johnpee Posted April 12, 2012 Share Posted April 12, 2012 Has anyone had a Heljan Class 35, 37 or 50 that has split the primary gear wheel in the gearbox ? I am told by Heljen that I have just been "unlucky" with my models and there is no problem. I have already replaced the gear sets in my class 35 and 37 after less that 24 hours total running time each. The replacements have been supplied by Howes free of charge but this does not allow for the time and hassle of replacing them. I would welcome reports of any other failures of this type to try and get Heljen to admit there is an issue and do something positve about the problem before all of us who have bought locos with this type of gearbox are left with long sidings of expensive scrap. I will not consider buying any more Heljen models until this problem is sorted out. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Horsetan Posted April 13, 2012 Share Posted April 13, 2012 Sounds like the plastic used wasn't quite up to it, particularly where the mass and momentum of 7mm scale is concerned. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mod5 Posted April 14, 2012 Share Posted April 14, 2012 There is also this thread which points to others and how to solve it if it helps. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grovenor Posted April 14, 2012 Share Posted April 14, 2012 Unfortunately it appears the blog linked to from that other thread has vanished. Regards Keith Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phill Dyson (onslaught832) Posted April 14, 2012 Share Posted April 14, 2012 I have also replaced the gear on one of my 7mm Heljans & I have a few friends who have had this problem too..............so there must be quite a few of these isolated incidents then ! I have also noticed that my BSYP Hymek has recently started shedding the chrome ? plating from it's wheels .........anyone had this problem yet ? Cheers Phill Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
charliepetty Posted April 14, 2012 Share Posted April 14, 2012 I have also replaced the gear on one of my 7mm Heljans & I have a few friends who have had this problem too..............so there must be quite a few of these isolated incidents then ! I have also noticed that my BSYP Hymek has recently started shedding the chrome ? plating from it's wheels .........anyone had this problem yet ? Cheers Phill Contact Howes of Oxford for spare gear sets. Normally FREE! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kev_Lewis Posted April 14, 2012 Share Posted April 14, 2012 I had the same problem with my 37. It was easy and inexpensive to fix, so I'm not worried. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheEngineShed Posted April 14, 2012 Share Posted April 14, 2012 Splitting sleeves either side of the gear was a problem with USA Trains 1/29 scale diesels, don't know if it still is... One easy fix for that problem was to wrap the sleeve on either side of the gear with mono-filament fishing line glued in place with epoxy or cyanoacrylate glue. This strengthens the sleeve and prevents it from cracking or restores an already cracked sleeve. If you can find an appropriate diameter thin wall pipe, that would work too. Don't own a Heljan O gauge diesel, so don't know what the clearances are like, but if I was replacing this part, I'd consider strengthening it. The fishing line trick takes a couple of minutes an axle... There's a photo in the topic linked below: http://www.mylargescale.com/Community/Forums/tabid/56/afv/topic/aff/8/aft/18979/Default.aspx Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kev_Lewis Posted April 14, 2012 Share Posted April 14, 2012 Splitting sleeves either side of the gear was a problem with USA Trains 1/29 scale diesels, don't know if it still is... One easy fix for that problem was to wrap the sleeve on either side of the gear with mono-filament fishing line glued in place with epoxy or cyanoacrylate glue. This strengthens the sleeve and prevents it from cracking or restores an already cracked sleeve. If you can find an appropriate diameter thin wall pipe, that would work too. Don't own a Heljan O gauge diesel, so don't know what the clearances are like, but if I was replacing this part, I'd consider strengthening it. The fishing line trick takes a couple of minutes an axle... There's a photo in the topic linked below: http://www.mylargesc...79/Default.aspx That's a nice fix but it wouldn't work with the Heljan gears. Here's a pic of the offending gear from the Howes Models website: http://www.howesmode...O4/IMGP4964.JPG It was the smaller cog that split on mine and there's nowhere to wrap the fishing line around. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheEngineShed Posted April 14, 2012 Share Posted April 14, 2012 http://www.howesmode...O4/IMGP4964.JPG Ouch. It does look like you are at Heljan's mercy... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kev_Lewis Posted April 14, 2012 Share Posted April 14, 2012 Ouch. It does look like you are at Heljan's mercy... Yeah, there's not a lot we can do, other than buying new gears from them. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
brian daniels Posted April 14, 2012 Share Posted April 14, 2012 Yeah, there's not a lot we can do, other than buying new gears from them. As was mentioned earlier in this post, the replacements are free from Howes Models Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phill Dyson (onslaught832) Posted April 15, 2012 Share Posted April 15, 2012 The replacement gear is listed as sold out for all class's except the class 20 on Howes website Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Tomlinson Posted April 16, 2012 Share Posted April 16, 2012 I have had a related issue on two locos, a 35 and a 47. On one bogie of each there was a moulding flaw on the cog closest to the worm, so that the spacing between the teeth was uneven. This produced a clicking sound although the locos worked quite happily. A telephone conversation with the very helpful man at Howes diagnosed the issue PDQ, and the replacement cogs, free of charge, arrived the following day. The parts were common to both locos, and I wonder if indeed the worms, cogs and motors are common to all of Heljan's diesels? Whilst there was a cost in my time, I felt that the dismantling and replacement process had been quite instructive in how the locos are designed and worked, whilst Howes attitude was first class. The locos now perform flawlessly, albeit only on my short test track. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phill Dyson (onslaught832) Posted April 16, 2012 Share Posted April 16, 2012 According to Howes website they all use the same gears apart from the Class 20's Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnpee Posted April 17, 2012 Author Share Posted April 17, 2012 Like most others it did not bother me that much to replace a pair of gear wheels and I quite enjoyed seeing how it all worked. Now after changing a FOURTH set the task is becoming a real pain. These are all on locos with less than 24 hours running!!!. Heljen still refuse to recognise there is a problem and told me so at the SECC model rail scotland show in February. Contacting Heljen in Denmark was also a waste of time. So all you purchasers of Heljen O gauge locos beware especially those of you who have bought them, run them once and stored them away. If in the future the supply of these dry up you will be left with a very expensive static loco. If anyone out there with a suggestion as to how to get Heljen to do something positive please let me know. If you know a contact name of the fat controller at Heljen, let me know. The attitude of my model supplier (Tower) was to pass the problem to Howes at my expense (in time) and inconvenience. I will not be buying anything more from Heljen until this is resolved, and I would recommend that anyone thinking of doing so, keep your money in your pocket...... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phill Dyson (onslaught832) Posted April 17, 2012 Share Posted April 17, 2012 Tower were equally un-helpful for me too, as they passed me on to Howes as well. Howes were much more helpful, but they still liked to pretend these are isolated incidents ( most people I know with Heljans have had this problem) What worries me is the lack of spare gears now listed on the Howes website & the lack interest shown by Heljan........will we get a new/endless supply of gears or better still a stronger gear that does not split ? I have a 47 & two Hymeks, are these problems occurring with later release models too ? I was going to get a Heljan Western when it is released, but I will need this issue resolving before I make anymore purchases. Cheers Phill Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium polybear Posted April 18, 2012 RMweb Premium Share Posted April 18, 2012 If anyone out there with a suggestion as to how to get Heljen to do something positive please let me know. If you know a contact name of the fat controller at Heljen, let me know. You could always start returning the locos to dealers as being "Not fit for purpose" and "Not of Merchantable Quality". After Heljan start getting £500 locos heading back their way they'll start to listed.... I do have an email address for numero uno at Heljan at home somewhere I think - I'll dig it out for you. I last used it during the 4mm Clayton Class 17 saga..... HTH Brian Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phill Dyson (onslaught832) Posted April 18, 2012 Share Posted April 18, 2012 You could always start returning the locos to dealers as being "Not fit for purpose" and "Not of Merchantable Quality". After Heljan start getting £500 locos heading back their way they'll start to listed.... Brian Good idea for those who have untouched Heljans with split gears, sadly not really an option for me though when I have spent many hours super detailing & weathering these loco's. Contact details you mention for senior Heljan people would be useful. Personally I can live with the gear fault if replacement gears remain freely available, although this is not the ideal solution. BTW Did the 4mm Clayton problem get sorted out ? Cheers Phill Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium polybear Posted April 18, 2012 RMweb Premium Share Posted April 18, 2012 Contact details you mention for senior Heljan people would be useful. Personally I can live with the gear fault if replacement gears remain freely available, although this is not the ideal solution. BTW Did the 4mm Clayton problem get sorted out ? Cheers Phill Hi Phil, I'll sort the email address for you when I get home if that's ok. Free Gears are ok (though far from ideal - you shouldn't have to keep diving under the bonnet every few hours to keep the loco running), but will they still be available in ten years time? What is needed is a modified gear to solve the problem once and for all. BTW, the Clayton did get sorted courtesy of Howes (dodgy motor problem). I understand it may not have been an isolated incident Brian Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
brian daniels Posted April 20, 2012 Share Posted April 20, 2012 Heljan are aware of issues of the gears splitting. It's no use emailing Heljan I am afraid, get in touch with Howes 01865 848000 as they will sort you out. I am affraid a lot of people are saying they have problems with products but not getting in touch with the UK agent so as far as they know there is no problem. Please ring Howes and let them know of any problems regardless of how insignificant it is. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phill Dyson (onslaught832) Posted April 24, 2012 Share Posted April 24, 2012 get in touch with Howes 01865 848000 as they will sort you out. I am affraid a lot of people are saying they have problems with products but not getting in touch with the UK agent so as far as they know there is no problem. Please ring Howes and let them know of any problems regardless of how insignificant it is. I made Howes aware of my split gear 2 years ago Brian & was sent a replacement gear by return post. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Joseph_Pestell Posted April 24, 2012 RMweb Gold Share Posted April 24, 2012 Lima used to have a similar problem with nylon gears on HO locomotives. To think that nylon/plastic will cope with the extra forces involved in 0 seems like folly. This needs a properly engineered solution. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Horsetan Posted April 24, 2012 Share Posted April 24, 2012 Lima used to have a similar problem with nylon gears on HO locomotives. To think that nylon/plastic will cope with the extra forces involved in 0 seems like folly. This needs a properly engineered solution. Brass or steel? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ian Kirk Posted April 25, 2012 Share Posted April 25, 2012 Hi, Nylon should be strong enough even for O gauge. Producing a similar gear set in brass would of course be much more expensive and perhaps noisier. The engineer in me suggests that the problem is with the assembly onto the axle. From the photograph the moulded gear is pressed onto the axle which appears to be splined. It would also seem to have been plated (which would increase the size by a small amount). If the sizes and tolerences are correct the moulding should push onto the axle with an interference fit, the splines stop it turning and all is well. If it is forced on when the clearances are too tight you introduce stresses in the plastic around the axle with the potential for cracks developing (usually from one of the grooves made by the splines). Not that this helps any of you but it should be relatively easy for the manufacturer to fix. I don't see locos lying around unused because parts become unobtainable. Quite apart from the damage this would do to reputation with consequent loss of sales it would, if there were enough locos with this fault, become worthwhile for someone else to produce an alternative part. best wishes, Ian Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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