luke_stevens Posted January 7, 2011 Share Posted January 7, 2011 I can guarantee you, however, that parents outside this hobby won't feel that £50 is a fair price by any stretch of the imagination. In 1979 RRP for E2 was £10.75 which equates to £40.70 (by RPI) or £64.50 (by average earnings)Things weren't always as cheap back then as we'd like to believe! Luke Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
luke_stevens Posted January 7, 2011 Share Posted January 7, 2011 I don't understand this obsession with RRP. There is a price which, for example, Hamleys can charge the well-heeled tourists and which may be justified by the high property costs, staff wages etc in the middle of London. There is a price which the "box-shifters"(often vilified on here) can charge which presumably reflects a low mark-up offset by large sales volumes and low running costs. We don't know the prices that Hornby or their wholesalers charge the different types of retail operation, nor the conditions they impose ( area of display, requirement to stock other Hornby products etc). It would also seem sensible to me to start off by charging what you think the market will stand. If that price turns out to be too high then you can reduce it. If you could have got an extra 10 or 20%, then the stock will sell out quickly and you'll soon see it on eBay etc with the speculators raking in the profits. Personally, I'd rather see that extra money going to Hornby to produce more of what I still see as bargain price superb scale models than to the spivs. As so many people have said, if you don't like the price you don't have to buy, but is there any chance the whingeing can stop? Ed I know a retailer who say he's sold a number of items to Hamleys at RRP, when he had stock and they didn't, which they have sold at a higher price still! But you raise an interesting point: What is RRP meant to represent? I'd suggest it is based on what a small family owned toyshop / modelshop would charge to make a reasonable return on stock that turns over at a slow but steady rate. Suggestion; Why doesn't Hornby abolish the RRP altogether and let retailers sell what they want at what they want? That would make things interesting... Luke Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
JeremyC Posted January 7, 2011 Share Posted January 7, 2011 So whose going to buy their kids a Thomas the Tank at £50? Well going by what my 13 year old son tells me about some in his class, possibly the ones who buy their Children £100 jeans; £100 Trainers; a £120 ear ring [yes really, and that was one of the boys!] and £400 iphones! [we're not talking 'rich kids' at a private school here and no he doesn't have any of these!] As others have noted our RTR prices are still a bargain compared to the Continental prices even allowing for the fact I think many Continental models are still higher quality than British [that's not saying modern Hornby/Bachmann are bad] To get back to the original subject of this thread, this is the first year for some time that I find much of interest to me in the Hornby range [modelling Scottish Ex LNER] and hope fully a move away from Hornbys Londoncentric atitude of the last few years. The B1 is very welcome. I asked the Bachmann representative at Model Rail Scotland 2 years ago if they were considering upgrading the chassis of theirs and was told they had no plans as new prototypes sold better. In view of that I see Hornby's model as a replacement not a duplicate. The Gresley suburban coaches are certainly useful. I had thought it possible they would do BR standard types so they would also suit their Ex LMS tanks, but they've come up trumps. I wonder if they will allow for doing the articulated twins in the tooling of the underframes? Gresley full brake, typical! I've just completed an ex Ian Kirk one. Probably will consider getting one even if it matches the mistakes of the exisiting ones. One other model I see as interesting as a follower of the Waverley route is the A3 as Coronach, one of the Carlisle 4! I notice a few shops are advertising this with a GER tender!!! As I say seems a good year to me [providing the money holds out] Jeremy Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Belgian Posted January 7, 2011 Share Posted January 7, 2011 Incidental when the Hornby A4 came out in 1979 it was £19.95 which is £120 (2008) using average earnings. Not too far from the current £134.40 of A4 Dominion of Canada' R2910. I'm not sure that anything has really changed... Luke The A4 certainly has. The modern tooling one is far removed in quality from the one launched in 1979 - yet (as shown) it's very little more in current-value pounds: I think it's far better "value"*. JE * I use the word "value" under advisement: this is my perception of the word: others may have a different perception. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ozexpatriate Posted January 7, 2011 Share Posted January 7, 2011 Suggestion; Why doesn't Hornby abolish the RRP altogether and let retailers sell what they want at what they want? That would make things interesting... I don't know if Hornby dictates any pricing "rules" regarding the prices their retailers charge. Based on variations in pricing, I would say that retailers appear to have a fair degree of flexibility to sell at whatever price they want. Many seem to sell at a low price point initially then raise the price as popular stocks dwindle, or drop the price if they have inventory that won't move. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ozexpatriate Posted January 7, 2011 Share Posted January 7, 2011 There also appears to be a sort of 'Franklin Mint' () type of market which Hornby have clearly latched onto with some of their recent train packs and are going further into with such things as the 'Royal Mail' link. Presumably Hornby sees these things as 'added value' ranges - which translates to me as a bit of fancy themed packaging, a leaflet, and a hike in the price - but then I have always held a cynical view of such marketing gimics. Whether or not this sort of thing appeals to the more traditional sort of collector I don't know but it will presumably sell to some of them 'in order to complete the set'. Curiously enough on the reopened Hornby forum this week, a gent made the following statement: First and foremost I am a collector and not a modeller. I found the clear assertiveness of that comment interesting. The same day another person, along with a list of A4s he was trying to source, made the comment: I'm a collector of Class A4 While I readily admitted there certainly were people who were content to acquire model locomotives like safari trophies, perhaps they represent more collective buying power than I realized! It does seem to me that the copper windings and magnets don't achieve their collective destiny if some current doesn't flow through them, turning the wheels and moving the locomotive down the track to an observer's satisfaction but that's me. Each to his own. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
frobisher Posted January 8, 2011 Share Posted January 8, 2011 Suggestion; Why doesn't Hornby abolish the RRP altogether and let retailers sell what they want at what they want? That would make things interesting... And then you'll get people moaning that they don't know what the price of things are in the catalogue. RRP is after all only recommended. Retailers are free to price at whatever level they want, but the feeling is you always must be under RRP (though I've seen Hattons go over RRP on items in the past...). Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold The Stationmaster Posted January 8, 2011 RMweb Gold Share Posted January 8, 2011 My belief is that the corporate accountants have more to do with this year's new price list than any other factor. Are they trying to sell a sow's ear for the price of a silk purse? (Which I think is essentially Ravenser's assertion regarding his analogy to Märklin's behaviour.) Perhaps in some instances but the highly detailed items are consistently priced when compared with similar products for the US market. Hornby isn't in a financial freefall, but like most businesses, they are scratching and clawing to hang in there, and to avoid problems that have hit their bottom line in the last couple of years, they see a need to increase pricing. No joy for us there, but this is simply business. We seem to have a very similar view on the whole Hornby pricing 'thing' and just to add a bit more to it I learnt today from a well-known trader what is happening with Bachmann's RRP pricing for 2011 - it seems the day of the £135ish RTR 00 steam outline loco will be well and truly with us in 2011. Odd perhaps that both the big manufacturers are coming in at around the same figure but then as manufacturing is basically in the hands of a single group - 'Chinese walls' or not between its component parts - then maybe not so odd but merely representative of a fairly even run of costs. More relevant probably - as I and others have already wondered - is what will happen to the more relevant (to us) retail prices. Normal levels of retail discounting from the £130+ RRP mark are going to turn in a selling price in excess of £100 and some retailers reckon that at present price related resistance to selling price is cutting in at the £100 mark - so sales volume could well suffer even without the other economic influences predicted for 2011; the modeller will only buy a couple instead of three, or one instead of two. And as I wrote this another thought crossed my mind - is the ever increasing number of commissioned models playing a part in this price escalation? Buyers - us - seem to be showing a remarkable lack of resistance to the much higher (until now) prices that come with many of the commissioned models. that translates, I suppose - as a willingness to pay more for something we really want, for something a bit special. Now if I were an accountant I could easily translate that sort of market priced wish fulfillment across to my more upmarket range, even if my marketeers couldn't - just a thought Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
antrobuscp Posted January 8, 2011 Share Posted January 8, 2011 And as I wrote this another thought crossed my mind - is the ever increasing number of commissioned models playing a part in this price escalation? Buyers - us - seem to be showing a remarkable lack of resistance to the much higher (until now) prices that come with many of the commissioned models. that translates, I suppose - as a willingness to pay more for something we really want, for something a bit special. Now if I were an accountant I could easily translate that sort of market priced wish fulfillment across to my more upmarket range, even if my marketeers couldn't - just a thought I am an accountant, and this echoes my own thoughts(fear as a buyer) once the initial isolated limited edition at a "premium price" became a flood. I'm sure cost inflation/exchange rate movements is/are providing a push, but anyone running a business is likely to push the price to what the market will bear. Buyers are clearly saying they're prepared to pay higher prices for what they want, and the manufacturers are listening to what the buyers want. Higher prices will follow unless price resistance increases. Not the only factor, I'm sure, but I would suspect it is a significant influence. Everyone will have their own "value points" in deciding what represents good value for money, is cheap, or conversly is over-priced. What will matter to the manufacturers is when the collective buyers sentiment shifts. Whether that will happen I don't know as despite the current financial climate, there still appears to be plenty of people with the necessary disposable income. Colin Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charlie Posted January 8, 2011 Share Posted January 8, 2011 Re: The class 67 question, KMRC's newsletter had this to say.... Among the items added to our website were three versions of Class 67 Diesel and some Maunsell coaches. Hornby have advised that these models were listed by mistake and that they have been held over until 2012 at the earliest. We have removed these items from our website as we would not know how much they may cost by the time the 2012 range is announced! Wonder if someone revealed a 2011 christmas announcement a touch early.... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
dibber25 Posted January 8, 2011 Share Posted January 8, 2011 Well your first sentence only applies if you read Model Rail, if you don't then it will all be 'new'. I don't how you can make the statement that 'TBA' pricing is an indication of the speed it was compiled, unless you know that for a fact. It's far more likely to be a factor of when the publication had to close for publication and distribution, and it's always possible that the final pricing on some items was still to be determined at close of press. The Hornby press preview takes place before the Hornby reps or the retail trade receive the same presentation. As a rule, little price information is made available to the press, hence the limited price info in the report. The News section in Model Rail and in our Hornby publication was compiled by the same people at the same time hence the similarity. The publications are, however, aimed at two different markets. CHRIS LEIGH Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Belgian Posted January 8, 2011 Share Posted January 8, 2011 Not technically Hornby 2011, but as it's just apparently been re-released, the following may have a bearing on the subject of Hornby's pricing strategy and the position of limited run releases. In recent weeks examples of the "Southern Suburban 1957" train pack, currently listed at £220-49, has been selling at less than £100 on e-bay (the lowest I have seen is £88-05). Today I have had e-mails from both Rails of Sheffield and Kernow offering the sets at less than £100. This is a very good combination (in my opinion anyway) of a new type BR black "Schools" with lemaitre chimney and three Hornby Maunsell coaches - the latter consisting of one Composite with high windows as per previous releases and a Brake Composite and an all Third/Second with low windows. The latter are the only Maunsells with low windows in BR(SR) green to have been released so far and have been the most-requested versions in the SR-orientated forums I have seen. The run was limited to 2500, yet here it is, apparently having lost much of its value and the simultaneous release of it by two major retailers at a price under half of its list price indicates special pricing from Hornby. Was it overpriced (the stand-alone black "Schools" still sells for £104-50 at Rails) or just over-produced? Alternatively, if we boycott don't buy the new limited editions in sufficient numbers, will they later be offered at vastly lower prices?? Makes you (me) think. Any other views? JE Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ravenser Posted January 8, 2011 Share Posted January 8, 2011 Perhaps one way of placing any comments about pricing on a firmer footing than personal feeling is to look at market prices thrown up by a functioning market I've just taken a quick look at Hatton's bargain listings for other reasons. There aren't actually many locos listed as bargains at the moment , so anything that appears presumably is a poor seller needing price action to shift it, and ought to flag up where the market just won't bite. Both the Bachmann and Hornby 4MT 4-6-0 are being discounted at Hattons. That strikes me as significant, and suggests that the concern about duplication resulting in poor sales and poor commercial returns has substance. A parallel boiler Scot is also available as a bargain - again that was a product clash between Bachmann and Hornby, though Bachmann ended up with a different version of the Scot Three versions of the Schools are on bargain - I wonder if this points to why Hornby have re-released existing tooling for various 4-4-0s instead of tooling up a state-of-the art Director?. Two versions of Ivatt Flying Pig 2-6-0 are on bargain - I can't see any obvious reason why these don't shift. A Railroad A4 is on bargain (is there a limit to the A4 market??), as is the ex Lima Deltic in blue - a release which was widely regarded as pretty pointless. A pewter collectable of Lcomotion No 1 is going at a massive reduction . Evidently not many folk want to collect it.... I had forgotten tHornby had tried to release the Dean Single for £96 last year. That's on bargain at £69 Things that ran in small numbers show up as well - a class 44 Peak (only ten of them), Hornby 59 in Hanson and Bachmann 57 show up (57s seem to be staples of the bargain lists). Both that and the Bachmann 66 are in DRS , which flags another issue - some liveries don't sell. Obsolete BR and privatisation liveries are clear problems - anything in One livery has been difficult to shift, MML Mk3s have been almost as bad , and the First NW 153 is clearly facing problems A quick look at Rails of Sheffield finds another Schools, the FNW 153, various 47s (a class subject to endless duplication) and a clutch of Heljan class 15s. Rails are also showing under the heading "New Products now in Stock" a Hornby Brighton Belle It is also interesting that Hattons "Best Sellers" feature Railroad and bargain items very strongly , along with cheap Oxford Diecast. The only full price stuff featuring is the new Bachmann IPA , the Hornby 38xx, and the Hawksworth full brake. I may just have caught them at a lull in new releases , but to me , this suggests that people are not going for the big ticket items and are buying budget models. It is also a salutary reminder that there are plenty of models out there still selling for £50-£70, if you are prepared to be canny and focus on what you can get rather than go for what you fancy the moment it comes out. If a pattern can be drawn, it suggests that things that ran in limited numbers do sell in more modest numbers, that duplication does indeed hurt , and leave things in the bargain bin, and (interestingly) that the market for medium sized tender engines may not be quite so strong as we assume. It is also worth noticing that two of the more flagrent examples of recycled old tooling from last year (the Lima Deltic and overpriced Dean Single) have indeed stuck in the market Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold The Stationmaster Posted January 8, 2011 RMweb Gold Share Posted January 8, 2011 Perhaps one way of placing any comments about pricing on a firmer footing than personal feeling is to look at market prices thrown up by a functioning market I've just taken a quick look at Hatton's bargain listings for other reasons. There aren't actually many locos listed as bargains at the moment , so anything that appears presumably is a poor seller needing price action to shift it, and ought to flag up where the market just won't bite. It gets even more telling if you look at Hornby's own website where they are showing a DCC fitted 'Schools' (Wellington) at a lower price than Hattons while the non DCC BR Std 75XXX is just £2.48 more than the Hattons price. It gets even more interesting when they show both of these as 'Not In Stock, they may be at your dealers' - which suggests that Margate has dumped surplus stock into retailers at seriously reduced prices. It could be very interesting to see what Hornby's own list looks like by the end of the year Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fenman Posted January 8, 2011 Share Posted January 8, 2011 Both the Bachmann and Hornby 4MT 4-6-0 are being discounted at Hattons. That strikes me as significant, and suggests that the concern about duplication resulting in poor sales and poor commercial returns has substance. I think this is very curious, because over on the Dapol announcements thread not one person has criticised the duplication of the Western -- in fact, it seems to be universally welcomed, despite Heljan's existing model being pretty decent (cab errors notwithstanding). Or is it that we only don't like "duplication" when Hornby does it?! I think it's difficult to make an exact comparison, but Bachmann's B1 appears to me to be at least as flawed as Heljan's Western, albeit in different ways -- yet Hornby's new B1 is Bad, while Dapol's new Western is Good? Personally I welcome both announcements. I think some of your other points are well made -- the early disappearance of the Schools from Hornby's range is something I'd already commented on as being an indicator of slower sales than was hoped and, in turn, the likely explanation for the "new" 4-4-0s being Railroad. But I'm not sure I agree with you that high-priced items are poor sellers, at least on the basis of this analysis. The two high-priced items you've found are both Southern Railway packs, both released in the same year, in the immediate aftermath of the Schools being released, and following a heavy run of model releases when Southern steam modellers have never had it so good! It may be that one of the packs was a pack too far. For those who argue they were different eras and for different markets, I suspect I'm not the only person who bought both packs and play with them with equal relish. Paul Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest dilbert Posted January 8, 2011 Share Posted January 8, 2011 Re. market pricing ... Daughter #1 received her Masters degree twelve months ago ... her bank balance at that time was about €200 in credit - she now has a full time job and no stupid student loan type crap to worry about... did the Model Railway budget take a hit ? - of course - was it important, I don't care ... Daughter #2 has another two years to complete - same result expected... The nipper is at least three years away from any potential higher level education... Buy what you can afford.. the rest is irrelevant ... dilbert Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold The Stationmaster Posted January 8, 2011 RMweb Gold Share Posted January 8, 2011 I think this is very curious, because over on the Dapol announcements thread not one person has criticised the duplication of the Western -- in fact, it seems to be universally welcomed, despite Heljan's existing model being pretty decent (cab errors notwithstanding). Or is it that we only don't like "duplication" when Hornby does it?! I think it's difficult to make an exact comparison, but Bachmann's B1 appears to me to be at least as flawed as Heljan's Western, albeit in different ways -- yet Hornby's new B1 is Bad, while Dapol's new Western is Good? Personally I welcome both announcements. Paul I don't think anyone would be too likely to criticise 'yet another Western' (this will be the fourth!) as long as they hold out hope for what they consider an accurate body shape with decent mechanicals and consistent production quality. And I haven't noticed all that many criticising the arrival of a 'decent B1' - although that might change into a horde of screaming banshees if it comes to pass that Bachmann's plans also include a re-tooled B1. Looked at another way duplication is perhaps a natural consequence of the large manufacturers both looking, as they are bound to, for locos with good commercial opportunity which means a big market and ideally quite widespread prototype use (although Bachmann seems to have successfully gone against that grain). As the list of available unmodelled 'modern' large mixed traffic locos which are out there ready to be measured shrinks it is not unlikely that the two manufacturers will make the same, or very similar, decisions about what to add to their range a long time before commercial release. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pennine MC Posted January 8, 2011 Share Posted January 8, 2011 I think this is very curious, because over on the Dapol announcements thread not one person has criticised the duplication of the Western -- in fact, it seems to be universally welcomed, despite Heljan's existing model being pretty decent (cab errors notwithstanding). Or is it that we only don't like "duplication" when Hornby does it?! I think it's difficult to make an exact comparison, but Bachmann's B1 appears to me to be at least as flawed as Heljan's Western, albeit in different ways -- yet Hornby's new B1 is Bad, while Dapol's new Western is Good? Paul, TBH mate I think you're seeing what you want to see now. With that glib phrase 'cab errors notwithstanding', you're pretty much sidelining what a lot of folk see as its principal problem, and obviously the hope is that Dapol improve on that (whilst hopefully not introducing any other cockups, but that's another matter) Comparison with the B1 (which has a chassis that's viewed as obsolete) isnt just difficult, IMO it's completely spurious. FWIW, personally I'm not bothered either way about the B1, if I wanted one I'd still look for a decent Bachy one It is also a salutary reminder that there are plenty of models out there still selling for £50-£70, if you are prepared to be canny and focus on what you can get rather than go for what you fancy the moment it comes out. Drifting OT again but this underlines what I've always said when anybody says they're being 'priced out of the market'. Added to that is the secondhand market - my local shop probably deals in s/h more than most, but just in the last few months I could have had a Hornby 8F or Grange, Bachmann Standard 4 2-6-0, Fairburn tank or Deltic, all for £45 - 50. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andy Y Posted January 9, 2011 Author Share Posted January 9, 2011 Or is it that we only don't like "duplication" when Hornby does it?! I think it's difficult to make an exact comparison, but Bachmann's B1 appears to me to be at least as flawed as Heljan's Western, albeit in different ways -- yet Hornby's new B1 is Bad, while Dapol's new Western is Good? Personally I welcome both announcements. I certainly didn't hang my hat solely on the B1 issue in my earlier post http://www.rmweb.co....post__p__288351 but observed a pattern. A pattern of commercial opportunism at the expense of a manufacturer we often look to for more 'mundane' but useful items of stock. If this issue lay just with one release, an upgraded B1, it is unlikely I would have raised any comment at all as the marketplace merits it from someone. Dapol have clearly seen a section of the marketplace that is largely critical of the current Heljan offering (and a more vocal collection of critics than may apply to the B1). This topic has highlighted more concern over a release programme and particularly the pricing (information that was not available at the time of writing the announcement information) than I have ever seen. There are commercial pressures and subsequent price changes that will affect all manufacturers but in tight times all round* is this what we actually want to see? *I have now spoken to several retailers who feel that the price changes will have an affect on buying behaviour and are looking very carefully at the volumes ordered despite rapacious spending within the 'must have' marketplace. This may have the side effect of production runs taking longer to exit the manufacturers door in total which will surely have farther reaching implications for all. Most of the talk has been about us as consumers and the manufacturers; in the middle of this are our retailers who have some very difficult decisions to make in their pricing decisions - more products to stock and customers who may spend the same but buy less. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
MRDBLUE17 Posted January 9, 2011 Share Posted January 9, 2011 Andy makes a very valid point above, everyone is concerned about spending in the country at the moment and its not jsut the normal christmas blues period. We all have to spend more at the pump for fuel and energy prices in what has been a very cold period has also gone up. This is before you even get onto food prices and so on globally that again will eat into our funds. It is a fact that we are all poorer due to all these cost rises and it means we have a little bit less disposable income each month. One thing about pricing which is common during economic periods like this is that people who suceed in business particularly in retail can sell less products for more money and so long as they manage there cost base can still make good profits but this will mean they will order less and manufacturerers will produce less so we might not see so many bargains. I will wait to see what Bachmann are bringing out and then as normal will order at my usual model shop and I know I will get a good price that is competitive with some of the biggest retailers. The increased prices will mean that I might have to be a bit more selective but that is probably a good thing (well so the wife tells me!) Mark Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium John M Upton Posted January 9, 2011 RMweb Premium Share Posted January 9, 2011 Well ignoring the tedious ongoing pricing/RRP argument/whining and returning to the important topic, discussing the models that were announced, I have now settled on what I will be taking from the 2011 range. R3054 50008 Thunderer is a given. May shop about a bit for who has best price but to be honest this one will sell like hot cakes so will grab it when it first appears. R3045 73202 GatEx is also a given, it was used as the ghost train over the December snow period and saved a lot of proverbial bacon. The only thing I can see with this model is that I can see it being a very slow seller, nothing suitable for it to haul for a starter so it could be a staple of the bargain bins in 2012 along with the Olympic tat after about September! Brighton Belle - Yep I am having the Blue/Grey version (Pullman livery is just so clichéd.. ) but lets be honest here, it won't see the light of day until late 2012 will it? Therefore that will be budgeted for in next year's list not this years. Was considering taking some of the Mk2d aircon's in Intercity colours to replace my rake of Airfix ones I just spent two months repainting(!) but to be honest Hornby's take on Raspberry Ripple livery has never been great so will wait to see the goods on this one. Mind you Airfix Mk2d TSO's seem to be reaching £40 each now on Ebay!!!! Three NSE Vep's plus a few Bachmann 2-EPB's will take care of the rest of my modelling budget this year I reckon!! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
frobisher Posted January 9, 2011 Share Posted January 9, 2011 Alternatively, if we boycott don't buy the new limited editions in sufficient numbers, will they later be offered at vastly lower prices?? Or indeed just dropped as non-sellers... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
frobisher Posted January 9, 2011 Share Posted January 9, 2011 I don't think anyone would be too likely to criticise 'yet another Western' (this will be the fourth!) Fifth surely as there was the Trix one? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
D605Eagle Posted January 9, 2011 Share Posted January 9, 2011 I think this is very curious, because over on the Dapol announcements thread not one person has criticised the duplication of the Western -- in fact, it seems to be universally welcomed, despite Heljan's existing model being pretty decent (cab errors notwithstanding). Paul You have got to be joking! Its the worst cockup by Heljan by a long shot, including their "tubby" 47. It just looks plain wrong. I posted on another thread that I went to Warley some years ago purely to buy a couple of Heljan wessies to replace my crude Lima ones. I still have my Lima ones now. That doesn't say much for the Heljan one! People are overly pleased about the prospect of a new Dapol wessie because fifth time lucky, we might actually get a wessie that looks like a wessie. Jim Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Belgian Posted January 9, 2011 Share Posted January 9, 2011 Or indeed just dropped as non-sellers... No. These appear to be over-ordering at the manufacturing stage (2500 as a Limited Edition: if only 1500 sell there is an over-order of 1000 that must be liquidated . There wouldn't be any further manufacture anyway). My point, just to labour it, was that the "Limited Edition" market may be showing signs of over-exploitation . . . JE Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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