RMweb Gold Re6/6 Posted January 30, 2023 RMweb Gold Share Posted January 30, 2023 25 minutes ago, MrWolf said: Possibly that the glue component in dilute or otherwise PVA is non conductive? You could be right. All I know is that I get better results with the 'bespoke' glues than ordinary PVA. Don't know why! 1 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium peterm1 Posted March 25, 2023 RMweb Premium Share Posted March 25, 2023 I'm hopefully not too far off from starting some grass on my layout. I've been reading this thread but need to find out what to use for the layering. Being down under we often have to think of something other than products you can get in England. I was thinking of cheap non scented hairspray. Am I anywhere near the mark? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold teaky Posted March 25, 2023 RMweb Gold Share Posted March 25, 2023 7 minutes ago, peterm1 said: I'm hopefully not too far off from starting some grass on my layout. I've been reading this thread but need to find out what to use for the layering. Being down under we often have to think of something other than products you can get in England. I was thinking of cheap non scented hairspray. Am I anywhere near the mark? This guy's YouTube videos might be of use. He's Australian, so I imagine he has the same access to products as you. https://www.youtube.com/@LukeTowan Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium peterm1 Posted March 26, 2023 RMweb Premium Share Posted March 26, 2023 Thanks teaky, I've looked at his site but can't see anything about a layering substitute. I've heard about people recommending ordinary spray glue for the layering, but that seems a bit aggressive. I've got the proper basing glue and thought I might try thinning that down and spraying it on. It's a shame we can't buy the proper stuff over here. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jdb82 Posted March 26, 2023 Share Posted March 26, 2023 I have used WWS layering spray which seems pretty good - I use it for making trees too. They post worldwide according to their website, and although the spray can is only available to post to the UK, they have a non-aerosol version here which they will ship globally. Maybe worth a try. https://www.wwscenics.com/product/layering-sprays/ 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
mac1960 Posted November 11, 2023 Share Posted November 11, 2023 I am trying to source some static grass from Silhouettes/ Mini nature a German manufacturer. The UK supplier has currently run out that I use. Anybody know of other suppliers ? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
swisspeat Posted January 3 Share Posted January 3 I tried typing in Mini Natur UK Supplier into a search engine. I found a few UK shops came up. Occasionally their excellent quality scenics is available at shows. The manufacturer does I understand post direct to the UK. I looked at doing that once but their P and P was rather too expensive. Probably cheaper to send from a German model shop. Peter Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
swisspeat Posted January 3 Share Posted January 3 And is response to the earlier questions about layering sprays I also find that Spray Adhesive is just too sticky for this purpose. It swamps the fibres of the existing layer of scenics and too many static grass fibres will stick to it. It will not look realistic. But I find that unscented extra hold hairspray works really well indeed for second and subsequent layers of static grass fibres. Go steady on the amount of hairspray released onto the tops of the already laid scenics - a little goes a long way. Enjoy working with static grass fibres! Peter Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Re6/6 Posted January 5 RMweb Gold Share Posted January 5 If the layout 'never leaves home' hairspray is fine. I've used it ever since the advent of static grass but to our chagrin when we got 'Balcombe' out after three years of outside insulated shed storage last year, a vast amount of expensive fibres had fallen to the floor. Being a cheapskate, I swept it all up up and seived it for re-use! If one's layout is portable then I would use Peco or WWS layering sprays which do have a stronger hold, after all hairspray is designed for 'one night'! Just a thought! 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter Kazmierczak Posted January 5 Share Posted January 5 To be honest, I've not read this whole thread. BUT, I thought I'd enter the 21st century and try using static grass on my Shardlow layout, instead of ye olde flock powder/coloured sawdust. What's the best way to begin? I've looked at various YouTube videos, but am none the wiser. Is it worth buying a Woodland Scenics starter kit, and taking it from there? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold 96701 Posted January 5 RMweb Gold Share Posted January 5 It largely depends on how much you want to pay. I built a pound shop version from an electronic fly swatter and metal tea strainer. A friend with an N gauge layout borrowed it and was perfectly happy with the results that he obtained. Having given it back to me, he built an extension, so bought one of these grass and again was delighted. He did have a recent problem whereby he left the lid off the static grass, dropped his headlight into it (by accident) and ended up with the whole lot upside down on his carpet! His advice? "Always put the lid back on your static grass." Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Re6/6 Posted January 5 RMweb Gold Share Posted January 5 3 hours ago, 96701 said: He did have a recent problem whereby he left the lid off the static grass, dropped his headlight into it (by accident) and ended up with the whole lot upside down on his carpet! His advice? "Always put the lid back on your static grass." Aaah.....I chuckled when I read that! The times that I've left the lid off, turned it over to start flocking and tipped the fibres all over the place and a big clean up/rescue was needed! I now conciously check that the lid is firmly screwed on before work...mind you that's no guarantee....!😉 Peter, a starter pack would probably be a good idea to get the feel of it all. It would also depend on how much static work you have to do. If you have a fair bit to do then Phil's recommendation https://dmgelectech.co.uk/product/static-grass-applicator/ looks to be a good place to start. I have a lot to do, probably 5m² +, so my heavy duty 35 kv machine is most useful. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
swisspeat Posted January 6 Share Posted January 6 When I first saw the Woodland Scenics Starter Kit I did not think it would work but after using it a few times it does if you limit yourself to max grass fibres of 4mm. tea strainer types work ok for the same size of fibres but you do have to be careful that you do not load the bowl too high because as you shake it bundles of grass fibres drop onto the layout. what scale do you work in? If it up to OO scale these starter kits are ok because once the rule has dried you can add a second and third layer to build up the height. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
swisspeat Posted January 6 Share Posted January 6 John, interesting comments about grass grass falling off. So far that has not happened to me with extra hold hairspray and my projects are stored in a damp garage. i always just liquid glue for the first layer of fibres then hairspray for any subsequent additional patches or colour variations. glad to see you reused the fibres that had fallen off. I would do the same! peter Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Re6/6 Posted January 6 RMweb Gold Share Posted January 6 (edited) 31 minutes ago, swisspeat said: what scale do you work in? Balcombe and Parkend Marsh Sidings are in P4 When they're built (!) Rüthi (SBB) and Lisanno (FS) will be in H0. Ouse Valley Viaduct Parkend Edited January 6 by Re6/6 3 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Re6/6 Posted January 6 RMweb Gold Share Posted January 6 The problem with the storage is that we're on the coast with very high salt and moisture in the air and the boards are stood on end....moisture and gravity! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
swisspeat Posted January 6 Share Posted January 6 Thanks! on the viaduct board that is a lot of fibres! :-) I have recently been playing around with glues for static grass. Surprisingly I found that one of the best is Elmer’s School Glue. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Re6/6 Posted January 6 RMweb Gold Share Posted January 6 2 hours ago, swisspeat said: I have recently been playing around with glues for static grass. Surprisingly I found that one of the best is Elmer’s School Glue. Peter, I've yet to try 'school glue' but I heard from someone in the business (can't remember who!) that the commercial base glue sold by them is a very sinilar consistency to 'school glue' and not PVA. Apparently PVA is rubber based and proprietary basing glues are polymer based. Quite what the effective difference is, I don't know, but in my experience the proprietary stuff works better for me. Much as the difference between hairspray and layering spray! Yes, there is rather a lot of grass so a large quantity of fibres required! The picture shows about 20% that is needed! I'll look into trying some 'school glue' which is probably much cheaper than the commercial stuff. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrWolf Posted January 6 Share Posted January 6 It was good old Copydex when I was in junior school, it's latex based apparently. https://www.findel-education.co.uk/product/art-and-design/glues-and-adhesives/pva/copydex-adhesive-125ml/he1877206#:~:text=Copydex flexible latex glue is,frequently used in primary schools. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
WIMorrison Posted January 6 Share Posted January 6 You will know if it is Copydex from the smell - totally unique, and unforgettable Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
swisspeat Posted January 7 Share Posted January 7 Regarding Elmers... Last week I did a test of PVA, Noch Grass Glue, Mod Podge, Static Tac and Elmers School Glue. I used identical fibres etc. I used a Static King on mains power. I did the test because I had seen US You Tube clips suggesting Mod Podge was the best for planting grass fibres and I wanted to see if that was correct compared to formulated grass glues. My test proved by far that Elmers planted more fibres than any of the others which was a big surprise! 1 1 5 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Re6/6 Posted January 7 RMweb Gold Share Posted January 7 That's impressive Peter. I've ordered some! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
swisspeat Posted January 7 Share Posted January 7 The cheapest I found is at B and M. Other discount stores are available! :-) Various sized bottles are available. Please let us know if you find it a good glue for this purpose. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Re6/6 Posted January 7 RMweb Gold Share Posted January 7 Will do Peter! 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold ikcdab Posted March 2 RMweb Gold Share Posted March 2 I've just run out of my WWS layering spray. And it's £12 to £14 for a replacement. Lots of talk on here about using hairspray instead. So whats the best hairspray to look for? I guess "extra hold" sounds good, but a lot of these boast " no stickiness" which seems the opposite of what we need. I'm tempted to go into B&M and just buy the cheapest, which I guess will be sticky.... Any suggestions? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Create an account or sign in to comment
You need to be a member in order to leave a comment
Create an account
Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!
Register a new accountSign in
Already have an account? Sign in here.
Sign In Now