Norm81 Posted December 8, 2012 Share Posted December 8, 2012 A lot of people expressed their displeasure on their ballot paper: http://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/2012/11/16/police-and-crime-commissioner-spoilt-ballot-pictures_n_2144173.html We need more front line police, not more people sat behind desks shouting orders. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold TheSignalEngineer Posted December 8, 2012 RMweb Gold Share Posted December 8, 2012 .............seems all too clear to me that it suits someone (or rather lots of someones) in high places to keep a countable percentage of the population zonked out on whatever it happens to be. ............... I thought that was the purpose of daytime television Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Max Stafford Posted December 8, 2012 Share Posted December 8, 2012 If Group 4 could'nt get their act together for one event in London what chance for the rest of the country ??? Guess who don't care as long as they get their divi? Dave. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Sidecar Racer Posted December 8, 2012 RMweb Premium Share Posted December 8, 2012 Mike next time run for our local commissioner, at least you have a bit of passion for the service. Regards, Nick. Just very sad to see the way the service has changed over the years , even as a civvie you could see the way the 'boys and girls' on the front line were getting a bit sick at the the way things were going . Max is not the only one waiting for the day , there are hundreds of them all fed up with the treatment they are getting . Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium skipepsi Posted December 9, 2012 RMweb Premium Share Posted December 9, 2012 A lot of people expressed their displeasure on their ballot paper: http://www.huffingto..._n_2144173.html We need more front line police, not more people sat behind desks shouting orders. lots more.... lots fewer........ Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Max Stafford Posted December 9, 2012 Share Posted December 9, 2012 One hundred years after the phrase was first coined; "Lions led by donkeys" is more relevant than ever. Sadly, many of the lions themselves have become donkeys. Dave. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Max Stafford Posted December 9, 2012 Share Posted December 9, 2012 Group 4 here we come. If I'm not mistaken, even the ACPO is a private company. You're bob-on with this BD. Most people think ACPO is some kind of government body or at worst quango. In fact it is a private 'consultancy' composed of senior police officers providing guidance and expertise. To themselves. Dave. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baby Deltic Posted December 9, 2012 Share Posted December 9, 2012 You're bob-on with this BD. Most people think ACPO is some kind of government body or at worst quango. In fact it is a private 'consultancy' composed of senior police officers providing guidance and expertise. To themselves. Dave. Association of Chief Police Officers. Company Number: 3344583. Registered in England and Wales. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Welly Posted December 9, 2012 RMweb Premium Share Posted December 9, 2012 On an opposite note for a change, Alan Hardwick the Lincolnshire PCC has identified savings in his own office of £500,000 and is putting that back into the police pot. I don't know how many deputies he has not many I suspect. Lincoln police station custody suite was going to be closed and moved to a new build G4S run custody facility 3 or 4 miles out of the town centre. This man cancelled that too! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kenton Posted December 9, 2012 Share Posted December 9, 2012 As for PCCs I must admit I can't see the point - why not just make the old system have electable members? That would make them more like your local council, and look at what we get with that. Besides they would just keep passing the buck, take no individual responsibility, and have the same issues/arguments and cronyism. At least the PCC you can, in theory - if you can be bothered, vote them out next time, holding the individual responsible. I think I would have preferred electable CC and to do away with the PCC idea. At least that way you get a time-served person with policing experience and still have democratic influence over policing policy within an area, rather than the strange political oddities we have now. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Dagworth Posted December 10, 2012 RMweb Gold Share Posted December 10, 2012 That would make them more like your local council, and look at what we get with that. Besides they would just keep passing the buck, take no individual responsibility, and have the same issues/arguments and cronyism. At least the PCC you can, in theory - if you can be bothered, vote them out next time, holding the individual responsible. I think I would have preferred electable CC and to do away with the PCC idea. At least that way you get a time-served person with policing experience and still have democratic influence over policing policy within an area, rather than the strange political oddities we have now. Some areas have got ex coppers as PCCs. I'm glad to say we have one here, policing is far too important to have politicians allowed anywhere near it. Andi Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold ian Posted December 10, 2012 RMweb Gold Share Posted December 10, 2012 Some areas have got ex coppers as PCCs. I'm glad to say we have one here, policing is far too important to have politicians allowed anywhere near it. Andi Yes, we had a choice of a Labour candidate, Conservative candidate or an independent ex-copper. The ex-copper got the job and imediately announced that he was giving a large part of his salary to set up a charity. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robert Posted December 10, 2012 Share Posted December 10, 2012 Without wanting to go to far into the forbidden topic of politics - but, in my opinion, what the problem basically boils down to is the incessant obsession with Statistics which pervades everywhere like a creeping fungus. The politicians should stay out of this sort of thing and leave the trained experts to do the job. Obviously some administrative staff will always be needed - but the whole structure has got top heavy in so many areas, not just the police. Go to your local NHS hospital, wait in a corridor for ten minutes and count how many medical staff you see compared to how many people wandering around with clipboards and you'll get an idea of what I am getting at. As a citizen (who admittedly doesn't live in the UK) what I want to be able to do is to feel safe walking the streets, and to know that the Police are able to go some way to keeping the streets safe without being stretched to the limit. I don't care about statistics! I started reading Inspector Gadgets Blog when Black Rat mentioned it a while ago. If half of what is posted on there is true (and I suspect it is - even if there is some poetic license) then it is extrememly worrying for the future. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Max Stafford Posted December 10, 2012 Share Posted December 10, 2012 Stay where you are Robert. Don't even think of coming back to this dump. Not in its present form anyway! Dave. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
34theletterbetweenB&D Posted December 10, 2012 Share Posted December 10, 2012 No one has touched on the fundamental problem, which is the clear contradiction in terms within the job title. Police commissioner is conceptually ok, (whatever the flaws may be in the actual execution of the office) crime commissioner, that can safely be left to private enterprise rather than funded at the taxpayer's expense. ... policing is far too important to have politicians allowed anywhere near it. That thought works equally well with 'democracy' substituted for 'policing'. And elected politicians create the very law that the policing enforces, however imperfectly; so like it or not, politicians are from time out of mind already embedded in policing. I am much exercised by the thought that 'the whole thing' that is our present elected representative democracy, may be on its last legs and these kind of moves for elected police commissioners are symptomatic of that. Clearly we are vastly more information and communication rich than we were even in the quite recent past, yet we still only get a very crude sampling of public opinion on the way our affairs would best be managed on a roughly four year time base. Trying to extend election to offices designed to directly manage any given sector of public affairs remains a clumsy approximation to sampling what the public requires. Is there now potentially a better way of directly sampling what 'we' want done, in response to any given circumstance? For sure those in elected office and the inevitable adjuncts to that system will resist such change like fury (independent of party), because the advantages that accrue from these offices are great. But as alternatives become apparent, it could be that 'elected representative' government will join 'absolute monarchy' in the dustbin of history. (The British of course will retain the outward form of constitutional elected representative democracy with the hereditary MPs chuntering on at Westminster, but the power will reside with the e-lect, or whatever.) Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Max Stafford Posted December 10, 2012 Share Posted December 10, 2012 It's interesting to note that 78% of our 'elected representatives' have millionaire status. I'm not sure how they can possibly identify with a man in Solihull working a 50 hour week to try and feed his family whilst keeping a roof over their head. Or a pensioner having to toss up between heating their home or feeding themselves. This circus is surely coming to and end. How it ends I don't know, but I pray that it's peaceful. Dave. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Horsetan Posted December 10, 2012 Share Posted December 10, 2012 ....This circus is surely coming to and end. How it ends I don't know, but I pray that it's peaceful. I was contemplating the possibility of an Egyptian pyramid scheme coming in - heads they win; tails you lose. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
the penguin of doom Posted December 10, 2012 Share Posted December 10, 2012 I find it very ironic that on the day many officers found they would be loosing substantial amounts of money per year, our local comissioner appointed his running buddy as a deputy at a substantial annual wage! At the moment I have 15 years left to do. Lord knows what length of service I'll have one the politicians have finished meddling, but I'd quite happily leave tomorrow if I could afford to. I'm afraid it's just a job to me nowadays..... Cheers. Sean. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium skipepsi Posted December 10, 2012 RMweb Premium Share Posted December 10, 2012 I was contemplating the possibility of an Egyptian pyramid scheme coming in - heads they win; tails you lose. We already have this system its called a win win system its their system. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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