wheels and most have the X2F couplers or equivalent, including what I assume is an early Roundhouse kit which has a diecast chassis, The receptacle cast into the base plate wont take a Kadee as it is too narrow, so some work needed. 

(The coupler head is the same as the others but the mounting is different)

The rest have plastic versions of Kadees, which I will swap.

[BR60103]

Would a Kadee #4 fit? It has a very old shank design -- there is a small pin in the middle and two pins on the side of the box that the coupler is pulled back against.

 

(I've never seen Kadee #1, 2 or 3  or even seen a reference.)

[doctor quinn]

15 hours ago, melmerby said:

I've converted all theabove wagons to metal wheels.

I'm baffled by the tank cars, a couple had replacement metal wheels but 3 still had the original plastic, all were scalle 33" wheels but the lettering on the end of the tanks quite clearly says 36" wheels, hardly surprising as a tank full of water would, including the chassis/tank, be well over 75 tons.

In the 'blue box' era Athearn and Roundhouse fitted 33" plastic wheels to all their freight cars regardless of what the prototype had.

[melmerby]

8 hours ago, BR60103 said:

Would a Kadee #4 fit? It has a very old shank design -- there is a small pin in the middle and two pins on the side of the box that the coupler is pulled back against.

 

(I've never seen Kadee #1, 2 or 3  or even seen a reference.)

No idea.

The shaft of the coupling is about 1/8" wide with a hole about half that of a Kadee to locate it and a notch where a small coil spring for centring goes.

 

I've got a bulk packof #148s which I'm using for any with a standard #5 size box, those with the original #5s often need repacing as the spring doesn't often work properly after many years.

[melmerby]

Picture of the couplers

The two on the left aren't quite the same, the hole is fractionally different size so the smaller one wont fit on the pin on the larger one.

You can see how different the Roundhouse one is, it's also diecast.

 

 

Another one of the cars puzzles me. It is a shorty flat car from IHC but it says underneath Mehano Made in Slovenia.

It's in the correct box so I assume (some?) IHC products were made by Mehano.

 

EDIT

Another X2F

 

Edited January 18 by melmerby

[BR60103]

Keith:  I can't confirm it, but I'm sure that IHC had its early products made by Mehano.

 

[John M Upton]

8 hours ago, BR60103 said:

Keith:  I can't confirm it, but I'm sure that IHC had its early products made by Mehano.

 

 

Correct. There were a number of models including a couple of really bad locos made by the Mehano factory that turned up under various brand names, IHC, Model Power, even Lima I think.

 

The Alco C628 was a particular horror, I bought one once, not only did the loco self destruct in transit, so did the packaging!

[Oldddudders]

On 02/01/2024 at 03:14, BR60103 said:

if the couplers are truck mounted.

Important difference. US trains prosper with truck/bogie-mounted couplers, since there are no buffers. UK models have buffers, and thus the body-mounted coupler, preferably with a cam mech, works better if you want realistic gaps between vehicles. . 

[melmerby]

Amongst the S/H kits I purchased was a Roundhouse Gondola.

 

As mentioned the chassis is die cast as were the coupling (now replaced with Kadee) and the trucks, which are sprung.

However I haven't fathomed how to assemble it and get the springs into place. The instructions don't help as there is no text, just pictures of it assembled.

I managed to get the wheels in and with difficulty, springs on one side but when I went to the other side, it moved a bit and the springs came out again☹️

 

The kit was unbuilt but it did also contain a pair of ready wheeled plastic trucks, so I might use those.

Shame really as it would be nice if the sprung trucks could be used. I might try again if I can work out a plan to keep the springs in place until it is fully assembled.-

 

I don't know how old it is but there is a product list included and the high sided Gondola was listed at $2.50

A die cast kit of an 0-6-0 steam switcher was $14.50, all included.

 

Edited January 24 by melmerby

[Talltim]

Going back a bit in the thread. Moloco and Tangent make kits

e.g. https://www.tangentscalemodels.com/product/undecorated-kits-srs-4600-covered-hopper/

https://www.tangentscalemodels.com/product/undecorated-kits-no-couplers-prr-shops-g41a-coil-car/

https://www.molocotrains.com/collections/freight-cars/undec

Edited January 24 by Talltim

[BR60103]

I remember the sprung trucks.  I suggest that the sideframes be assembled and the springs installed before the wheels are put in.  There should be enough movement to do this -- twist the sideframes up and down.

I offer again the suggestion that a length of thread be put through the springs before you try to install them. Pull out gently after it's all together.

 

My first HO kit was by Athearn. The coil springs had been replaced by a rubber block, shaped like a "B" to represent the springs. This was a devil to install as it didn't compress and hung up on the sprogs.

 I forget the count, but I think there are 5 or 7 springs on each side of the prototype.

 

[davknigh]

On 19/01/2024 at 05:59, Oldddudders said:

Important difference. US trains prosper with truck/bogie-mounted couplers, since there are no buffers. UK models have buffers, and thus the body-mounted coupler, preferably with a cam mech, works better if you want realistic gaps between vehicles. . 

Truck mounted couplers are generally associated with lower quality equipment when found on freight stock.

 

Cheers,

 

David

[steve1]

14 hours ago, davknigh said:

Truck mounted couplers are generally associated with lower quality equipment when found on freight stock.

 

Cheers,

 

David

 

Agreed. I chopped them off and made a body mount if I was keeping the trucks or, more usually, dumped the trucks entirely and fitted a body mount for a Kadee.

 

Some cheap (& nasty) locos had truck mounted couplers but these were best avoided completely anyway.

 

steve

Edited January 26 by steve1

[melmerby]

talking of couplers

The McKean Kit, A PS-1 40' Boxcar (nice one, plenty of detail & well moulded.) has these couplings which are different to the ones shown in the instructions:

 

 

The mounting is the same as an E-Z (shown on the diagram) or Kadee but as you can see it seems to be a non working attempt at a Janney.