Woundering about scottish landscapes

[Grant Newhouse]

Hey there everyone. I'm planning on makeing a OO9 layout based in the north highlands of scotland. I live in canada and dont really know much about the landscape of northern scotland. I was wondering weather or any one has any info or even better pictures/ links so i can try to get a feel for the landscape. I want my layout to represent a NG line that takes loaded coal wagons down the hill to a small quay, jetty, dock for transhipment. If any ones knows of some locations like this it would be much apreciated.

 

Thanks

Grant

[John B]

Grant -

 

Bit of a big question there! You might want to alter your layout plans, though, to take into account that coal wasn't mined anywhere in the Scottish Highlands... Slate or timber would be a much more logical cargo.

 

For scenic inspiration, I'd go googling. The scenery varies radically from desolate and rocky (NW, Sutherland, Wester Ross, etc) to bleak and boggy (Caithness) to hilly and forested (Speyside) to vast wide open spaces. The coastline also varies dramatically, so you need to narrow down your locale a bit. Searching photo collections on Flickr might be a good start.

[pH]

Bit of a big question there! You might want to alter your layout plans, though, to take into account that coal wasn't mined anywhere in the Scottish Highlands... Slate or timber would be a much more logical cargo.

Not strictly true - coal was mined at Brora until 1974. However, I would agree that slate, some other mineral or timber would be more likely. Grant - if you use (for example) Fotopic or Flickr for photographs or Google Streetview, you should be able to get a reasonable idea of the scenery.

[Pinkmouse]

Yup, coal mining would likely be in the Ayreshire area amongst others. Still quite pretty and hilly, but bear in mind that in the 19th and early 20th centuries, mining was a much messier business than today, and because of that, one coalfield very much resembled another. You could be in Scotland, South Yorkshire, Northumberland or Wales, and apart from the accents of the miners, see not much difference

[Pennine MC]

Hey there everyone. I'm planning on makeing a OO9 layout based in the north highlands of scotland. I live in canada and dont really know much about the landscape of northern scotland.

 

Grant, dont take this as being obstructive but as some of us are currently doing a bit of navel gazing (here, if you're at all interested), can I ask you a question? If you dont know much about the area, how do you know you want to model it? As I say, I'm not trying to be difficult, I'm just trying in wider terms to understand the psychology behind the query - and I will say 'thanks' for an answer

[sulzer27jd]

Hey there everyone. I'm planning on makeing a OO9 layout based in the north highlands of scotland. I live in canada and dont really know much about the landscape of northern scotland. I was wondering weather or any one has any info or even better pictures/ links so i can try to get a feel for the landscape. I want my layout to represent a NG line that takes loaded coal wagons down the hill to a small quay, jetty, dock for transhipment. If any ones knows of some locations like this it would be much apreciated.

 

 

Grant not only was there limited coal extraction from the Highlands there were also very few narrow gauge lines. I think from the variety of replies you will see that no-one is being negative and if you are set on the Scottish Highlands there are possibilities. If it has to be narrow gauge then one of the best examples would be the Lochaber Narrow Gauge http://en.wikipedia...._Gauge_Railway. There were also timber railways but these would be more in the Central Highlands, between Perth and Inverness, simply because there is very little timber in the far north!

 

I suggest you use Flickr and type in Scottish Highlands - that will take you to a good selection that will give you an feel for the area.

 

Yup, coal mining would likely be in the Ayreshire area amongst others. Still quite pretty and hilly, but bear in mind that in the 19th and early 20th centuries, mining was a much messier business than today, and because of that, one coalfield very much resembled another. You could be in Scotland, South Yorkshire, Northumberland or Wales, and apart from the accents of the miners, see not much difference

 

That's a good point, but even the accents could vary as often whole groups of men would be moved from one area to another. There was at least one village in Yorkshire that had a pipe band for example!

[Guest stuartp]

Geological map of Scotland here. Picking up on John B's point you'll notice that the different types of geology form a series of roughly SW-NE bands across the country, and each will affect the appearance of the modern landscape. There are some links there to go digging further if you want to learn about Moine Thrusts etc.

 

You won't find coal anywhere in the igneous or metemorphic rocks. Igneous rocks are molten rocks which have been pushed through existing rocks, metamorphic rocks have been compressed and heated so any coal deposits will have been destroyed in that process. For coal you want sedimentary rocks, and even then only some of them. The main Scottish coal deposits are around Ayrshire, Central Belt and Fife (the light blue Carboniferous sediments in the middle) with odd bits around Campbletown on the Kintyre peninsular (Carboniferous again) and the aforementioned Brora which seems to be on a fringe of Jurassic sediments surrounded by much older rocks.

 

Having said all that, there's colliery traffic on my layout which is set firmly in the non-coal bearing Ordivician/Silurian purple bit at the bottom ! Reason ? Firstly I grew up in Barnsley and both my grandads were miners so I couldn't really not have one. (Proving Sulzer's point, one moved from Scotland in the 1930s and one from South Wales, the pit village just outside Coventry where they settled and where my mum and dad grew up had men and accents from every coalfield in the country.) Secondly, I started building an Ayrshire coalfield layout some years ago so some of the buildings and other equipment are already started.

 

If you really want to do coal then it's possible but certainly atypical. I don't think it would shout 'Scottish Highlands' at most viewers. There's another thread on here somewhere about Scottish narrow gauge lines which might be worth searching for too.

[JZ]

As has been mentioned, there is no coal in the Northwest Highlands and as slate is also sedimentary, that would also be an unlikely cargo. And, sad to say, there are very few trees there either.

But let us look at what is there.

Fish.

Fairly busy ports at Lochinver, Ullapool, Kinlochbervie and Badcall Bay and many villages along the coast would have had at least couple of boats working out of them at one time.

Sheep.

The reason for the Highland clearences. Mainly for wool I believe. But this traffic would be seasonal, though transport of animals could be year round.

Peat.

The main fuel up in these parts and getting popular again for heating and cooking.

Marble.

No, I havn't lost mine. Marble is quarried between Inchnadamph and Elphin. The white blotch on Google earth if you look. High quality stuff too and much of it is exported to Italy.

Stone.

Although there is little trace of quarrying, the builders must have got their stone somewhere locally. There is no reason to say that a particular type was much sought after.

 

For transprtation to sea you would need something like a Clyde Puffer. These plied the coast carrying anything and everything. At many places they would have been beached at low tide to offload their cargo. Other places would have had a small wood or stone jetty.

This is the one at Scourie.

 

If you do model NW Sutherland, this is the sort of scenery there is. You can just make out the marble quarry near the centre of the photo.

[Grant Newhouse]

Thanks everyone, the reason i wanted to model a scottish narrow gauge line is because 1: i have some scottish blood in me and im very proud of it, 2 i was going to build a welsh coal rout but when i went down to the loacal model shop i found a snow plow for a CPR sd-40-2 for a doller, so i picked it up for my sd-40-2. But when i got home i put the plow by my Campbeltown & Machrihanish 0-6-2 and thought that the plow looked really good on it, so i decided to model a scottish railway as i understand there is more snow in scotland then in wales? again thanks for the help, i really like the picture of NW Sutherland. I may have to change my local. I really like coal traffic so i want to try to stay with it, but i never thought about marble traffic befor. Ahain thanks for all the help everyone.

 

Grant

[Pennine MC]

Thanks everyone, the reason i wanted to model a scottish narrow gauge line is because 1: i have some scottish blood in me and im very proud of it,

Can't argue with that I suppose

[pH]

Grant, if you've already got a Campbeltown & Machrihanish 0-6-2T, you don't need to look any further for a prototype railway. The Campbeltown & Machrihanish was originally built to connect coal pits near Machrihanish (see stuartp's post above) to Campbeltown harbour for shipping.

[JZ]

Of course you can make your own history. For inspiration look at Ted Polet's Craigcorrie & Dunalistair. Seeing it in the mid '70s inspired me to do 009 and when I look at the latest developments I often hanker for another 009 layout.

[Oldddudders]

Of course you can make your own history. For inspiration look at Ted Polet's Craigcorrie & Dunalistair. Seeing it in the mid '70s inspired me to do 009 and when I look at the latest developments I often hanker for another 009 layout.

For some of us Older Ghytts, P D Hancock's Craig & Mertonford was the essential freelance Scots narrow gauge, regularly featured in RM in the late '50s/early '60s. So it is no surprise that Mr Polet pays tribute to it here

 

http://www.009dutch.nl/main/pages/epdh.htm

 

I think we all recognise the validity of the OP's wish to honour his origins, and these layouts show it can be done in NG with distinction.

[Bernard Lamb]

You can go even further north and model a prototype. Try Orkney. You might well be the first to model this line. Operationally very limited it's true, but you could develop your own history.It would particularly suit a person with a liking for big ships and a hatred of trees.

Bernard

[scottishlocos]

Hi Grant

 

You may want to look at the puggy line in lochaber for inspiration it ran from Fort William to Loch Treig

it was used for the constriction of the hydro electric and aluminium plant there it went

right up the mouintainside over 1200ft plenty of snow there in winter too.

 

regards

 

Dave

[JZ]

You can go even further north and model a prototype. Try Orkney. You might well be the first to model this line. Operationally very limited it's true, but you could develop your own history.It would particularly suit a person with a liking for big ships and a hatred of trees.

Bernard

 

Toyed with this myself at one time or another. A line running from Stromness, through Kirkwall, east across Mainland then south across the Churchill Barrier to St Mary's Hope. Possibly 3ft gauge and connected by sea to the proposed HR extension from Thurso to Gill's Bay.

[Grant Newhouse]

Thanks guys, i looked AT SOME PICS OF Orkney and i think it would be an interesting plae for a railway. I really like the lochaber aria (google images) and i think i may have to get the 'ol modelers license out and give the puggy some competition. And SNOW! a reason to justify the very large plow on the front of my 0-6-2! Again thanks for all the info and advice!

[JZ]

Information about Orkney is here. Not a great deal of snow due to the Gulf Stream, but it is not unknown and it would be wise to be prepared.

[flubrush]

Information about Orkney is here. Not a great deal of snow due to the Gulf Stream, but it is not unknown and it would be wise to be prepared.

 

Or you might want to look at the Outer Hebrides with Lord Leverhulme's attempts to industrialise the island of Lewis.

 

http://www.bbc.co.uk/scotland/islandblogging/blogs/005132/0000008950.shtml

http://www.bbc.co.uk/scotland/islandblogging/blogs/005132/0000008950.shtml

 

the railway was definitely planned and the Pentand Road on Lewis was built on what would have been the trackbed of the line.

 

Jim.

[flubrush]

Information about Orkney is here. Not a great deal of snow due to the Gulf Stream, but it is not unknown and it would be wise to be prepared.

 

Or you might want to look at the Outer Hebrides with Lord Leverhulme's attempts to industrialise the island of Lewis.

 

http://www.bbc.co.uk/scotland/islandblogging/blogs/005132/0000005802.shtml

http://www.bbc.co.uk/scotland/islandblogging/blogs/005132/0000008950.shtml

 

the railway was definitely planned and the Pentand Road on Lewis was built on what would have been the trackbed of the line.

 

Jim.