Jol Wilkinson Posted May 19, 2011 Share Posted May 19, 2011 £25 per hour?! May I ask which planet you reside on? Good grief, that's at least twice what most people expect professional model builders to earn. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
DavidH Posted May 19, 2011 Share Posted May 19, 2011 Yes, it's one of those strange quirks by which the hourly wage you can claim is often inversely proportional to your actual skills/experience. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ron Ron Ron Posted May 19, 2011 Share Posted May 19, 2011 £25 per hour?! May I ask which planet you reside on? Absolutely! I wouldn't get out of bed for that. Not everyone is on a minimum wage. For some, £25/hr is very low ....... Seriously, for quite a lot of people, that is quite low as an hourly rate. Try at least doubling it for incomes in my immediate neighbourhood. Good grief, that's at least twice what most people expect professional model builders to earn. Maybe I should employ some to build my model railway then. Sounds like a bargain. (that is meant as a joke) . Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
coachmann Posted May 19, 2011 Share Posted May 19, 2011 It's comical how everyone is an expert on what others should earn per hour. Solicitors are well paid.....I wonder how many there are in the UK? Professional model locomotive painters are nowhere near as well paid....I wonder how many there are in the UK? One reason for bringing this up is I was once accused of putting my charges up quite a lot one year and the accuser was a solicitor who earned more in an hour than I earned in a week. Do you know what he said?.....Model locomotives were only his hobby! Right...... Strangely it reminds of this thread on postages. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
shortliner Posted May 19, 2011 Share Posted May 19, 2011 Since I have (literally yesterday) been through this can I offer the following little story for your edification I need 2 x Peco Electro-frog med rad LH turnouts, so I look in RM and a retailer is offering them at £8.75 each+ P&P 4.00 therefore total £21.50 - ah ,but there is a catch " Postcodes.........IV....... will ( my underline) incur extra postage" - Guess who lives in the IV area? Since Royal Mail delivers to ALL UK postcodes for the same charge, how on earth can the advertiser/retailler justify this? - granted that couriers may charge an excess, but this actually says "POST & PACKING" - courier is not mentioned. Now, to continue the story - I look on ebay and find the turnouts at BIN £9.75 each, WITH FREE POSTAGE, from exactly the same seller/retailer - so I order, pay by paypal and am charged £19.50, saving myself £2.00 on the deal - with no excess charge for living in the IV postcode area. I'm not naming the retailer, but there seems to be something slightly odd taking place. Again, to anyone buying in UK from US ebay look very hard at the postal charges - yes USPS has increased charges, but some of the prices being asked are ridiculous! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ron Ron Ron Posted May 19, 2011 Share Posted May 19, 2011 If I'm not mistaken, aren't Gaugemaster very cheap for P&P charges ?? Their charges may be off-set by higher retail prices though. . Mainland UK orders above a value of £10.00 can be sent carriage free using our economy service, with the exception of orders containing one or more items above a length of 600mm and below £25.00 total order value. Orders conforming to this exception will be charged carriage at cost, (not to exceed £4.95). Mainland UK orders below a value of £10.00 will incur a small orders handling charge of £2.00. Mainland UK orders solely for catalogues are exempt from the small orders handling charge. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kal Posted May 19, 2011 Share Posted May 19, 2011 Absolutely! I wouldn't get out of bed for that. You would'nt get out of bed for that??? My Butler wouldn't even get out of bed for that Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ron Ron Ron Posted May 19, 2011 Share Posted May 19, 2011 Neither will mine........ Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
roger440 Posted May 19, 2011 Share Posted May 19, 2011 I tried selling some of my surplus stock on ebay, but ive given up to be honest! Given that sending it out at a low cost involves the post office, and that the post office is only open when im at work, and going to the post office will cost my buisness £60 per hour, bizzarely, it makes more sense for me to lob my spare stock in the bin. Time is money, and sending out a package takes time, and ebay makes it as complicated as it can get. I simply dont understand the complaint about the cost of postage versus the cost of what you are buying. The effort is much the same regardless of its value. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Talltim Posted May 19, 2011 Share Posted May 19, 2011 For those that have items that they feel bad about throwing away, but are too heavy or have not enough value to eBay , perhaps you could Freecycle them? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ohmisterporter Posted May 20, 2011 Share Posted May 20, 2011 Last year I sold a book on ebay. At the time there was a £2.75 maximum postage value imposed by ebay. Actual postage was £4.41 so after ebay and paypal charges at the end of the day I actually made £0.16 "profit". That is without taking into account packaging costs. Though I did get rid of a book I no longer needed. I don't sell books on ebay now, the local charity shops have them. Geoff. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Butler Henderson Posted May 20, 2011 Share Posted May 20, 2011 If I'm not mistaken, aren't Gaugemaster very cheap for P&P charges ?? Their charges may be off-set by higher retail prices though. I often use Gaugemaster, yes their prices are often on the high side but for difficult to get items they are often no more expensive when you total up how much it would cost to order them all from other suppliers when you factor in P&P. Also have had a next day delivery with the free P&P so they obviously pay some regard to the profit made and cost of the order in determining which delivery style to use. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
hollywoodfoundry Posted May 20, 2011 Share Posted May 20, 2011 Again, to anyone buying in UK from US ebay look very hard at the postal charges - yes USPS has increased charges, but some of the prices being asked are ridiculous! In my experience, the LAST service that US people use is the United States Postal Service. They far prefer to use expensive couriers like UPS, Fedex and such because they will come and collect the parcel from them. For some odd reason US companies also have no regard for what the freight charges are going to cost you, the customer. If I see excessive freight charges, I negotiate with them to use the postal service instead. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
peach james Posted May 21, 2011 Share Posted May 21, 2011 It's comical how everyone is an expert on what others should earn per hour. Solicitors are well paid.....I wonder how many there are in the UK? Professional model locomotive painters are nowhere near as well paid....I wonder how many there are in the UK? One reason for bringing this up is I was once accused of putting my charges up quite a lot one year and the accuser was a solicitor who earned more in an hour than I earned in a week. Do you know what he said?.....Model locomotives were only his hobby! Right...... Strangely it reminds of this thread on postages. That's why I view bought in models as often a total no-brainer. My big toy cost...well, around 6.50 UKP/hr or so, less materials, for the builder, assuming he put in as many hours as I think are in it. Considering that it is first class work from a very capable machinist, that was a totally silly price. Mind, it still is my most expensive vehicle. I bought a Comet coach that had been their demonstrator. (Mk 1 SLEP) Because the finished model was ~2x the price of the kit, which again, seems very cheap. I know how long it took me to make it's compatriot, and I would be making well less than minimum wage to make it, and paint it...and I don't think that even a professional like you, Larry, would be able to do it in what the $$$ would argue was appropriate. James Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Poggy1165 Posted May 21, 2011 Share Posted May 21, 2011 Postage isn't cheap these days. Tried sending anything recently? I sold a loco kit on Ebay a few weeks, and charged £8 for special delivery (insured) which I thought was a lot to ask. Guess what, the postage came to £9, so I was a quid down without allowing for packing materials, time taken to pack, petrol to the post office, time taken to go to the post office and so on. I shrugged off these losses as in the scheme of things it's no big deal. A business is not going to do that. It's going to at least want to recover its global costs. I reckon to cost the job properly I ought to have charged at least half an hour for time (my time isn't free, I could have been writing or doing something around the house), maybe a quid for packing materials (these aren't free either, in fact they're damned dear) and maybe a quid for petrol. Therefore an 'economic' postage price would have been around £13-50, even on a minimum wage. Anything less than that is 'subsidised'. I suspect traders who offer free or cheap postage are putting the cost on their prices. Either that, or they're cutting their profit to the bone. The latter is not generally a good way to stay in business long-term. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlackRat Posted May 21, 2011 Share Posted May 21, 2011 I used to think I was in the wrong job............................now I know I am! lol Always found the biggies to be reasonable, Dave Cleal used to be brilliant, I havent used him for a whilst as he seems to have run down a lot of what I used to buy. Usually arrived the next day, cheap to! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold The Stationmaster Posted May 21, 2011 RMweb Gold Share Posted May 21, 2011 Postage isn't cheap these days. Tried sending anything recently? I sold a loco kit on Ebay a few weeks, and charged £8 for special delivery (insured) which I thought was a lot to ask. Guess what, the postage came to £9, so I was a quid down without allowing for packing materials, time taken to pack, petrol to the post office, time taken to go to the post office and so on. I shrugged off these losses as in the scheme of things it's no big deal. A business is not going to do that. It's going to at least want to recover its global costs. I reckon to cost the job properly I ought to have charged at least half an hour for time (my time isn't free, I could have been writing or doing something around the house), maybe a quid for packing materials (these aren't free either, in fact they're damned dear) and maybe a quid for petrol. Therefore an 'economic' postage price would have been around £13-50, even on a minimum wage. Anything less than that is 'subsidised'. I suspect traders who offer free or cheap postage are putting the cost on their prices. Either that, or they're cutting their profit to the bone. The latter is not generally a good way to stay in business long-term. I quite agree - having sold various things through the possibilities offered on RMWeb you quickly realise that postage for Special Delivery is not cheap and neither is packaging material (although I do tend to aim for bomb-proof with my packaging). I don't charge for my time of course and the walk to the Post Office does me good (and knackers me coming back up the hill) so my costs are limited to packaging material - even Jiffy Bags cost money - and the postal fee and as an individual I can do exactly what traders do, viz I either factor the P&P into my minimum selling price or I make clear that it is additional at whatever rate. Traders who wish to stay in business obviously have to recover such costs somehow - either as a separate amount or in the selling price. Take for example my local model shop - he does a lot of overseas business in diecast cars and the p&p plus insurance is not cheap so although he discounts prices for some overseas customers he still charges his full dispatch costs to them, and (hopefully) remains in business. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rich.B Posted June 12, 2011 Share Posted June 12, 2011 Last year I sold a book on ebay. At the time there was a £2.75 maximum postage value imposed by ebay. Actual postage was £4.41 so after ebay and paypal charges at the end of the day I actually made £0.16 "profit". That is without taking into account packaging costs. Though I did get rid of a book I no longer needed. I don't sell books on ebay now, the local charity shops have them. Geoff. Hi Geoff, Yep, the same happened to me with books, I did manage to sell some really good books in batches on Ebay, and where `buyer collects'..... just as well really as I wouldn't have made a sausage, not as I did anyway.......seems the Ebay thing is getting all rather silly, as per usual `a great idea' is once again abused.....NOT just by P+P which yes I agree some are just totally taking the P. But think, You buy a new Bachmann 4-6-0 tender loco for just an example, a couple of years down the line you decide to sell the loco, you've took great care of it, mint box, all extra bits still sealed etc. So, you list it on Ebay just using the 99p start price and just a couple of decent pics.....you check your fees so far....0.12p....mm not bad, then once you've sold the item, say it sold for example for...£50 you think thats not too bad for the loco really as you paid probably £65-70 for it when new....then once it's sold you then realize that you are really out of pocket,.... £5.00 FINAL VALUATION FEE to the greedy people at ebay....really! yes a charge ok, but does anyone think this a justifiable fee when Ebay is such a vast worldwide business, think how many people sell on Ebay, it won't take a genius to see that their profit margin must be erm,...rather healthy. But wait, not finished yet, a lot of people use Paypal as yes I agree it's more convienient than some other methods, but on to that final valuation fee you then need to add near enough £2.00 in some cases for their troubles of receiving the payment into your account. Now don't get me wrong I know business' have to make money and I don't expect something for nowt, and yes I know Ebay and Paypal need to take a fee, but your talking the best part of a tenner here with both of them. So, then we come back to the old P+P argument. I assume sellers private and trade try to reap some of those costs back, and I'm not saying thats right and justifiable, but no one seems to have mentioned these hidden extortionate fees in my opion anyway. I have sold much stuff on Ebay, but after working all the fees out now I see little point in selling much more on there. looks like finding other alternatives as from what I've seen many others are doing the same, I supose we shall find another up and coming organization on which to sell our items until that gets as big and greedy as the present set up then the cycle starts again. The same happened with the car boot sale...... I rest my case, maybe I have drifted off topic a little but the whole picture needs to be unveiled here as well as some of the high costs of P+P, as someone stated `It works out cheaper and easier for many people to buy online and pay P+P taking into account petrol,parking, and the sheer time and trouble in some cases. Regards, Rich Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Horsetan Posted June 14, 2011 Share Posted June 14, 2011 ^^ ....and PayPal is the reason why Elon Musk was able to partly-fund the creation of his electric sportscar, the Tesla. You've probably paid for it. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
GreenDiesel001 Posted June 15, 2011 Author Share Posted June 15, 2011 Hi. Since I began this thread I thought you might like to know of the following:- 2 white metal motorcyles and side cars about the size of silver bracelet charms. They could be got into a matchbox or a very small jiffy bag. Postage on Ebay £4.00. I usually find these days that when I leave feedback about an item the postage and packing charge gets a single star, unless of course it is a fair charge. Now I realise unless I bid for an item I'm not going to win it but I do think sellers should be realistic in their charges. Anyone who wants the item will of course take a stupidly high postage in their stride and the seller makes more money than he initially thought. Just my opinion. Jeff Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
craigwelsh Posted June 16, 2011 Share Posted June 16, 2011 Jiffy £1 Large Stamp £1 Petrol £2 maybe, not sure. Can I get two wm motorcycle + sidecars for less than £4 + x anywhere else? Yes i'll buy there, no i'll have to buy them if I really want them. I never really see the point in arguing about the p+p vs item price. Most BiN items compensate on one or the other to achieve the same price and auctions you'll pay the going rate if you want it or not. Considering eBay fees these days I don't really object to people wanted them to get a bit less. I only deduct a postage star if someone sent 2nd class when it was supposed to be 1st or similar. Likewise if fragile parts are sent in a normal envelope though that normally raises a dispute.. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
chris_irl Posted June 16, 2011 Share Posted June 16, 2011 OK I should have been more realistic. I just put in a very low figure as an example. Had a car serviced recently or had to call a Plumber? Bernard lol, skilled trades though. packing is minimum wage stuff Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bernard Lamb Posted June 16, 2011 Share Posted June 16, 2011 lol, skilled trades though. packing is minimum wage stuff In a large organisation yes. But in a one man business, run by an expert in their field, it can be a very different matter. Bernard Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Julia Posted July 5, 2011 Share Posted July 5, 2011 These days with the boom in online sales delivery is more often done by someone other than royal mail. The idea of sending the shop apprentice down to the post office with a box of parcels to post is one that is really heading the way of the dodo. More often you can get companies to come and collect your parcels, and when you do this they will often offer substantial discounts. Sites like parcel2go allow you to shop several delivery companies, and book a bulk set of packages for collection. This is often going to be cheaper for all involved than the walk down to the postoffice (which is now twice the distance as they closed all the local branches), to weight in a queue (that is 3 times as long due to the closures), to post something for slightly more than parcel2go will do it for you... Perhaps I am just being cynical about the whole thing, but I am pretty sure that the likes of our favourite box stuffers don't goto their local post office to send you that shiny loco. That said, I wish they did do sensible postage prices on things, I wanted some rail joiners, but I don't want to spend the 4 quid flat postage rate... J Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Butler Henderson Posted July 6, 2011 Share Posted July 6, 2011 These days with the boom in online sales delivery is more often done by someone other than royal mail. The idea of sending the shop apprentice down to the post office with a box of parcels to post is one that is really heading the way of the dodo. Perhaps I am just being cynical about the whole thing, but I am pretty sure that the likes of our favourite box stuffers don't goto their local post office to send you that shiny loco. Royal Mail do collect from large businesses. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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