Roy P Posted September 3, 2011 Share Posted September 3, 2011 May I draw attention to the latest issue of the Bachmann Collectors Club magazine and a question about the colour of the seats of the Midland Pullman as running in the 1960s. For those who are not members of the BCC but may have some information, Bachmann are saying; quote " We have images showing first class seating in both the red and blue variant, but we are unable to ascertain for definite if one colour only was used throughout the six car train, or if there was indeed a variation within the train." The BCC goes on to say they have studied publish sources, freeze frame film and interviewed people connected with building of the units but still need some help with the seating configuration. Anyone with such information is invited to contact the BCC editor via collectorsclub@Bachmann-europe.co.uk The magazine also states that this model has "now progressed to the tool room". In the light of some comments in other threads, I hope Bachmann's decision to involve it's customers is viewed as positive. I do not possess such information but those that do must speak now or hold their piece as it were. I have started a new topic on this one as the most appropriate threads were locked some time ago and this snippet may have been overlooked in all the excitement about the NSE EPB RP Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold The Stationmaster Posted September 3, 2011 RMweb Gold Share Posted September 3, 2011 I have got small scale drawings of the interior layout of the Western sets (as no doubt have many other people as the source in my possession was not exactly rare?). Did the LMR do a similar booklet I wonder? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
robertcwp Posted September 4, 2011 Share Posted September 4, 2011 Each 6-car set comprised two half-sets so whether the seats were all the same colour depended on which two half-sets were coupled together. I believe two half-sets had one interior colour scheme and the other two the other scheme but cannot find any information on which way round this was. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
mark54 Posted September 4, 2011 Share Posted September 4, 2011 Not quite as simple as that, as there is a panning shot in the BTF Blue Pullman film at Marylebone that clearly shows Motor First car "A" with blue seats and the adjacent Kitchen First car "B" with red seats. Unfortunately it is difficult to make out the car numbers. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
robertcwp Posted September 4, 2011 Share Posted September 4, 2011 Though it's about the WR units, this booklet gives details of the two colour schemes used in First Class: http://www.railwaysarchive.co.uk/documents/BRWR_Pullman1960.pdf Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium rprodgers Posted September 4, 2011 RMweb Premium Share Posted September 4, 2011 Will have a look in the Blue pullman book by Kevin Robertson. Robert I couldnt get your link to work but I suspect it is the same booklet issued to train crew that I have in my possession. It would be ironic if there is more information available concerning the Western units Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium rprodgers Posted September 4, 2011 RMweb Premium Share Posted September 4, 2011 on page 43 of Kevin Robertson's book quoting from George Behrend's book "Pullman In Europe In 1962" . " The first class saloons are finished off in two colour schemes. In one the seats are furnished in red upholstery with navy blue stripes , with a blue and black carpet and rosewood partions at the end. In the other , light blue with navy blue stripes is used for the upholstery , and the carpet is red and black, while the partions are ebony." ............A second opinion from Charles Long confirms that first class on both the LMR and WR sets were either red ribbed or blue ribbed, each half set being of a different combination; a similar arrangement applied to the LMR power cars...." Unfortunately which units were which shade the book doesnt appear to elaborate. There is a good interior shot of a WR unit on page 84 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
BernardTPM Posted September 5, 2011 Share Posted September 5, 2011 Unfortunately which units were which shade the book doesnt appear to elaborate. I've not been able to find any references on this either; the fact that there are two schemes is mentioned in a number of original contemporary publications but none say which were in which (something nice and simple like Scheme 1 in even numbered vehicles and Scheme 2 in odd numbered ones is one possiblility I suppose), not even the Kitmaster instruction sheets! I'm glad I was ignorant of this fact back in 1980 when I built the Midland Pullman set for Chiltern Green (so it's Scheme 1 throughout). Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
robertcwp Posted September 5, 2011 Share Posted September 5, 2011 Will have a look in the Blue pullman book by Kevin Robertson. Robert I couldnt get your link to work but I suspect it is the same booklet issued to train crew that I have in my possession. It would be ironic if there is more information available concerning the Western units The link works fine for me. The booklet is unlikely to be the same as the one issued to train crews. The Railways Archive one is more in the nature of glossy publicity material, which seems to have been the source for most other descriptions of the interiors. I have the original booklet and supplied the scans to Railways Archive. I also have the Midland Pullman one but that is much more vague. Mark's observation from the BTF film suggests that the colours alternated from one vehicle to the next, which also destroys any suggestion of odd numbers one scheme, even numbers the other, because as originally formed, each 3 or 4 car half set was either odd numbers or even numbers throughout. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold The Stationmaster Posted September 5, 2011 RMweb Gold Share Posted September 5, 2011 The link works fine for me. The booklet is unlikely to be the same as the one issued to train crews. The Railways Archive one is more in the nature of glossy publicity material, which seems to have been the source for most other descriptions of the interiors. I have the original booklet and supplied the scans to Railways Archive. I also have the Midland Pullman one but that is much more vague. The link worked perfectly ok for me and what it illustrated was very definitely not the booklet issued to traincrews (which is what I referred to in my earlier post as it includes the seating plans). Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Philip Jackson Posted October 31, 2011 Share Posted October 31, 2011 CAD pic now up http://www.Bachmann.co.uk/image_box.php?image=images1/branchline/31-255DC.jpg&cat_no=31-255DC&info=0&width=650&height=239 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roy P Posted November 30, 2011 Author Share Posted November 30, 2011 Sorry about bumping this when there is another thread running but as I forgot to ask at the NEC, I emailed the Bachmann Collectors Club and have received this reply from Dennis Lovett. "...The feedback on the Blue Pullman was amazing and our Design Engineer responsible for the project followed up every lead. There is a two page follow-up in the next issue of the Bachmann Collectors’ Club magazine which is currently being distributed (it appears on pages 56 and 57). We were even contacted by a preservation society who has three of the original seats in its possession! Feel free to let people know when you receive the update in the magazine. Dennis Lovett Public Relations Manager Bachmann Europe plc. Good news!, and I was looking forward to the next issue anyway! RP Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marty Mc Posted December 1, 2011 Share Posted December 1, 2011 Hi Now thats a real positive result for Bachmann and I'm delighted to hear that they are willing to ask for advice. I see this as a real positive for customer relations. Well done Bachmann. Martin Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
BernardTPM Posted December 1, 2011 Share Posted December 1, 2011 Those seats are probably the biggest single pieces left of these trains - unless the egnines found further, non-railway use. They're doing a very good job on the research. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Oldddudders Posted December 1, 2011 RMweb Gold Share Posted December 1, 2011 Once again we see the advantage to Bachmann of employing a professional "front of house". Dennis Lovett is ex-BR, ex-Virgin Trains, in both cases in a PR and promo capacity. He is also an enthusiast. Other big companies in our field might feel the benefit of such an appointment - if the budget can stretch to it! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roy P Posted December 5, 2011 Author Share Posted December 5, 2011 The latest issue of the Collectors Club Magazine (so much more than a Newsletter) has arrived and as promised there is a two page article about the Blue Pullman model. There are a couple of new pictures of the underfloor details and while I admit never actually seeing the top of a real unit never mind the underneath, it does look crisp and defined. Most of the text gives thanks to the many people who offered their help with this project and show a selection of the messages received. The conclusion Bachmann have come to regarding the arrangement of seat colours is that they should alternate "Scheme 1" and "Scheme 2" through the length of the six car unit as there evidence for this and it would give the most pleasing effect in the model. Having no thoughts to the contrary of my own, this all seems fair and I look forward to my one with increasing anticipation. Can I "justify" it? Of course not! but then, no model I've purchased ever earned its keep. RP Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Oldddudders Posted December 6, 2011 RMweb Gold Share Posted December 6, 2011 Can I "justify" it? Of course not! but then, no model I've purchased ever earned its keep. Very few layouts can "justify" a BP or similar exotic glamour-girl. There were only a couple of trips a day, and Cheadle Heath was the only intermediate stop, I think. But that isn't the point. The contrast between the BP and the grimy freight that much of the route saw all day is exactly why the model will sell - it all adds to the sum of enjoyment in running a "rounded" train roster for your layout. If you like it, buy it and feel good! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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