Crompton-hauled Redhill-Reading services

[Reading General]

Incidentally..in my experience the "tadpole head" was never used for anything else and the seats were at least partially stripped out. Maybe they were used at the eastern end of the line but I never saw them in use in Reading

[Oldddudders]

Incidentally..in my experience the "tadpole head" was never used for anything else and the seats were at least partially stripped out. Maybe they were used at the eastern end of the line but I never saw them in use in Reading

This was one of the first services in SE England - I think - to make us of a conductor-guard. So the driving trailer, having no gangway connection to the thin end of the train was not wanted by these chaps, who I think got a bonus in sales from their Almex machine. It meant there was effectively only a coach and a half of passenger accommodation.

[Reading General]

Presumably care was needed at Reading to ensure that a unit running trailer-first didn't enter Plat4A on top of a 8 car Waterloo service.

[KeithHC]

I traveled a couple of times in the EPB coach of a Tadpole from North Camp to Redhill. I was a junior surveyor at the time and  a couple of us where dropped off at North camp after work nearby. As there was three of us maybe the guard saw us regularly and knew we where getting off at Redhill so quick check of tickets and we where left alone. I seam to remember that there where two compartments with seats and the others cleared out for mail use.   

 

Keith HC Dursley

[Nearholmer]

Reviving this topic, but going to the Tonbridge end of the route .......

 

I seem to recall that the loco hauled train that arrived early evening, having left Reading at "tea time", would terminate in the Down Bay, meaning that it had to cross the whole layout at the northern end of the station. Also, I recall that the Up postal, which arrived shortly after, used the Down main platform. Presumably all to do with mail bags again, because "hundreds" of Mail vans converged in the road on the Down side of the station.

 

Can someone reassure me that this is not all false memory syndrome?

 

Kevin

[Gwiwer]

That memory sounds about right.  Mails could not be handled on the up side at Tonbridge without some inconvenience so the relevant trains used the down side.  Anything arriving from Redhill in the early evening potentially carried mailbags from the transfer terminal there.  Post electrification there was a similar MLV working for that purpose.

 

Where ever you were you didn't want to have to transfer laden mailbags any further than was necessary!

[Oldddudders]

Reviving this topic, but going to the Tonbridge end of the route .......

I seem to recall that the loco hauled train that arrived early evening, having left Reading at "tea time", would terminate in the Down Bay, meaning that it had to cross the whole layout at the northern end of the station. Also, I recall that the Up postal, which arrived shortly after, used the Down main platform. Presumably all to do with mail bags again, because "hundreds" of Mail vans converged in the road on the Down side of the station.

Can someone reassure me that this is not all false memory syndrome?

Kevin

The up postal was, I think, the 18.40 Dover Priory to London Bridge, headcode JO. It ran via Redhill, and the Tonbridge layout certainly permitted such moves then. It was only when Eurostar was imminent that the remodeling finally fructified. That was the end of the long crossover at the London end.

[Nearholmer]

Sounds right.

 

Sometimes the Up Dover postal would arrive hauled by an electric loco, which had to come off and be replaced with a Crompton. The train included a TPO, complete with postbox in the side.

 

I also recall an evening postal on the Hastings line, again I think an Up service. It only ran to a few vans, and was sometimes hauled by an ED. I'm not sure whether it was a regular service, or an "engineering works" diversion of a train that normally ran by another route.

 

Slightly back towards topic: I used the 3R trains very frequently, and the EPB coaches were only ever "opened to the public" on 'special occasions', extreme overcrowding. Most of the time the seat cushions were turned up, and the coach was full of mail bags, or empty. Trick was to bag the declassified first class compartment,of course.

 

Another mildly interesting diagram was a Hastings set, stabled at Tonbridge, which ran three short trips each day. Eridge and back early in the morning; ECS to Edenbridge; back to Tonbridge with scholars; stable through the day; late afternoon to Edenbridge to return the scholars; ECS to Tonbridge. I don't even think it went to London in the evening peak, so was the most under-utilised set on the region.

 

Kevin

[brushman47544]

Very poor pic of this, my own.

 

Is that a hearse with a coffin in it on the motorail in platform 8 ?!?

[Nearholmer]

Thought it was a Hillman Husky.

 

The question is, given a free choice, would you rather be transported in: (a) a Hillman Husky, or (b) .......

 

(Younger readers may not understand this question fully.)

 

K

[brushman47544]

Thought it was a Hillman Husky.

 

The question is, given a free choice, would you rather be transported in: (a) a Hillman Husky, or ( B) .......

 

(Younger readers may not understand this question fully.)

 

K

 

Could be both - Hillman Husky 2 Hearse http://www.sparesgateway.co.uk/CarsTrim/hillman/husky-2/hearse

[brushman47544]

Just been looking at Robert Carroll's flickr site and come across this photo taken at Guildford:

https://www.flickr.com/photos/robertcwp/9026031610/
 

I wonder if this is a Reading - Redhill working? BSK S35024 is not a surprise, but next to it looks like an FK with its yellow stripe and no centre door. I can understand the need for lots of 1st class in the peaks, but I thought the services were 2nd class only once steam finished.

[Nearholmer]

Hmmm....... No tail lamp, and the brake for the R-R service was normally marshalled in the middle of the rake three, not at the end, by this date.

 

I think some form of shunt is going on here, but of what, or why, I wouldn't like to guess.

 

Kevin

[phil-b259]

Presumably care was needed at Reading to ensure that a unit running trailer-first didn't enter Plat4A on top of a 8 car Waterloo service.

 

IIRC that (and other variations on the same theme) was one of the prime causes of delays* which forced BR to accept that replacing the 4 platformed station with a single bay wasn't working. As a result platform 4B got added in the late 70s - if you have a look at photos of the canopy its obvious that one 'half' of it was an add on to the original structure provide for 4A

 

* Delays too North Downs services were probably tolerated given the low key nature of the route in those days, but the same wasn't true of Waterloo services which needed to be on time as they approached London to make their 'slot' into Waterloo

[Reading General]

Just been looking at Robert Carroll's flickr site and come across this photo taken at Guildford:

 

https://www.flickr.com/photos/robertcwp/9026031610/

 

I wonder if this is a Reading - Redhill working? BSK S35024 is not a surprise, but next to it looks like an FK with its yellow stripe and no centre door. I can understand the need for lots of 1st class in the peaks, but I thought the services were 2nd class only once steam finished.

it's W35024 so it won't be a R-R working. No idea what it is though.

[Gwiwer]

W35024 trails an FK on what I take to be a cross-country working of some sort.  A few of those were routed via Guildford as were some summer Saturday only workings.  Flickr says it's taken in June 2013 which obviously isn't the case and is probably the upload date.  I can't recall such an event but it's possible the Waterloo - Exeter service (which used WR mk1 stock) might have been diverted this way for some reason to reach Salisbury via Havant and Romsey.  The absence of a tail-lamp however suggests it is a shunt move in the station and not a through working.

 

Mk1 stock got moved around so a WR coach on an SR internal working isn't beyond the realm of possibility but the FK is unusual indeed if it were a Reading - Redhill working.  Though again all things are possible and it could have happened.

[brushman47544]

I've posted this photo of a Tadpole at Redhill because you can just see a Crompton in the siding behind it. This will be the loco and stock for the 16.40 service to Redhill

https://www.flickr.com/photos/72856291@N05/6950467468/in/photolist-bAbXQ1-poxoqf-bKZyXp-dkSv7A-5Sb4Ux-jB9eMH-5VkVdb-aELuLL-btsbLA-ndAvES-bZPoif-g3BUZQ-73tg1n-7pYvPY-vmX46H-8NboSE-9JdVCv-dpKfra-6mdm3x-cihozh-9LTmZJ-5T23qK-mqEGA4-o6YWLz-5VDquL-bH9UXk-7ui2Fv-bGVEuT-auhkzS-ootBNB-ddtspu-5FW2XV-5jnAFQ-aBcgk3-9ynr82-dpKhmc-cZ2GoL-9vdGcV-7ZyU1o-kyWT4M-btHDt8-7ZyZqW-aERCiX-6atrxH-4YB6uX-8XYJfv-roBtZ7-dpKqs5-bMnm2v-95obep

[Nearholmer]

What an excellent photo!

 

Pure Southern Region nostalgia.

 

K

[Reading General]

W35024 trails an FK on what I take to be a cross-country working of some sort.  A few of those were routed via Guildford as were some summer Saturday only workings.  Flickr says it's taken in June 2013 which obviously isn't the case and is probably the upload date.  I can't recall such an event but it's possible the Waterloo - Exeter service (which used WR mk1 stock) might have been diverted this way for some reason to reach Salisbury via Havant and Romsey.  The absence of a tail-lamp however suggests it is a shunt move in the station and not a through working.

 

Mk1 stock got moved around so a WR coach on an SR internal working isn't beyond the realm of possibility but the FK is unusual indeed if it were a Reading - Redhill working.  Though again all things are possible and it could have happened.

SR mk1s used on the R-R route were allocated into sets so it's very unlikely that a WR coach would be in use. I never saw these sets augmented with anything other than a PMV

[talisman56]

Slightly back towards topic: I used the 3R trains very frequently, and the EPB coaches were only ever "opened to the public" on 'special occasions', extreme overcrowding. Most of the time the seat cushions were turned up, and the coach was full of mail bags, or empty. Trick was to bag the declassified first class compartment,of course.

 

 

 

As they were EPB coaches there wasn't a 'declassified first class compartment' as EPBs are second class only...

 

The only 'EPB' units with a prior first class element were the DTSs in the ex-Tyneside units (5781-95), and none of those were ever in a 3R.

[Nearholmer]

Perhaps I wasn't being clear: the compartments were in the middle, thin, coach, not the EPB bit, which, IIRC, was a DTSO.

 

K

[brushman47544]

Perhaps I wasn't being clear: the compartments were in the middle, thin, coach, not the EPB bit, which, IIRC, was a DTSO.

K

Don't think so. As a regular user of the Tadpoles in my teens I don't remember any side corridor compartments. Weren't the centre coaches TSOs?

[jonny777]

This webpage gives a detailed description of the units.

 

http://www.bloodandcustard.com/tadpoles001.html

[Nearholmer]

This is seriously weird!

 

Every week I used to travel home late after evening classes, two evenings each week, in Croydon. And, I have a very distinct memory of changing trains at Redhill, crossing over and boarding the train to Tonbridge, making sure to bag a compartment.

 

But, the website, and you chaps all concur that there were no compartments!

 

So, either I'm completely round the bend, or the particular train concerned was diagrammed to something else, a 3D, a 3H, or maybe the 6S/L that was based at Tonbridge for school trains to/from Edenbridge. Me being round the bend shouldn't be discounted, of course!

 

And, although I used to use them very numerous other journeys, it is only on that one that I recall compartments.

 

I live and learn (and, then rapidly forget what I've learned, it would appear).

 

Kevin

[brushman47544]

Could it have been one of the loco hauled workings and your compartment was in a BSK? Whilst it could have been a 3D or 3H, I don't think they had what might be called regular diagrams, rather turning up as cover on any turn as needed, which wouldn't fit with your regular trip on the same train.