Tony Davis Posted August 5, 2011 Share Posted August 5, 2011 have managed to negotiate a space 10' wide by approx 2'6" and would like to model something fairly local. I have seen some discussion of Potton Station and found the following Trackplan; http://www.signalbox...rams.php?id=404 I would like some suggestions as to how best adapt/extend the trackplan to fit within the above parameters and also provide operational interest. I will be building the layout in 00 gauge Thanks Tony Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
AJ427 Posted August 5, 2011 Share Posted August 5, 2011 Hi Tony, I'm assuming you've received permission to use the diagram from the signabox.org as these plans are copyright. If you have just ignore me but if you haven't you'd be best removing the image and linking to it here: http://www.signalbox...rams.php?id=404 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Easterner Posted August 5, 2011 Share Posted August 5, 2011 I second AJ427's advice. On the substantive question, it looks like an interesting prototype (I especially like the platform canopy - a real feature) which I would think would provide enough operational interest as is, so I go for it unaltered. I would think you would get the station in the space, but of course 2'6" won't be enough to turn around in in OO. Are you thinking of end-to-end? (I'd have thought roundy-round would be the natural format here.) Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony Davis Posted August 5, 2011 Author Share Posted August 5, 2011 Hi Tony, I'm assuming you've received permission to use the diagram from the signabox.org as these plans are copyright. If you have just ignore me but if you haven't you'd be best removing the image and linking to it here: http://www.signalbox...rams.php?id=404 Hmm, may have misread the feel free to use MY images etc... anyway I have erred on the side of caution and removed the image, thanks for the heads up Tony Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony Davis Posted August 5, 2011 Author Share Posted August 5, 2011 I second AJ427's advice. On the substantive question, it looks like an interesting prototype (I especially like the platform canopy - a real feature) which I would think would provide enough operational interest as is, so I go for it unaltered. I would think you would get the station in the space, but of course 2'6" won't be enough to turn around in in OO. Are you thinking of end-to-end? (I'd have thought roundy-round would be the natural format here.) Yes, end to end Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold beast66606 Posted August 5, 2011 RMweb Gold Share Posted August 5, 2011 Hmm, may have misread the feel free to use MY images etc... anyway I have erred on the side of caution and removed the image, thanks for the heads up Tony I know John, he would (probably) be happy for you to use it, but ask first - same policy as I have. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony Davis Posted August 5, 2011 Author Share Posted August 5, 2011 I know John, he would (probably) be happy for you to use it, but ask first - same policy as I have. Emailed him just now, should have gone round, Potterspury is about 5 mins from me Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leicester Thumper Posted August 5, 2011 Share Posted August 5, 2011 quote regarding copyright from the site: Your use of the diagrams A small word about copyright. I am sharing my diagrams with you willingly. You are welcome to copy them to disc and/or print them out for your own personal use. However, you must contact me for permission if you intend to do anything commercial with them - such as (but not limited to) inclusion in magazines, books or other sales. Believe it or not I have twice detected and had to take action against disrespectful characters selling my diagrams for profit on Ebay! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony Davis Posted August 5, 2011 Author Share Posted August 5, 2011 quote regarding copyright from the site: Which I interpreted as being able to use on this site, as it was not being used for commercial gain. But I have emailed him just to check Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andy Y Posted August 5, 2011 Share Posted August 5, 2011 Which I interpreted as being able to use on this site, as it was not being used for commercial gain. In addition to legislation please bear in mind our rules too - http://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/topic/33-copyright-rules/ ImagesFirstly, please ensure that the image is taken by you and in itself is not of copyrighted material. If the image was not taken by you or you do not own rights to reproduce that image you must ensure that you have the consent of the image owner to reproduce the image on the forum. If you do have the consent of the owner of the image to reproduce it on here it is customary practice to credit the photographer and/or image owner, this certainly goes a long way to maintaining goodwill and at least ensures that you are not trying to pass off another persons property as your own. Anyway, hopefully the topic can now get back on track as AJ has kindly provided the link which, if originally used, would have negated this distraction. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nick Holliday Posted August 7, 2011 Share Posted August 7, 2011 I have managed to negotiate a space 10' wide by approx 2'6" and would like to model something fairly local. I have seen some discussion of Potton Station and found the following Trackplan; http://www.signalbox.org/diagrams.php?id=404 I would like some suggestions as to how best adapt/extend the trackplan to fit within the above parameters and also provide operational interest. I will be building the layout in 00 gauge Thanks Tony Now that the dust has settled we can get back to the original question. I hate to be negative but I am afraid Potton isn't going to fit easily into your space, if what you have is only 10 feet long and you want to model in OO. First of all, what you have found is a signalling diagram, and it only tells a small part of the story, even though it does show all the sidings within the remit of the signal box it refers to. What is missing is indicated by the clue written between the tracks on the right hand side. This reads Potton No. 2, and it refers to the second signal box at Potton station, some 900 feet away to the north east from Box No 1 (12 feet in OO!) This controls another trailing crossover with single slip leading to three sidings on the south eastern side which run all the way down past the goods shed, but don't connect to any of the tracks associated with No 1, while a fourth one next to the running lines, forms the main loop connecting to the line shown on No 1 diagram. In addition there is a single siding, perhasp a short lay-by, on the north side of the tracks. The good thing is that these additional sidings do at least make the station much more interesting for operation, but increase the length required. Overall from overbridge to overbridge Potton measures roughly 1440 feet, which would require just under 20 feet in OO. (I found all this information by using the old-maps website and overlaying plans from the 1930's onto an aerial photo with a scale - the basic road layout has not changed much over the years)(BTW The original plan as in the diagram is almost identical to that used by David Jenkinson on his seminal Garsdale Road layout, but that was a continuous layout, mainly used for displaying his large collection of trains based on actual services, and the goods yard itself provided little interest.) Whilst it may not be a problem squeezing the station into a 10 foot long diorama, the major problem you are going to have is what happens to the trains when they go under the road bridges at each end. The width you have is actually the correct scale for Potton, but it doesn't give you enough to curve the tracks round, which would require at least 3 feet, and more sensibly 4 or more, which would also knock a similar figure off the length available for the station. Operationally, a double track through station with fiddle yards at each end involves an awful amount of effort off stage, for little result. Realistically the shortest longest train that you could get away with would be two coaches and a small loco, which would measure about 2'6", so a fiddle yard at each end would leave you with only 5 feet for the station. The distinctive arrangement of water tower, footbridge and station building woud be difficult to compress, and they extend some 175 feet from the southern road bridge, so would need a touch over 2 feet, leaving just 3 feet to squeeze in the crossover and some sidings, as well as an extra bit of platform to take the train. Unfortunately Potton goods shed seems on the large size, at around 32' x 55', making things even more awkward. The only suggestion I can make, if your overall length has to include the fiddle yards, is to say that the line to the south has been closed because of an accident or engineering works, and all trains are having to terminate and reverse at Potton. You could then reduce the length of the southern fiddle yard to a loco length, and use it as a substitute for the crossover. Trains would then arrrive at the platform, the engine could then draw forward under the bridge and using the fiddle yard as a traverser return on the other track, and then proceed through the station, reverse through the crossover with the single slip, and then couple on to the train. Since the single slip doesn't have a facing point lock, the train would have to be drawn out of the "arrival" platform empty and taken through the crossover and reversed back into the "departure" platform to allow passengers to embark. This procedure would add considerably to the operational interest, and potentially release another couple of feet for the station itself. Alternatively, it could be made to work quite well in N gauge, but that probably is not the answer you wanted. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Pannier Tank Posted August 7, 2011 RMweb Premium Share Posted August 7, 2011 have managed to negotiate a space 10' wide by approx 2'6" and would like to model something fairly local. I have seen some discussion of Potton Station and found the following Trackplan; http://www.signalbox...rams.php?id=404 I would like some suggestions as to how best adapt/extend the trackplan to fit within the above parameters and also provide operational interest. I will be building the layout in 00 gauge Thanks Tony If Potton turns out to be too large for your space, how about Newport Pagnell (can't get much more local than that!) http://clutch.open.ac.uk/schools/giffard99/First_Days/Last_train.html http://www.disused-stations.org.uk/n/newport_pagnell/index.shtml Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
edcayton Posted August 7, 2011 Share Posted August 7, 2011 the link shows the line extending beyond the station. Any idea why? Ed Newport Pagnell I mean Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony Davis Posted August 7, 2011 Author Share Posted August 7, 2011 Now that the dust has settled we can get back to the original question. I hate to be negative but I am afraid Potton isn't going to fit easily into your space, if what you have is only 10 feet long and you want to model in OO.. Alternatively, it could be made to work quite well in N gauge, but that probably is not the answer you wanted. Nick, thanks very much for the well researched reply, but I think your opening statement makes a valid and not easily ignored point, and so I am going to move (modelling) location for the 10' project, but I intend to return to Potten should I ever gain more room. Kind regards Tony Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony Davis Posted August 7, 2011 Author Share Posted August 7, 2011 If Potton turns out to be too large for your space, how about Newport Pagnell (can't get much more local than that!) http://clutch.open.a...Last_train.html http://www.disused-s...ell/index.shtml By Coincidence I found a book in Stony Library entitled; "The Wolverton to Newport Pagnell Branch", by Bill Simpson, and this seems to be a good subject for modelling within the confines mentioned plus, as you rightly point out, it is a very local railway. Kind regards Tony Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Pannier Tank Posted August 7, 2011 RMweb Premium Share Posted August 7, 2011 the link shows the line extending beyond the station. Any idea why? Ed Newport Pagnell I mean The intention was to continue the railway to Olney. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Pannier Tank Posted August 7, 2011 RMweb Premium Share Posted August 7, 2011 By Coincidence I found a book in Stony Library entitled; "The Wolverton to Newport Pagnell Branch", by Bill Simpson, and this seems to be a good subject for modelling within the confines mentioned plus, as you rightly point out, it is a very local railway. Kind regards Tony It's a good book. I travelled on the last train from Newport Pagnell to Wolverton with 41222 the Newport Nobby. That's me in the lower photograph in the link I sent to you. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony Davis Posted August 7, 2011 Author Share Posted August 7, 2011 It's a good book. I travelled on the last train from Newport Pagnell to Wolverton with 41222 the Newport Nobby. That's me in the lower photograph in the link I sent to you. The photo is in the book as well. The wagon turntables look interesting Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold chris p bacon Posted August 12, 2011 RMweb Gold Share Posted August 12, 2011 so I am going to move (modelling) location for the 10' project, but I intend to return to Potten should I ever gain more room. If you do return to it, it was a fascinating station with a tremendous amount of goods traffic in and out, as well as the cross country passenger traffic (how about Hymek D7060 on 10/4/65 with a Weymouth-Cambridge special or GW engines on their way to Kings of Norwich) I have a reasonable amount of info regarding the Station as well as being a personal friend of the stations current owner who has been resident since about 1965, (The Sandy Transport Society still conducts its AGM on the up platform under the canopy every July). I live 3 miles away in Sandy and am currently, very slowly building a model based on its Station/track plan circa 1950, and believe me that doesn't fit into 10' ! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony Davis Posted August 12, 2011 Author Share Posted August 12, 2011 If you do return to it, it was a fascinating station with a tremendous amount of goods traffic in and out, as well as the cross country passenger traffic (how about Hymek D7060 on 10/4/65 with a Weymouth-Cambridge special or GW engines on their way to Kings of Norwich) I have a reasonable amount of info regarding the Station as well as being a personal friend of the stations current owner who has been resident since about 1965, (The Sandy Transport Society still conducts its AGM on the up platform under the canopy every July). I live 3 miles away in Sandy and am currently, very slowly building a model based on its Station/track plan circa 1950, and believe me that doesn't fit into 10' ! I have family in Potton which led me to notice the name, there was a paragraph or two in a recent Steam magazine about a campaign to save the shed there, all of which led me to look out more about the place and consider modelling it. Best of luck with your modelling project and maybe some photo's on the forum? regards Tony Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold chris p bacon Posted August 12, 2011 RMweb Gold Share Posted August 12, 2011 I have family in Potton which led me to notice the name, there was a paragraph or two in a recent Steam magazine about a campaign to save the shed there, all of which led me to look out more about the place and consider modelling it. Best of luck with your modelling project and maybe some photo's on the forum? regards Tony The original shed for Shannon (Sandy & Potton or Potton & Sandy Railway depending on where you live!) is still there just off Biggleswade road it is listed either Grade 1 or 2* at the rear of some terraced properties. The building of the Sandy & Potton is a super story in itself, as it was on private land it did not need an act of parliament but crossing Carthagena road (Deepdale) did, so they built a bridge in an adjascent field and diverted the road through it, as that was just a nod among "Gentlemen" of local authority, the remains of the bridge are still there with the kink in the road When I get my act together I shall start a thread in the layout topics, hopefully sooner rather than later progress is slow at times but it does run now (with a few faults!) Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony Davis Posted August 12, 2011 Author Share Posted August 12, 2011 Shannon, yes. That was mentioned as well. I believe Steam Magazine is involved with it somehow Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
LNERGE Posted August 15, 2011 Share Posted August 15, 2011 All that i have on Potton. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
LNERGE Posted August 15, 2011 Share Posted August 15, 2011 I lied.. one more item.. The date stamp is on the rear but placed on the image with photoshop thingy. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Horsetan Posted August 15, 2011 Share Posted August 15, 2011 Potton still stands, if somewhat truncated by the industrial building at one end! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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