Wright writes.....

[Mallard60022]

Ahh boiler cladding securing bands. They are so difficult to get right and are often made really huge by commercial moulding. I have heard of folk in the larger sales using tape to replicate the bands but which tape?  They are subtle and in 4mm I think I would let the transfer strip do the job as has been suggested here.

 

Thanks for the info about Sandtofts  museum. It is a bit of a way from me but I will try and make the effort to get there. One of the problems i have as I get older is the motivation to go off and "do" things on ones own. In happier times I had a friend and we went to all sorts of railway type places together but sadly he passed on unexpectedly and now there is no one. So folk please value your friends and mates whilst you can. One such planned foray was to York this Easter but I now doubt that will happen.

 

Martin Long

Happy to meet up with you at Donny or Retford and do a Sandtoft visit Martin.

Phil

[Black Marlin]

Hello again Tony - greetings from the wilderness!

Apologies for the very, very long silence - I have been exceedingly busy, but the upshot of it is that I now have a barn big enough for me to comfortably contain a 40' x 20' layout.... Oh, the plans I have...!

I was sorry to hear of Mo's unwellness, and thoroughly heartened to hear that she's doing much better. Will I see you again at Glasgow this year? If so, I may have a couple of engines (DC analogue, naturally!) requiring your tender ministrations, if you're amenable?

 

Best wishes,
Gavin (of Aberdeen MRC)

[Barry Ten]

Two of the locomotive projects that have been on and off my workbench in recent days:

 

The Gem Cambrian 2-4-0T I built in 2016 has gained nameplates and lettering (HMRS), one advantage of which over waterslide decals

was that I was able to squeeze up the letters a bit to fit the available space. It's all very impressionistic as I've yet to see

a photo of one of these engines with full Great Western lettering, but I don't like the shirt-button livery, so this it had to be.

 

 

The SE Finecast Prairie I started in December has now progressed to having its chassis painted, which I always do

the awkward way by painting through the spokes. I must admit once I've got a loco running satisfactorily, I'm loathe

to dismantle it - and always in too much of a hurry to stop to paint the chassis before assembly.

 

 

The roof is currently a loose fit, and I don't want to attach it permanently until I've glazed the spectacle plate, which

will need to be done after painting. Even then I might want to access the cab, so after dropping the roof on the floor

about twenty times each time I picked up the loco and forgot that it was loose, I added these simple brass clips to

grip the inside of the cab. They're just bits of springy brass, and do the job surprisingly well.

 

 

cheers,

 

Al

 

 

[Tony Wright]

Last weekend the family went via Grand Central to the NE and back.  On our return in daylight, I watched the scenery go by South of Grantham, looking out for landmarks like the Mallard sign and Little Bytham.

 

It's not the first time I've travelled along the ECML (probably about the 50th) but was wonderful to pass LB, recognising it immediately from the photos published on this thread, not so much those of the real thing but those of the model.  I can't think of another occasion when I have spotted familiar features of a location from previously seeing a model of it, rather than the other way around.

 

Well done Tony (and all the LB team) for giving me a whole new experience!

 

Rob

Thanks Rob,

 

Anyone fizzing through Little Bytham these days on the ECML will need sharp eyes to pick out anything which is recognisable from years ago. Coming south, once you've come over the viaduct straddling the village, the abutments of the MR/M&GNR formation are still to be seen (though reduced in height) but, since the goods shed was demolished a decade ago and new houses built on the site, any glimpses of the still-standing booking hall and the Willoughby will be very fleeting. Behind trees now, the stationmaster's house can just be seen, but then that's it. Anything like rock outcrops or the site of the limestone loading dock on the Down side are now totally obliterated behind mature trees, some close enough to be near-brushing the sides of trains on the respective slows. 

 

No matter, it can still be replicated as it was on the model, as, I hope, the following pictures illustrate...............

 

 

Marsh Bridge, at the south end was a typical GNR three-arch overbridge, demolished with electrification in the mid-'80s. In this shot from '60 years' ago, Class A2/3 60500 EDWARD THOMPSON (Crownline/Wright/Rathbone) heads a Down express. Today, a concrete raft-type bridge gives access to Marsh Farm, and it might just be possible to get a similar view from the stationmaster's garden, rampant Mother Nature permitting. 

 

 

Looking north from Marsh Bridge, one needs to be very tall today to see over the parapet. Not so in 1958, when the station was fully-operational, for the parapet was very low (and civilised). Another Class A2/3, 60516 HYCILLA (DJH/Wright/Rathbone) heads an Up Newcastle service passing a 9F (Kitmaster/Crownline/Dave Alexander/Wright/Wright Junior) on an Up minerals. Though a shot in the same direction could be taken today, catenary would cause visual obstructions and there are just four tracks. Trees permitting, the stationmaster's house and the Willoughby might well appear, but any limestone outcrops are covered in greenery. 

 

 

I suppose it's conceivable that two of the preserved A4s might still pass at Little Bytham, but not these. 60014 SILVER LINK (Wills/Scratch/Wright/Rathbone) heads a Newcastle-bound express, passing 60026 MILES BEEVOR (SE Finecast/Wright/Rathbone) in charge of an Up fast goods. Bachmann's splendid Thompsons (modified) form the first two cars in the express and the goods is a mixture of kits/modified proprietary, hardly any of which is my work. 

 

 

Though it's possible to scramble up to the top of the MR/M&GNR formation to get a similar position to take a shot such as this today, unrestricted tree growth over the last four decades has rendered a picture impossible (unless one wants a picture of tree trunks). Though that retaining wall still stands, it's been invisible for years beneath creepers; so much so that it's not been inspected for the last 20 years (probably more!). The loco is a real museum piece of mine. It's an O4/8, made from a K's set of frames, footplate and tender from their O4, on to which I scratch-built a boiler and cab. To be kind to it, it is of its day (43 years ago!). I feel quite 'proud' of its train, since it contains about six wagons I've made (a rare occurrence).

 

  

 

I moved a little bit further west to get another shot, this time including the 9F described earlier. 

 

 

Another O4, this one a Little Engines O4/1, sitting in the Up headshunt on an engineers' train. The third wagon is that ancient K's white metal one I built on Friday, now finished as a stores van. I have no idea whether the numbers I applied are correct (beautifully made by Cambridge Custom Transfers), but weathering probably disguises any wrong applications. Time was when this headshunt was the nearest track to the edge of the embankment on the east side, though there are only four tracks now. Anyway, even if it were still there, mature trees behind housing built over the decades would make such a shot impossible from this position today. 

 

It occurred to me that it might have been an idea to attempt take some pictures today from similar positions to the model ones above. I didn't (for the reasons already cited) and also because it was wet, and I just find the current subject matter too boring! 

[APOLLO]

Rampant vegetation growth on and around our railways nationwide is an ever increasing nuisance to both rail operators and photographers / observers. To me it has become ever worse and seemingly unmanaged over the last 20 years or so.

 

I often wonder the causes - economic cutbacks, global warming = more CO2 = more rampant growth - reduced effectiveness of weedkiller due to legislation, etc. I don't really know but here alongside the WCML just north of Wigan it certainly is a noticeable problem. We received letters from Network Rail the other year regards tree pruning, and they held a meeting in a local church hall explaining what - where - why. The work was done - just the big trees etc getting close to the overhead wires etc, but the growth will be back, and with a vengence if my back garden is used as a guide !!

 

Nice to see your "virtually" tree-less Little Bytham Tony, just like it used to be.

 

Brit15

[Denbridge]

Rampant vegetation growth on and around our railways nationwide is an ever increasing nuisance to both rail operators and photographers / observers. To me it has become ever worse and seemingly unmanaged over the last 20 years or so.

 

I often wonder the causes - economic cutbacks, global warming = more CO2 = more rampant growth - reduced effectiveness of weedkiller due to legislation, etc. I don't really know but here alongside the WCML just north of Wigan it certainly is a noticeable problem. We received letters from Network Rail the other year regards tree pruning, and they held a meeting in a local church hall explaining what - where - why. The work was done - just the big trees etc getting close to the overhead wires etc, but the growth will be back, and with a vengence if my back garden is used as a guide !!

 

Nice to see your "virtually" tree-less Little Bytham Tony, just like it used to be.

 

Brit15

You have in part answered the question of undergrowth. Since the demise of steam, there is virtually nil fire risk. In fact the undergrowth is now often seen as a view and noise blocker. Residents who do not want to see or hear trains now have to be consulted before NR are allowed to do any pruning or felling.

[davefrk]

Hi Tony, hope you and Mo are both well.

Interesting that boiler bands have been mentioned, I was talking to someone just the other day about using just the transfer lining for boiler bands, the only problem I found was to very carefully remove the moulded boiler bands first, some people can't even hold a knife straight.....

 

DJH Crab with the cast on bands removed and lining transfers of the type one has to cut out so you get a sharp edge.

 

Boiler bands are very thin, 3 or 4mm thick on the real thing but some cast bands and even RTR bands can be nearly 25 mm.

I did a batch of Millholme Mucky Ducks a few years ago and the boiler bands were a pig to remove.

 

All the best,

 

Dave Franks.

[Denbridge]

Hi Tony, hope you and Mo are both well.

Interesting that boiler bands have been mentioned, I was talking to someone just the other day about using just the transfer lining for boiler bands, the only problem I found was to very carefully remove the moulded boiler bands first, some people can't even hold a knife straight.....

 

LMS Crab.jpg

DJH Crab with the cast on bands removed and lining transfers of the type one has to cut out so you get a sharp edge.

 

Boiler bands are very thin, 3 or 4mm thick on the real thing but some cast bands and even RTR bands can be nearly 25 mm.

I did a batch of Millholme Mucky Ducks a few years ago and the boiler bands were a pig to remove.

 

All the best,

 

Dave Franks.

For lined bands I just use lined transfers. For unlined, I have some sheets of 5 thou Nickel Silver. Bit of a pig to get soldered on straight, but the good old resistance soldering tool comes into its own with solder paint. Trick is to spot solder 1st.

[Clive Mortimore]

Thanks Rob,

 

Anyone fizzing through Little Bytham these days on the ECML will need sharp eyes to pick out anything which is recognisable from years ago. Coming south, once you've come over the viaduct straddling the village, the abutments of the MR/M&GNR formation are still to be seen (though reduced in height) but, since the goods shed was demolished a decade ago and new houses built on the site, any glimpses of the still-standing booking hall and the Willoughby will be very fleeting. Behind trees now, the stationmaster's house can just be seen, but then that's it. Anything like rock outcrops or the site of the limestone loading dock on the Down side are now totally obliterated behind mature trees, some close enough to be near-brushing the sides of trains on the respective slows. 

 

No matter, it can still be replicated as it was on the model, as, I hope, the following pictures illustrate...............

 

A2 3 60500.jpg

 

Marsh Bridge, at the south end was a typical GNR three-arch overbridge, demolished with electrification in the mid-'80s. In this shot from '60 years' ago, Class A2/3 60500 EDWARD THOMPSON (Crownline/Wright/Rathbone) heads a Down express. Today, a concrete raft-type bridge gives access to Marsh Farm, and it might just be possible to get a similar view from the stationmaster's garden, rampant Mother Nature permitting. 

 

A2 3 & 9F.jpg

 

Looking north from Marsh Bridge, one needs to be very tall today to see over the parapet. Not so in 1958, when the station was fully-operational, for the parapet was very low (and civilised). Another Class A2/3, 60516 HYCILLA (DJH/Wright/Rathbone) heads an Up Newcastle service passing a 9F (Kitmaster/Crownline/Dave Alexander/Wright/Wright Junior) on an Up minerals. Though a shot in the same direction could be taken today, catenary would cause visual obstructions and there are just four tracks. Trees permitting, the stationmaster's house and the Willoughby might well appear, but any limestone outcrops are covered in greenery. 

 

A4s 60014 & 60026.jpg

 

I suppose it's conceivable that two of the preserved A4s might still pass at Little Bytham, but not these. 60014 SILVER LINK (Wills/Scratch/Wright/Rathbone) heads a Newcastle-bound express, passing 60026 MILES BEEVOR (SE Finecast/Wright/Rathbone) in charge of an Up fast goods. Bachmann's splendid Thompsons (modified) form the first two cars in the express and the goods is a mixture of kits/modified proprietary, hardly any of which is my work. 

 

O4 8.jpg

 

Though it's possible to scramble up to the top of the MR/M&GNR formation to get a similar position to take a shot such as this today, unrestricted tree growth over the last four decades has rendered a picture impossible (unless one wants a picture of tree trunks). Though that retaining wall still stands, it's been invisible for years beneath creepers; so much so that it's not been inspected for the last 20 years (probably more!). The loco is a real museum piece of mine. It's an O4/8, made from a K's set of frames, footplate and tender from their O4, on to which I scratch-built a boiler and cab. To be kind to it, it is of its day (43 years ago!). I feel quite 'proud' of its train, since it contains about six wagons I've made (a rare occurrence).

 

  O4 8 & 9F.jpg

 

I moved a little bit further west to get another shot, this time including the 9F described earlier. 

 

O4 on engineers' train.jpg

 

Another O4, this one a Little Engines O4/1, sitting in the Up headshunt on an engineers' train. The third wagon is that ancient K's white metal one I built on Friday, now finished as a stores van. I have no idea whether the numbers I applied are correct (beautifully made by Cambridge Custom Transfers), but weathering probably disguises any wrong applications. Time was when this headshunt was the nearest track to the edge of the embankment on the east side, though there are only four tracks now. Anyway, even if it were still there, mature trees behind housing built over the decades would make such a shot impossible from this position today. 

 

It occurred to me that it might have been an idea to attempt take some pictures today from similar positions to the model ones above. I didn't (for the reasons already cited) and also because it was wet, and I just find the current subject matter too boring! 

Hello Tony

 

Just down the road to you there is a lovely Overhead Line Equipment feed station. Next time I visit you, and if we pop along to the Willoughby I will take my camera and photograph it. To be followed up by a drawing. I have drawn a twin track feed station.

 

[Tony Teague]

I know it's a bit OT but there are several surviving London Trolleybuses in running order at the Sandtoft trolleybus museum. They have a gala in late July and if you got you will certainly have the chance to ride on one. The most recent to be restored as far as I know is a 6 wheeler that I think was repatriated from Ireland. The gala is always a great day out. I think they run a bus service from Doncaster.

 

Jamie

Here is said 6-wheeler on a running day:

 

Lots of other stuff there, both from LT and other operators.

 

Tony

[Chamby]

Here is said 6-wheeler on a running day:

 

SJPAB9A093502170520.jpg

 

Lots of other stuff there, both from LT and other operators.

 

Tony

. Oh this brings back memories of the green ones they ran in Nottingham when I was a nipper, that I used to ride into the city centre with my Grandma. I remember being really disappointed if the trolley bus arrived with only two axles and not three!

[westerner]

I seem to remember seeing dark maroon ones in Cardiff in the 1950s.

[Re6/6]

Went to school every day on one of those. 611 up to Pond Square in Highgate Village!

 

[Tony Teague]

. Oh this brings back memories of the green ones they ran in Nottingham when I was a nipper, that I used to ride into the city centre with my Grandma. I remember being really disappointed if the trolley bus arrived with only two axles and not three!

 

 

I seem to remember seeing dark maroon ones in Cardiff in the 1950s.

Wot?

Like these two??

 

 

 

(Both at Sandtoft)

 

[Apologies to Tony for turning this into a Trolleybus thread!]

 

Tony

Edited February 20, 2018 by Tony Teague

[Tony Wright]

Wot?

Like these two??

 

SJPAB9A082202170520.jpg

 

SJPAB9A062702170520.jpg

 

(Both at Sandtoft)

 

[Apologies to Tony for turning this into a Trolleybus thread!]

 

Tony

Tony,

 

Nobody need apologise for turning this thread to anything they like (other than puerile insults or dictatorial statements). It's part of what makes this thread so active and interesting.

 

I think trolleybuses are wonderful creations, though I cannot remember any from my youth to any great extent. Chester never had any (and its trams disappeared pre-War), and Sheffield had trams when I was a kid. Did Rotherham ever have any? Liverpool had trams. I seem to recall trolleybuses at Doncaster; am I right? The ones at Wolverhampton had long gone before I made it my home, though roadside stanchions remained for many years (some might still). 

[jamie92208]

I've always had a fascination with trolleybuses as the last UK system in Bradford was near to where I grew up. I even organised a school transport society trip for a tour of the system in IIRC 1970. Apart from such highlights as being able to pull the handle to change the points in the town centre so that we could change routes, the weirdest part was going through the bus washer in the depot. Standing in the upper saloon with the trolley base just above our head with 600v going through it while being sprayed with water was strange, even though we knew about faraday cages. It was a sad day when the system closed in 1972.

 

Jamie

[Tony Wright]

Hi Tony, hope you and Mo are both well.

Interesting that boiler bands have been mentioned, I was talking to someone just the other day about using just the transfer lining for boiler bands, the only problem I found was to very carefully remove the moulded boiler bands first, some people can't even hold a knife straight.....

 

LMS Crab.jpg

DJH Crab with the cast on bands removed and lining transfers of the type one has to cut out so you get a sharp edge.

 

Boiler bands are very thin, 3 or 4mm thick on the real thing but some cast bands and even RTR bands can be nearly 25 mm.

I did a batch of Millholme Mucky Ducks a few years ago and the boiler bands were a pig to remove.

 

All the best,

 

Dave Franks.

We're very well, thanks Dave.

 

That Crab of yours is a beautifully-natural model, one of the finest I've seen of the class (in any scale/gauge). May I make one observation, please? I've never seen a real Crab with cabside numbers that small. There are two shots of 42790 in Irwell's recent 'Book of the Crabs' (on page 245) and both show the normal (8"?) type. I know some Scottish-based Crabs had even larger numbers in BR days (applied by St. Rollox?), but none shows anything quite so small. My observation is based on the amount of space between the vertical lining and the first and last digits. 

 

Regards,

 

Tony. 

[davefrk]

Hi Tony, yes you are right about the small numbers and a few people have commented over the years. The Crab was built nearly thirty years ago and those were the only numbers left on the HMRS sheet, time was of the essence as the Glasgow show competition was only weeks away. I promise that when Wharfeside is ready for a show I will renumber the loco when weathering it. I've already re-done a couple of other locos which were originally done with these transfers and IIRC the Crab is the last one.

 

You've probably shamed me into it now so I'll be posting a new picture soon.

 

All the best,

Dave F.

[Re6/6]

l've often wondered why trolleybus systems haven't been considered (with the exception of the on/off proposed Leeds one IIRC) when tramway systems are ruled out through expense.

[Mallard60022]

l've often wondered why trolleybus systems haven't been considered (with the exception of the on/off proposed Leeds one IIRC) when tramway systems are ruled out through expense.

Some European Countries have retained both their Tram and Trolly systems. Maybe they were more farsighted or perhaps the populations were more tolerant of 'things' that got in the way of cars?

My only view of Trolly Buses was outside Newcastle Central in the early 60s. Lovely machines.

Phil

Edited February 20, 2018 by Mallard60022

[unclebobkt]

       ... .

  I'd go with MONS MEG, the one female in the class (after all locos are always - like warships - described as 'she'). 

 

 

 

         But aren't warships also called 'Men o'war.'?

 

         

[jacko]

         But aren't warships also called 'Men o'war.'?

 

         

Nah!. You're thinking of jellyfish.   

[Mallard60022]

 

 

I'd go with MONS MEG, the one female in the class (after all locos are always - like warships - described as 'she'). 

 

 

Someone I was talking with recently told me that we are one of the few Countries in which many people refer to machines as she. I'd be interested in finding out why. Also, why is it that (say) a large, mechanical clock isn't a 'she'. There must be some historic foundation for this genderisation of things like steam loco's? 

Thank you 

Phil

[glo41f]

Thank you for the trolley bus pictures. Interestingly a number of Ipswich ones went north when the system was taken down and they served a few more years with Walsall and Bradford. Environmentally clean and quietly efficient. 

 

I have spent some time in the last week when it has been wet outside, looking at a number of model magazines of recent date. I come from an era when we avidly looked forward to the publication of the Railway Modeller each month and savoured the Railway of the Month. The often grainy black and white pictures showed model layouts which were unattainable to us whose idea of scale was the awful Wrenn track system. Upon reading this current crop, I find that I would not have the same enthusiasm despite the fact that the productions are full colour and streets ahead of what we were offered back in the day. There is an overweening sameness to them partially as they all have "reviews" of  the latest trade offerings or proposals which, if you read them, are often not reviews at all but rather publicity "puffs". As to the layouts there are indeed some who still have the power to thrill and inspire but many fail so to do. Whatever happened to the drawings and the technical articles which used to be a staple in days gone by?

 

On the technical front, try as I do to comprehend the digital world, I am flummoxed by it and the many systems and gizmos that seem to be needed to get it all to work. It seems we now need power districts and stay alive bits and bobs (stay alive would be a useful health product I feel!). Some of the costs involved are quite eye watering too and probably out of reach for many on low or fixed incomes.

 

One development that seems to have "legs" is radio control battery power. Has anyone here any practical experience of this that they would be prepared to share with us?

 

(I like the Crab but they look so ungainly!)

 

Martin Long

[Tony Wright]

         But aren't warships also called 'Men o'war.'?

 

         

Of course, but all ships (not just warships) have always been feminine in description (even if they were named after men). 

 

I can't recall where I read it, but, after witnessing the launch of the Bismark, Hitler insisted that his capital ships be described as being male gender (previous German ships had also been shes). His reasoning was that they were far too powerful to be described as females. Not that it did the German battleship much good. It was sunk (principally) by two British Battleships, both named after men, though both King George V and Rodney have always been described as 'she'. 

 

I think it's one of those quirks and eccentricities of English. However, in the cases of the likes of locos such as HYCILLA and MELD, the feminine gender was entirely correct, since they were both fillies. 

Edited February 20, 2018 by Tony Wright