S.A.C Martin Posted December 8, 2009 Share Posted December 8, 2009 The End is Nigh Slightly devastated as it means I'll never get the chance to sample it - and surely that means a few locomotives lose out on some much needed work? Can't believe they could just scrap it like that. What an absolute travesty. Shades of Concorde abound... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
pete_mcfarlane Posted December 8, 2009 Share Posted December 8, 2009 The End is Nigh Slightly devastated as it means I'll never get the chance to sample it - and surely that means a few locomotives lose out on some much needed work? Can't believe they could just scrap it like that. What an absolute travesty. Shades of Concorde abound... From reading the news article, this isn't the VSOE Pullman train. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
edin_bry2x Posted December 8, 2009 Share Posted December 8, 2009 The End is Nigh Slightly devastated as it means I'll never get the chance to sample it - and surely that means a few locomotives lose out on some much needed work? Can't believe they could just scrap it like that. What an absolute travesty. Shades of Concorde abound... is it just the way im reading it or does this article just mean the named service train has been pulled and has nothing to do with the luxury train. Dont really see the big loss certainly not comparable with concorde, surely more like the scrapping of The Clansman which was a travesty. bry Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
pete_mcfarlane Posted December 8, 2009 Share Posted December 8, 2009 is it just the way im reading it or does this article just mean the named service train has been pulled and has nothing to do with the luxury train. It says in the article that the VSOE is continuing: Only travellers who can afford lavish private trains ??“ such as the Venice Simplon-Orient-Express and the Danube Express's Istanbul Odyssey ??“ will be able to enjoy the service's former glory. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
woodenhead Posted December 8, 2009 Share Posted December 8, 2009 Reading the article I doubt very much anyone would want to travel in it now, you get a better service on the Anglo-Scottish sleepers services. In it's final guise there is not even a buffet, even a Trans Pennine Express can offer some sort of food. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
S.A.C Martin Posted December 8, 2009 Author Share Posted December 8, 2009 Sorry if my initial post has mislead some people - but because its such a "raw" experience is precisely why I'd like to experience it before it gets cut! There's been a lot of interesting traction at the head of the "modern" train, not least the various d/electrics and d/hydraulics and electrics of course. Glad that it doesn't affect the VSOE, but then thats not the same thing , is it? EDIT: ...and I might add, it's not all about the luxury - what about the history? So what if its run down, it's the journey that counts, frankly. The fact that you can no longer experience any part of the original train along its route aside from preserved examples is exactly why I alluded to Concorde's passing - you can't experience that thrill anymore. That's two "must do" trips I was unable to afford and now in all likelihood will never make. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
woodenhead Posted December 8, 2009 Share Posted December 8, 2009 Looking on Wikipedia though, the stock is even standard stock, it's just a name now, a memory of a time when train travel was the way to cross Europe to The East. Wiki Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
highpeak Posted December 8, 2009 Share Posted December 8, 2009 As a penniless student I travelled home in 1974 from a period of study abroad in Trieste on the Direct Orient express, not especially glamourous but quite interesting. As I recall, the train arrived in Trieste from Belgrade, spent quite a lot of time in the station attaching and detaching cars, made its way to Venice where there was more attaching and detaching, thence to Milan, more attaching etc etc and entered Switzerland an hour or so late. Swiss efficiency took over and made sure we were exactly the same number of minutes late when we left Switzerland. We stopped at quite a few places in France, apparently to sling newspapers around (it didn't really interfere with my sleep as I did not have a sleeper or couchette, just spent the night in the seat I occupied all the way from Trieste to Calais). We arrived in Paris somewhere around 6-ish, were detached from the main train and towed around to Gare du Nord by some sort of switcher, then hauled up to Calais to catch the ferry. After that single-seat service, the journey degenerated into farce: some crappy overcrowded EMU up to London, carting suitcases on the Blunderground between stations, an extremely slow journey from Euston to Stockport with innumerable delays due to PW work, the scheduled missed connection at Stockport allowing a 58 minute wait for the next all stations to Buxton. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
eastwestdivide Posted December 8, 2009 Share Posted December 8, 2009 To clarify, it's night train 468/469 Orient Express between Strasbourg-Vienna which is ending, according to the Thomas Cook Euro timetable notes (p.38 winter edition). There, it's described as "bringing to an end the long and complex history of this once famous train". By 2001 it was only Paris-Vienna, and in 2007 only Strasbourg-Vienna. As the other posters said, it's not the luxury thing. Still a shame. Looks like the longest distance train from Istanbul now is to Bucharest (unless anyone knows different?) Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dudley Dodger Posted December 8, 2009 Share Posted December 8, 2009 Good God, they can't do that. Even if it isn't British! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lady_Ava_Hay Posted December 8, 2009 Share Posted December 8, 2009 I think this proves once and for all that the romance of train travel is completely lost on the Europeans. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
woodenhead Posted December 8, 2009 Share Posted December 8, 2009 I think this proves once and for all that the romance of train travel is completely lost on the Europeans. Yep, they electrified then went to high speed networks whilst we dithered about whether an APT was the right solution, scrapped it, privatised, ruined the infrastructure and only now have we just completed our first bit of high speed railway. They may not understand the romance like we do but they certainly understand the benefits of modernisation and high speed over air. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
60B Posted December 8, 2009 Share Posted December 8, 2009 If its only running Strasbourg - Vienna then they've completly lost out on Paris. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
S.A.C Martin Posted December 8, 2009 Author Share Posted December 8, 2009 Yep, they electrified then went to high speed networks whilst we dithered about whether an APT was the right solution, scrapped it, privatised, ruined the infrastructure and only now have we just completed our first bit of high speed railway. They may not understand the romance like we do but they certainly understand the benefits of modernisation and high speed over air. Not denying the modernity of the continental railways, but surely of all the names that could have been reborn as an ICI or SNCF or similar "brand name", following the original route, this was the train to keep? The deterioation of railway history continues - yes, we must have progress. Can't we keep a few remnants around for future generations (hell, my generation!) to sample? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium cornelius Posted December 8, 2009 RMweb Premium Share Posted December 8, 2009 Calm down dear, it's only a train. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
woodenhead Posted December 8, 2009 Share Posted December 8, 2009 I can appreciate your point, but what is currently the Orient Express is a shadow of what it was and when you get on what is left where is the luxury/service demanding of the train you are visioning? It's just an empty name now like the 'Royal Scot' or the 'Flying Scotsman' ended up shorn of all their pomp and luxury, better to fade away as a romantic memory if you ask me. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
bingley hall Posted December 9, 2009 Share Posted December 9, 2009 The End is Nigh Slightly devastated as it means I'll never get the chance to sample it - and surely that means a few locomotives lose out on some much needed work? Can't believe they could just scrap it like that. What an absolute travesty. Shades of Concorde abound... It's almost a non-story. I don't quite see what there is to get quite so upset about as really the service has lived on in name only for many years now - I was quite surprised to find that it still even existed. To quote from the article.... As for the glamour, the silver service dinners and revelry have long since disappeared. On my trip last week, the train comprised four coaches, with only a handful of passengers. There was no restaurant car or buffet. On boarding at Strasbourg, passengers found they had been provided with an apple and a bottle of mineral water. Only those who had stocked up with food and drink had anything to look forward to. Are you sure you are not confusing the various VSOE services with a regularly scheduled service? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
S.A.C Martin Posted December 9, 2009 Author Share Posted December 9, 2009 It's almost a non-story. I don't quite see what there is to get quite so upset about as really the service has lived on in name only for many years now - I was quite surprised to find that it still even existed. To quote from the article.... Are you sure you are not confusing the various VSOE services with a regularly scheduled service? Try reading through the thread rather than skimming it, please. I already stated I was not talking about the VSOE train, but the Strasbourg-Vienna section of the last portion of the 'real' Orient Express train. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
S.A.C Martin Posted December 9, 2009 Author Share Posted December 9, 2009 As a penniless student I travelled home in 1974 from a period of study abroad in Trieste on the Direct Orient express, not especially glamourous but quite interesting. As I recall, the train arrived in Trieste from Belgrade, spent quite a lot of time in the station attaching and detaching cars, made its way to Venice where there was more attaching and detaching, thence to Milan, more attaching etc etc and entered Switzerland an hour or so late. Swiss efficiency took over and made sure we were exactly the same number of minutes late when we left Switzerland. We stopped at quite a few places in France, apparently to sling newspapers around (it didn't really interfere with my sleep as I did not have a sleeper or couchette, just spent the night in the seat I occupied all the way from Trieste to Calais). We arrived in Paris somewhere around 6-ish, were detached from the main train and towed around to Gare du Nord by some sort of switcher, then hauled up to Calais to catch the ferry. After that single-seat service, the journey degenerated into farce: some crappy overcrowded EMU up to London, carting suitcases on the Blunderground between stations, an extremely slow journey from Euston to Stockport with innumerable delays due to PW work, the scheduled missed connection at Stockport allowing a 58 minute wait for the next all stations to Buxton. Thank you Highpeak, for sharing your experience with us. It's much appreciated by this particular penniless student (currently and seemingly being berated for opening the topic in the first place). There's the point - it was the experience of the thing I will never sample, just like Concorde, and a few other must-do things. Only a train? For you Cornelius, yes. For me - it's a dream lost, ta. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ozexpatriate Posted December 9, 2009 Share Posted December 9, 2009 I already stated I was not talking about the VSOE train, but the Strasbourg-Vienna section of the last portion of the 'real' Orient Express train. Wikipedia The two city names most intimately associated with the Orient Express are Paris and Istanbul, the original endpoints of the service. The current Orient Express does not serve Paris or Istanbul. Its immediate predecessor, a through overnight service from Paris to Vienna ran for the very last time from Paris on Friday, June 8, 2007. Since then, the route, still called the "Orient Express", has been shortened to start from Strasbourg. For me the 'real' Orient Express runs from Paris to Istanbul. Otherwise it's like using the name 'Flying Scotsman' for a train from Peterborough to York. Nevertheless, yes, it's sad to see the name disappear. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
rovex Posted January 29, 2010 Share Posted January 29, 2010 A couple of years back I looked at the possibility of travelling to Constantinople by train. There was certainly at that time a train that ran from Paris to Istanbul, although not named the Orient Express. I wasn't that bothered with a named train, it was more the thought of travelling along the route. In the end I didn't go, as redundancy meant I had better things to spend my money on - like paying the mortgage. Would be interesting to see if it was still possible. I also found the continental timetable sites amazing, and much better than the British ones. Not only did you get train times but it told you what platform the train left from Rovex Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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