Karhedron Posted December 11, 2009 Share Posted December 11, 2009 Can anyone suggest where I can find a track plan of Marylebone station? The period I am interested in is the the 1940s through to the 1960s. Ideally I would also like to see the layout of the sidings at the adjacent milk bottling plant too. I have checked the list in "History of selected LMS stations volume 1" and Marylebone is not in there. Does anyone know if it is in volume 2? I have not been able to find a track plan online. Does anyone know of one online? Alternatively are there any books that have it in? Any help gratefulyl received. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
38c Posted December 11, 2009 Share Posted December 11, 2009 Hi The station your looking for was GCR then LNER untill tne late 1950s or a early 1960s Dave Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adam Posted December 11, 2009 Share Posted December 11, 2009 Can anyone suggest where I can find a track plan of Marylebone station? The period I am interested in is the the 1940s through to the 1960s. Ideally I would also like to see the layout of the sidings at the adjacent milk bottling plant too. I have checked the list in "History of selected LMS stations volume 1" and Marylebone is not in there. Does anyone know if it is in volume 2? I have not been able to find a track plan online. Does anyone know of one online? Alternatively are there any books that have it in? Any help gratefulyl received. Not really helpful I admit, but the reason you won't find it in a book on LMS stations is that it wasn't an LMS station (and only joined BR(M) in 1958), since it was built by the GCR, an LNER constituent. The usual suggestions are a large scale OS map of the period - a variety of editions are available from here: http://www.old-maps.co.uk/ an Aerial Photo - lots from the 1940s unsurprisingly, available from a variety of sources, e.g. http://www.ukaerialphotos.com/ Adam Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nick Holliday Posted December 11, 2009 Share Posted December 11, 2009 Although this plan is not too detailed it gives a pretty good idea of how the various parts of the station are orientated, and how the goods yard sprawls over a large area. http://archivemaps.com/mapco/bart1908/bart22b.htm I have a feeling that there is a full plan, at least of the passenger station, somewhere in George Dow's Great Central trilogy, but that's at home, so I cannot confirm. And if you want to spend a small amount of money, there is Alan Godfrey maps, I think their number 48, St John's Wood ones cover the relevant area, and the last two dates they can supply are after the station opened. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest stuartp Posted December 11, 2009 Share Posted December 11, 2009 There's a track plan and cross-section in George Dow's 'Great Central', (Vol. 3 ?) I think it dates from opening in 1901 (?) not the 40s though, not sure how much would have changed. If you can't find a copy drop me a PM. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Karhedron Posted December 11, 2009 Author Share Posted December 11, 2009 Not really helpful I admit, but the reason you won't find it in a book on LMS stations is that it wasn't an LMS station (and only joined BR(M) in 1958), since it was built by the GCR, an LNER constituent. The usual suggestions are a large scale OS map of the period - a variety of editions are available from here: http://www.old-maps.co.uk/ an Aerial Photo - lots from the 1940s unsurprisingly, available from a variety of sources, e.g. http://www.ukaerialphotos.com/ Ah, not an LMS station? That would explain my lack of success then. :oops: Thanks for the links, The aerial photos site has one of the area from 1945 which is about right although the prices are a bit steep. There's a track plan and cross-section in George Dow's 'Great Central', (Vol. 3 ?) I think it dates from opening in 1901 (?) not the 40s though, not sure how much would have changed. If you can't find a copy drop me a PM. Thanks for the kind offer. However I think that the bottling plant was not built until the 1930s so it probably won't show the detail I am interested in. Although this plan is not too detailed it gives a pretty good idea of how the various parts of the station are orientated, and how the goods yard sprawls over a large area. http://archivemaps.com/mapco/bart1908/bart22b.htm Thanks for that link, it gives a fair idea of the layout of the goods facilities. Now I wonder which one was the bottling plant? And if you want to spend a small amount of money, there is Alan Godfrey maps, I think their number 48, St John's Wood ones cover the relevant area, and the last two dates they can supply are after the station opened. Thanks, I will bear that in mind if all else fails. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest stuartp Posted December 11, 2009 Share Posted December 11, 2009 Another option I've only just thought of is the local studies section of whichever library covers Marylebone. They should have 1:2500 and/or 1:1250 OS maps at various dates which will show details of track layouts etc. They aren't publically available on line but if you know anyone currently enrolled at a UK university or college, hijack them, get them to log on to their instutution's library webpage and see if they can access Edina Digimap, which has all the old OS maps on. Hours wasted on there when I was a mature student. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Del Posted December 11, 2009 Share Posted December 11, 2009 Try the book 'Great Central - Then and Now'. There's definitely a plan in there, although don't know when from. http://www.amazon.co.uk/GREAT-CENTRAL-Then-Now/dp/B0013GBSQA Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Karhedron Posted December 11, 2009 Author Share Posted December 11, 2009 Try the book 'Great Central - Then and Now'. There's definitely a plan in there, although don't know when from. http://www.amazon.co.uk/GREAT-CENTRAL-Then-Now/dp/B0013GBSQA That's great, I will give that a try. Out of interest, does anyone know of any books that have good pictures of the freight yards and depots around marylebone? I am planning to try and get a copy of "Great Central Railway's London extension" by Robert Robotham. Any other suggestions of albums with good photos of the area would be very welcome. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Horsetan Posted December 11, 2009 Share Posted December 11, 2009 There is also a track plan in a past issue of British Railways Illustrated. I might have it somewhere...... It was in the same issue as the feature about the LMS "Crabs" Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
alcazar Posted December 11, 2009 Share Posted December 11, 2009 "The Great Central, then and now", has a really good plan dating from 1955 on p221. Shows all points etc except under the station roof. Mac Hawkins, David and Charles. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
shortliner Posted December 11, 2009 Share Posted December 11, 2009 It may also be worth contacting the local planning department of the council that covers Marylebone - they frequently have very large-scale maps on their database - it may cost you for a print-out, or perhaps a donation to their tea-swindle. Them as don't ask......... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nick Holliday Posted December 13, 2009 Share Posted December 13, 2009 I found a slightly more detailed plan of the original station at http://prints.leics.gov.uk/low.php?xp=media&xm=672524 No help with the later works, but may be of interest. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Forward! Posted December 13, 2009 Share Posted December 13, 2009 I' struggling to add much to the sound advice above. As definitive a bibliography on the GCR, and Marylebone is on the Great Central Railway Society webpage. http://www.gcrsociety.co.uk/bibliography.html There has been a good number of works on the final LMR period. another good online resource is http://www.railwayarchive.org.uk/ Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold beast66606 Posted December 13, 2009 RMweb Gold Share Posted December 13, 2009 I've seen a full signalling diagram for the original (pre BR) box - but can't remember where I'm afraid Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
TT3 Posted December 14, 2009 Share Posted December 14, 2009 Not sure if it helps but if my memory serves me right there was a decent article in RM in about 1986 with track plans and other details.. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Karhedron Posted December 14, 2009 Author Share Posted December 14, 2009 "The Great Central, then and now", has a really good plan dating from 1955 on p221. Shows all points etc except under the station roof. Sounds like my best bet as the daye is ideal. I will get a copy. Do you happen to know if the milk depot is included? I gather this was somewhere adjacent to the goods sidings. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Karhedron Posted December 18, 2009 Author Share Posted December 18, 2009 Many thanks to all for the advice. The map in "Great Central then and now" shows exactly the detail I was looking for (specifically the milk depot). Now comes an even harder challenge, can anyone help me find any photos of it? The depot appears to have been built on Rossmore road. This runs over a bridge at the northern end of the platforms. Photos of Marylebone are plentiful but the depot is very illusive. Most of the shots are either up or down the line which means the depot is out of shot. Either that or the photographer is standing on the bridge itself. As far as I can tell there was an extra platform (marked on the maps as a milk and fish wharf) which served this depot. It was at the northern end of the station on the up (eastern) side. I have a couple of pictures of railtours from the late 80s. I think that Clan Line is being prepped in the sidings beside the wharf and the buildings behind are the milk depot (they were demolished in the early 1990s as far as I can tell). Can anyone look at the pictures below and tell me if I am looking at the right part of Marylebone station for these to be the old milk depot or have I got my orientation wrong? http://daverowland.fotopic.net/p48050806.html http://daverowland.fotopic.net/p48050807.html Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Forward! Posted December 18, 2009 Share Posted December 18, 2009 I really hope someone who owns a copy can confirm this but I am pretty certain there is a detailed section in 'GCR IN LNER Days' on milk traffic to Marylebone. I don't own a copy of this two-volume work, but it might be a lead. Alas I'm interested in the 'GCR in GCR days' Will p.s- you may be interested in this GCR Diag 1z3 Milk Van. It is 2mm scale and part of my 'to build' pile. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Karhedron Posted December 18, 2009 Author Share Posted December 18, 2009 I have managed to contact the photographer and has confirmed that this is indeed the old milk depot. This is a bit of a eureka moment for me as this is the first photo I have found showing one of these urban bottling plants. They seem to have been very poorly recorded, even compared to the rural creameries that supplied them. In this case I was lucky as the depot is right next to a major station and was "in shot". Definitely one for the album. Thanks to all those who have helped in this research. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
alcazar Posted December 19, 2009 Share Posted December 19, 2009 LOL, if you look closely at the map of Marylebone Station, and at the end of the track you think is the milk depot, you'll see the notation, "Roberts Ho.". Just above that, is printed, "Milk Depot". The second shot of Clan line actually shows part of it. I don't know about a eureka moment, it's more of a "D'Oh! " moment Nice find anyway. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Bigcheeseplant Posted December 19, 2009 Share Posted December 19, 2009 For a number of years a BTH class 15 was parked there for carrage warming. David Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
38c Posted December 19, 2009 Share Posted December 19, 2009 Hi I can confirm "The Great Central in LNER Days" contains a photo of the dairy on page89. Also the British Railways Illustrated you need is Vol 7 June 1998. Hope this helps Dave Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Karhedron Posted December 19, 2009 Author Share Posted December 19, 2009 I can confirm "The Great Central in LNER Days" contains a photo of the dairy on page89. Also the British Railways Illustrated you need is Vol 7 June 1998. Hope this helps That does indeed! I will try and track both those down, many thanks! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Karhedron Posted November 21, 2011 Author Share Posted November 21, 2011 Resurrecting this thread after quite some time. I have managed to find a copy of the signal box diagram from 1946. Thanks to everyone for their help and suggestions, I hope this helps others out there. http://www.signalbox.org/diagrams.php?id=414 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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