Semaphore Signals - 4mm Scale (Mainly)

[G.M.R.]

I hope you dont mind me asking a couple of questions regarding signal building.

 

I am building a 16ft tall Home Signal for Llanfyllin from a MSE kit, but, am a bit confused by some of the instructions regarding fitting the balance weight

 

It tells me to solder a washer to the end of a 26swg nickel silver axle, then pass the axle through the bracket trapping the balance lever in the bracket

 

The instructions then say to drill a hole through left and right faces of post and push the axle through the post from the left hand side

 

Questions:

If the Washer is between the post and the bracket should it really be soldered to the end of the axle?

Which is the left and roght of a signal?

I have photos of signals, but, no close ups of the balance weight fitting, however it seems that some have the balance weights under the arm and others under the spectacle plate, that is really confusing. The photos of the GWR/Cambrian signal at Llanfyllin does not show the balance lever

 

Terry,

 

I've followed those instructions a few times and interpreted them like this:-

 

Starting from the end of the axle on the balance weight side of the post. We have firstly the soldered washer which acts like an end stop, then the outer part of the bracket, then the balance weight itself, then the inner part of the bracket, then the axle goes through the post and finally is soldered in place on the other side. I've got a photo somewhere of an early one I did. I'll post it when I find it. Hope that helps.

 

 

Edit. Maybe that photo helps. I've used a 16BA bolt instead of the wire axle and washer, but it looks the same.

Edited December 8, 2015 by G.M.R.

[Steve Hewitt]

Hi Steve,

 

Good to be able to say 'hi' at Warley. Inspirational work indeed

Thanks,

 

It was good to meet several RMwebbers at Warley.

I wish I could remember them all individually.

I can remember some faces, some names and some RMwebnames, but then it all gets a bit difficult

 

Steve.

[Steve Hewitt]

Terry,

 

I've followed those instructions a few times and interpreted them like this:-

 

Starting from the end of the axle on the balance weight side of the post. We have firstly the soldered washer which acts like an end stop, then the outer part of the bracket, then the balance weight itself, then the inner part of the bracket, then the axle goes through the post and finally is soldered in place on the other side. I've got a photo somewhere of an early one I did. I'll post it when I find it. Hope that helps.

 

image.jpeg

 

Edit. Maybe that photo helps. I've used a 16BA bolt instead of the wire axle and washer, but it looks the same.

Thanks for the reply.

Couldn't have put it better myself!

 

I use a lace pin instead of a wire and washer, but the effect if very much the same.

 

Left and Right depend on where you're looking from.

I usually say "looking at the front of the signal, in the direction of travel", so for a signal on the left side of the line, "right" is nearest the track.

 

Steve.

[Isambard Kingdom Brunel]

Thanks to you both for clearing up the 'washer' problem, I don't know where I got the idea the washer was between the bracket and post, I think a diagram in GWR Branchlines book 3.

Nite then back to the left and right.

The instructions say push the axle through from the left, using your method Steve, that would imply pushing it through the post towards the track, whereas I would have thought if the signal were in front of me on the left, I would push it through the post away from me? Hope you can under stand me coz I'm having trouble explaining it

[Steve Hewitt]

Thanks to you both for clearing up the 'washer' problem, I don't know where I got the idea the washer was between the bracket and post, I think a diagram in GWR Branchlines book 3.

Nite then back to the left and right.

The instructions say push the axle through from the left, using your method Steve, that would imply pushing it through the post towards the track, whereas I would have thought if the signal were in front of me on the left, I would push it through the post away from me? Hope you can under stand me coz I'm having trouble explaining it

Hi Terry,

 

Forget the Left and Right, it all depends where you want the Balance weight to be located.

The pivot point can be on either SIDE or the FRONT of the post.

It is determined by factors such as Upper or Lower quadrant operation, clearance at the signal location, wire direction to the signal box etc.

Find a suitable photo and copy that.

If no photo of the actual prototype, find one of another signal on the same railway in the same period.

 

Good luck,

Steve.

[Isambard Kingdom Brunel]

The realisation of the site of the balance weight in relation to the signal being upper or lower hit me with a dull thud as I was driving to work today.

Thanks for your help

[Steve Hewitt]

A GWR interlude.......

 

Those who visited my demo stand at Warley might have seen the part built signal I had on my workbench.

It is a fairly tall GWR Home and Distant from the "wooden post era".

 

It is now completed, and here are a few snaps:

 

The signal awaiting "planting".

 

Like this.

 

A few closer shots:

 

 

And with the staging timbers added:

 

 

 

Finally, with the lamps lit:

 

And the backlight showing:

 

More later, including a short video.

 

Steve.

[Steve Hewitt]

The Groundworks.....

 

Some may have noticed on the previous post, I have marked the transport frame "Cork and Sundeala".

This is the nature of the baseboard where the signal will be installed.

It is a total of 18mm thick.

 

 

The arrow on all these components points in the direction the signal will be viewed.

 

A length of 1/2in dia brass tube is used to ensure accurate alignment

 

I'm not sure how well Sundeala will take screws, which is how I normally have the servo mount installed.

 

To ensure a sound fixing of the servos, I've added an extra piece of plywood which will be screwed and glued to the Sundeala.

This in turn has captive 6BA bolts to retain the servo mount:

 

In place:

 

And screwed - no glue here as this has to be transferred to the layout when the signal is installed:

 

The servo mount:

 

is just made from plywood and glue:

 

Aligned by the brass tube:

 

And retained with 6BA nuts and washers:

 

Installing the signal.....

 

The brass tube is removed and the signal put in its place:

 

The servos are in "Safe" mode - mid position and locked.

The red heat shrink is covering the fibre optics as much to make them visible as for protection.

 

The links between the operating wires and the servo horns are installed:

 

Withe signal arms set to a mid-position also - to correspond with the servos:

 

The links are soldered to the operating wires:

 

Final job is to move the GF Controls unit out of "Safe" mode and adjust the arms for "Danger" and "Clear":

 

The result is best seen on this video:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7qaBWsJ9uDc

 

Steve.

[trustytrev]

A GWR interlude.......

 

Those who visited my demo stand at Warley might have seen the part built signal I had on my workbench.

It is a fairly tall GWR Home and Distant from the "wooden post era".

 

It is now completed, and here are a few snaps:

 

RIMG2109.jpg

The signal awaiting "planting".

 

RIMG2110.jpg

Like this.

 

A few closer shots:

RIMG2118.jpg

 

RIMG2119.jpg

 

And with the staging timbers added:

RIMG2120.jpg

 

RIMG2122.jpg

 

RIMG2124.jpg

 

Finally, with the lamps lit:

RIMG2138.jpg

 

And the backlight showing:

RIMG2139.jpg

 

More later, including a short video.

 

Steve.

Exquisite Steve.

trustytrev.

[Steve Hewitt]

Merry Christmas to all my "followers".

 

Thanks for your interest and comments during the past year.

 

Best wishes,

Steve.

[Steve Hewitt]

Happy New Year....

 

Something a little different I started over the Festive Season.....

 

I've been asked to make a Banner Repeater to be added to a signal which is already installed on the Carlisle layout.

The main part of the signal is a BR cantilevered bracket carrying a colour light signal and theatre indicator.

The prototype has a Banner Repeater, facing in the opposite direction to overcome siting difficulties because of the track curvature.

 

My intention is to make a working and lit Repeater with mechanical operation by cranks, from a servo to be mounted below the baseboard.

The model I make will then be attached to the existing signal and the operating bits routed down through the structure.

 

I'm starting with the MSE Kit which provides parts for two repeaters.

Each comprises a cast body, and a small brass etch:

 

The arm is attached to a lace pin for a pivot:

 

The cast body was cleaned up a bit, and drilled for the pivot hole:

 

Like so:

 

The front needs glazing, so I made a punch like this:

 

Which produced:

from some acrylic sheet.

 

The kit includes an etched bezel which should retain the glazing, and finish off the front of the signal.

Unfortunately, I found it to be far too flimsy, and consequently un-usable (by me).

 

In its place a turned a bezel from Brass:

which is a close fit on the white metal body, and holds the glazing in place.

 

The front of the bezel is curved, and a section filed out to clear the base of the body casting:

 

Like so:

 

The foot of signal is made from a couple of etched components:

 

And it goes together to give:

 

That would be it for the main signal, just a crank to fit to the rear of the pivot to make it operational.

 

However, this one has to be lit.

I've decided to use a surface mount LED for this job:

 

In order to keep the light down to a reasonable "glow", I experimented with 2.65kohm resistors in series:

This little lot seems about right with a 9v supply.

 

The LED now has to be buried in the foot of the signal......?

 

More later.

 

Steve.

 

 

[Jon Fitness]

Happy New Year....

 

Something a little different I started over the Festive Season.....

 

I've been asked to make a Banner Repeater to be added to a signal which is already installed on the Carlisle layout.

The main part of the signal is a BR cantilevered bracket carrying a colour light signal and theatre indicator.

The prototype has a Banner Repeater, facing in the opposite direction to overcome siting difficulties because of the track curvature.

 

My intention is to make a working and lit Repeater with mechanical operation by cranks, from a servo to be mounted below the baseboard.

The model I make will then be attached to the existing signal and the operating bits routed down through the structure.

 

I'm starting with the MSE Kit which provides parts for two repeaters.

Each comprises a cast body, and a small brass etch:

RIMG2145.jpg

 

The arm is attached to a lace pin for a pivot:

RIMG2146.jpg

 

The cast body was cleaned up a bit, and drilled for the pivot hole:

RIMG2147.jpg

 

Like so:

RIMG2148.jpg

 

The front needs glazing, so I made a punch like this:

RIMG2152.jpg

 

Which produced:

RIMG2151.jpg

from some acrylic sheet.

 

The kit includes an etched bezel which should retain the glazing, and finish off the front of the signal.

Unfortunately, I found it to be far too flimsy, and consequently un-usable (by me).

 

In its place a turned a bezel from Brass:

RIMG2149.jpg

which is a close fit on the white metal body, and holds the glazing in place.

 

The front of the bezel is curved, and a section filed out to clear the base of the body casting:

RIMG2150.jpg

 

Like so:

RIMG2155.jpg

 

The foot of signal is made from a couple of etched components:

RIMG2153.jpg

 

And it goes together to give:

RIMG2156.jpg

 

That would be it for the main signal, just a crank to fit to the rear of the pivot to make it operational.

 

However, this one has to be lit.

I've decided to use a surface mount LED for this job:

RIMG2158.jpg

 

In order to keep the light down to a reasonable "glow", I experimented with 2.65kohm resistors in series:

RIMG2159.jpg

This little lot seems about right with a 9v supply.

 

The LED now has to be buried in the foot of the signal......?

 

More later.

 

Steve.

Superb! Looking forward to seeing this working. I do like a banner repeater!

JF

[Steve Hewitt]

Progress.......

 

After some butchery to the casting, and reconstructive surgery with modelling putty, the LED is buried in the base of the signal.

 

For installation on an existing signal, to be achieved by someone else, in a far distant land, I've tried to make it as easy as possible.

From supplied dimensions, I've determined the relative position of the banner repeater, its operating crank, routing for the wires etc.

 

This has enabled a small sub-assembly to be made:

Glazing masked for painting.

 

and from the rear:

 

This can then be installed on the bracket signal, such that the operating wire which pulls down on the crank, and the LED wires can be routed inside the main stem.

 

After painting:

 

 

Hooked up to a PP3 9v battery to test the LED:

 

And in the dark:

 

 

The strip of scrap etch on which this sub-assembly is built has "double sided" sticky tape on the base, so it should be a very simple installation task.

 

Steve.

 

 

 

[Jon Fitness]

Progress.......

 

After some butchery to the casting, and reconstructive surgery with modelling putty, the LED is buried in the base of the signal.

 

For installation on an existing signal, to be achieved by someone else, in a far distant land, I've tried to make it as easy as possible.

From supplied dimensions, I've determined the relative position of the banner repeater, its operating crank, routing for the wires etc.

 

This has enabled a small sub-assembly to be made:

RIMG2175.jpg

Glazing masked for painting.

 

and from the rear:

RIMG2176.jpg

 

This can then be installed on the bracket signal, such that the operating wire which pulls down on the crank, and the LED wires can be routed inside the main stem.

 

After painting:

RIMG2199.jpg

 

RIMG2197.jpg

 

Hooked up to a PP3 9v battery to test the LED:

RIMG2192.jpg

 

And in the dark:

RIMG2194.jpg

 

RIMG2193.jpg

 

The strip of scrap etch on which this sub-assembly is built has "double sided" sticky tape on the base, so it should be a very simple installation task.

 

Steve.

Looks excellent. Just the right amount of lighting. I've never done an internally lit one so that's another tip for the note book :-!

Cheers

JF

[Steve Hewitt]

A "Quicky for Walton-on-the-Hill.....

 

This is a model of an old CLC post, which was superseded by the Upper Quadrant signal I've already built.

 

It was left in place on the prototype possibly because it carried a Yard Lamp.

As Mike hasn't yet decided how to deal with Yard Lamps, I've left it off for him to tackle at a later date.

(I must paint the base-plate before I deliver it.)

 

The post is a 3d print, with a cast white metal finial (MSE), and strengthened ladder (MSE plus N/S wire).

 

Coming soon - the three arm shunt signal.......

 

 

Steve.

[Michael Delamar]

Thanks Steve, looks great, I think it was kept as it had wires attached to it.

 

[Steve Hewitt]

And another for Walton-on-the-Hill......

 

This is the photo Mike has sent me for a three arm shunt signal:

 

 

This should be fairly straight forward, with a main post of Brass Tubes, Arm Bearings/Lamps will be 3D prints, and the arms, weight bars etc. from MSE etches.

 

Photos and details soon.

 

Steve.

 

 

[G.M.R.]

I find the safety hoop interesting. Clearly it provides a little protection when the lamp man accesses the top arm's lamp, but I would think he would just have to hang on tight when accessing either of the other two?

[G.M.R.]

Thanks Steve, looks great, I think it was kept as it had wires attached to it.

image.jpg

What are the "scaffolding" poles for?

[Welly]

What are the "scaffolding" poles for?

I suspect it was for a temporary loading gauge.

[Steve Hewitt]

Making a start.....

 

I made up the main post from telescopic thinwall brass tubes, according to "Warburton" - the bible for such things.

The 3D printed "Arm Bearing & L:amp" were then fixed in place.

 

The holes where the Fibre Optics will pass into the post were drilled 0.6mm, at a shallow angle to avoid abrading the fibre.

 

With its short arms, this signal has a very "Slim" appearance.

I needed to minimise the width of the Weight Bar assembly so that it doesn't look too overscale.

The width of such an assembly is determined as much as anything by the space taken up by the operating wires, these being 0.4mm thick N/S.

Where three wires have to be attached to three balance arms adjacent to each other, it can get quite "chunky".

To avoid this, I staggered the connections to the centre balance arm from the outer two just enough to keep the adjacent wires apart;

 

 

The baseplate was made with similar staggering of the Guide Tubes for the operating wires:

 

 

 

More soon....

 

Steve.

 

[Michael Delamar]

What are the "scaffolding" poles for?

They were for measuring the height of overhead lines.

[krmodels]

Hi Steve.

Thanks for the information provided in this blog, Some great ideas, for signal building no matter what scale or country you are attempting to depict. I notice how you build your ladders, and I have 2 ladder building jigs, to suit 7mm and HO/4mm. if you are interested I can send you one of the HO Jigs to try. For more infor on the jig, go to http://www.krmodels.com.au/krm_misc_004_page.html.

 

Regards Keiran

[Steve Hewitt]

Hi Steve.

Thanks for the information provided in this blog, Some great ideas, for signal building no matter what scale or country you are attempting to depict. I notice how you build your ladders, and I have 2 ladder building jigs, to suit 7mm and HO/4mm. if you are interested I can send you one of the HO Jigs to try. For more infor on the jig, go to http://www.krmodels.com.au/krm_misc_004_page.html.

 

Regards Keiran

Hi Keiran,

 

That's a very kind offer.

I must admit that over the years I've built several ladders using wire rungs and etched stiles and never managed to make a straight one!

I'll certainly give your jig a try, and post the process and result on here.

 

Steve.

[Steve Hewitt]

Nearing completion....

 

With the main structure completed and painted,:

 

 

The fibres have been installed, and are picking up a little light from my workbench:

 

With the arms installed and the operating wires connected:

 

 

 

It starts to look like a signal:

 

More soon, with a video.....

 

Steve.