Highland Bodgery

[uax6]

I have taken advantage of a 12 hr day in work to do some mass production. I started with cylinders:

 

and then lock up safety valves:

 

I then moved onto footplates. The dimesions were copied from the one that is made up, and then drawen onto 10thou plasticard thus:

 

I then cut them out:

 

The observant will note that there are an extra pair of cylinders and valves, these being for the other tankie.

 

Hopefully tomorrow I will get the cabsides cut.....

 

Andy

 

[Alex TM]

Hi Andy,

 

Some inspiring work on here.  Takes me back a bit to my youth when one of our club members had a knack of turing a Hornby loco into something completely original, and otherwise unavailable, using only plasticard.

 

Any advances with the J83 conversion?

 

Good luck.

 

Regards,

 

Alex.

[uax6]

Alex, thanks for the comments.

 

The J83 is looking somewhat sad in the locker at the minute. I've been looking at the drawing and eying up the body to see where I need to cut and shut to get closer to the Scrappie. The front wheelset is still awaiting its repositioning and i'm trying to work out how to use the romfords so that I can get the coupling rods back on. I have a set on one of my Bankers that have the triang rods just screwed into the crackpin hole, and I wonder if I can do that with these plastic centered ones, although I also have the piston rods to put on them. Will the triang crankpin fit through the romfords?

 

The body has been cut about quite a bit already, but I need to find a chimney from somewhere, anyone got a broken J83 with a good chimney in the scrap box?

 

I must also get back to the lathe to get the rest of the wheelsets for the Castles turned, and the chassis blocks drilled and cut down.

 

Today I can't feel my fingers, having helped clear the schools 'childrens garden' of a mass of nettles, so nothing will get done today, although I have brought a pair of bow pens with me to see if i can do anything with them. I'll take some photos so you can see what a mess I make with them!

 

Andy

[uax6]

Yesterday afternoon's playing around with bow pens was interesting. All the nibs I have seem to write ok, even though they are filthy. It would appear that there is a little art in getting them to start, but otherwise I didn't have too much trouble with them. I haven't tried doing curves or running paint through them yet though. I put the ink into them using an old syringe that came with a printer ink refilling kit, and that made it quite easy to fill, I would think it would work with paint too.

 

The pens:

 

Firstly my Kern. It's part of a set, sadly missing a couple of items, but is a nice thing to hold.

 

The smallest line I could draw was this, the thick line on the right is from a Bic Biro, and I think it is about 0.2mm:

 

The compass pen gave a line much the same thickness:

 

The second pen I have is a Jackson Bros bone handled one:

 

This is a lovely thing, fits the hand beautifully, and is so light you can hardly feel it. Again the nibs are dirty, but it does write, although it seems more reluctant than the Kern to start. I found by having a splodge of ink on a piece of paper and drawing a line from it was the easiest way to start the pen off.

 

The line was a tad thicker maybe 0.25mm:

 

The compass nib was much the same:

 

So having proved they work I'll try with a bit of paint on an old coach and see what happens!

 

 

Andy G

 

 

[Colin parks]

Hi Andy,

 

I am envious of your bow pen collection.

 

It might be worth investing in a copy of Ian Rathbone's book on painting and lining if you don't already have one. The thing to remember with using paint in a bow pen is to have it quite thick. This seems counter-intuitive, but produces the best lines. I have only lined one EMU with a(cheap!)bow pen, but two things helped: 1. Don't work in a warm room and 2. Start the pen off each time on a scrap piece of plastic to get it running.

 

All the best,

 

Colin

[uax6]

As promised here are some pictures of the battered triang Mk1 with my botched attempts at adding lining to it. I'll say now that I wasn't really taking time with it, but was really just playing to see how difficult it would be to hold the coach, ruler and pen. I can say that I need something to hold the coach in place as the tumblehome makes the coach rock and roll all over the place. (I wonder what Coachmann uses?) I also need to find out if the paint smudges against a the striaght edge... Jobs for another day I think!

 

I did the long lining on the raised mouldings on one side, and then some LMS-esque vertical lines on the other. following the mouldings is quite difficult when the coach rolls about. Even in the photos you can see that the lines were getting better the more I did. Whether some of the splodges is down to the nib been worn I'm not sure. Anyway here are the pictures (and please stop laughing!):

 

 

Then yesterday I spent some time mass producing parts again. This time the cab side sheets. Four were made from a template and it took the best part of two hours to file and shape the cut-out and the splasher details on them, and thats with them stuck together in pairs!

 

 

Then I marked out the cab fronts. I am going to try to use a compass to cut the specticles out, so I just need to find one now!

 

More tomorrow.

 

Andy

[Sandy Harper]

I'm not an expert but it looks like your paint is too thin. The other skill you will need to master is how to take of unwanted paint. This is described in Ian's book quite well but in essence you need a very fine brush of 'best ' quality 00 sable. Winsor & Newton do one at around £12 so don't use it for general painting. What you need to do is load it with clean white spirit, remove most of it on a paper towel and then draw the brush down the outside of the paint line to remove any surplus. The surplus will be drawn into the brush and it will need frequent swilling in clean White spirit. You can reduce the bumps and wiggles quite effectively this way.

 

Ian's book also describes how to treat bow pen points to get the best results.

Regards

Sandy

[uax6]

Sandy,

 

It could well be that the paint is too thin, I need to work out a way to get some tins to settle out! Maybe I need to by some fresh ones and leave them in the garage to settle and then decant the oil out?

 

I wasn't really trying anything other than the pens, so didn't care and the mess I made! The coach will bestripped at somepoint again, and I'll make up some sort of a cradle before I have another go.

 

I've been working away on the Terrier, and hopefully I should get it finished soon!

 

Andy

[Colin parks]

Hi Andy,

 

Do not give up on the bow pen.  My lines looked like that at first.  Sandy is right, the paint is too thin.  It ought to be gloss too - perhaps it is thin gloss.  Leave the lid off the tin,  pour off some of the oil or the 'nuclear option' (which might dull the paint if over-done) is to add a little  talcum powder.  This last tip was given to my brother by Precision Paint's original owners as a way of getting some body to red paints in particular.  Too much talc = matt paint though. 

 

As for holding the model steady,  why not make a wooden cradle with two lengths of timber as high as the width of your coach, say, 38mm inc. handles and set about 52mm apart, screwed to a board.  Something similar is to be found pictured in Ian Rathbone's book.  Of course, a cradle with one sliding side would be even better as you could clamp the model gently in place.  There is a picture of something similar on the Alan Gibson website used for holding models while drilling out holes for axle box bearings.

 

Now if the lower length of wood had a layer of anti-slip (such as the material used under rugs) and you used a ruler broad enough that it still rested on the rubber-topped surface even when ruling at cantrail level, that ruler would be going nowhere whist you worked along the coach side!

 

All the best,

 

Colin

Edited June 11, 2013 by Colin parks

[uax6]

I think the tin <was> gloss, although I didn't pay much attention! It might have been better if I had stirred it too. I was just seeing if the pens would do something with the paint.

 

I'm not going to give up, I have far too many coaches to line (and those d*mn locos too!) but I think I need to get the cradle sorted first. Fortunately I have, in stock, the remains of about 15 pallets, that should provide enough timber to make a cradle! I was thinking somewhere along your idea Colin, but haddn't though about adding non-slip, and the idea of the ruler not slipping is a good one too.

 

Do you need to use a ruler that has a chamfer on it, with the chamfer face down to the work to stop smudges?

 

Now where can i get some anti-slip from?

 

(BTW Colin, I won that complete set of bow pens for £7.50! I will just need to repair the two pen handles, so bargins are out there!)

 

Andy G

[Colin parks]

Hi Andy,

 

Fifteen pallets sounds like enough timber to make a cradle!  Smooth planed would be best.  As for anti-slip, it is sometimes on sale in Lidl. Failing that, carpet shops sell packs of it.  A piece of Pirelli 2" rubber chair webbing would make a nice stable base to rest you hand and ruler.  You would only need 12" of it.  I could send you a bit.

 

Re. chamfered rulers, the width of the nib of the pen keeps the paint clear of the edge of the ruler.  With the ruler upside down it would be harder to maintain a straight line.  It does sound like I'm an expert, which I am most certainly not, but it can all be learnt given enough practice.

 

All the best,

 

Colin

[Alex TM]

Hi Andy,

 

Just a thought about the stepped straight edge to a ruler:

 

Take a cheap plastic ruler and glue a strip of 20-40thou plasticard to the underside; that will give you 0.5-1mm of 'lift' which should be enough to stop any paint being drawn under it.  It will also be fairly flat and so avoid any rocking that would take place by using a ruler wrong-side-up.

 

Hope it's of use.

 

regards,

 

Alex.

[N15class]

I have allways worked with a plane flat rule or even plasticard templates. I find when using the pen almost upright it draws the line a 1/32 or so away from the edge so that there is no chance of it seeping under. I also find it better drawing the line a little away from the ruler for seeing where you are going especially on panelled coaches.

[uax6]

This is what I like about the forum, people with far more experience that me are on hand, and happy to give ideas and tips. Thanks!

 

The use of Pirelli seat webbing has made my mind move to the garage. Now I have a couple of choices, I could use some old webbing from one of the spare seats I have for my Moggy Minors (yes Colin, I run a Moggy van at the minute - Full GPO livery too!) or use some leftover lino used inside out, so the smooth side is face down, and the backing is against the model. That should mork quite well, but will I be able to stick it down?

 

As for using the pens, I'm glad that it would appear that I don't need a lip to stop 'wicking' of the paint, so I just need a good striaght edge.  But Peter (above) raises an interesting point, what angle do you hold the pen at? I was told by an mate who used to use these things day-in-day-out, that you use them just like a normal pen, so that would imply an angle of about 50* from the horizontal, but Peter uses his vertically. Which is best??

 

Andy

[Colin parks]

Hi Andy,

 

Re. webbing, it would not need to touch the model, it was meant as a surface on which to lay the ruler -lino would not have the same grip. I have heard of cork-backed rulers being used for lining-out, but I just a heavy steel one.

 

All the best,

 

Colin

[uax6]

I see now. Do you think old webbing would be ok for this, or do I need to tap you up for some new bits? ;-}

 

Talking of rulers, I picked up a 99p steel one in Sainsbugs, and was surprised to find that it was backed with some sort of felt, maybe this should become my lining rule? although it is quite light, so maybe not?

 

I need to think about the box, it needs to able to stop the rock, so it might need a tad of padding on the lower surface, something to play around with I think.

 

Andy

[Earlswood Nob]

Good morning all

An interesting thread. I am picking up tips in using plasticard for scratchbuilding. Now tips for using a bow pen.

I have been practising with a bow pen that I bought over 30 years ago, tried once,failed, then it away in an odd 'n' ends box. I discovered the pen again recently, and can now get some very fine lines. The tip about using a brush with white spirit to trim the lines is something I must try.

Earlswood Nob

[uax6]

I'm glad that you are learning new things too, I'm far from perfect and am learning stuff as I go along here too.

 

As an update to things I'll start with the castle specticle plate: I tried Mr Parks suggestion of using a pair of compasses to cut out the circles for the rims in 5 thou sheet the results being like this:

 

I then marked the 10thou sheet with where the holes are going to go, again with the compasses, and almost all the way through the sheet:

 

Then I used the center point of each circle (which are different sizes) to stick the rims on (the other side). The are hardening off before I cut the hole right through:

 

On the Terrier front I have been trying to get this out of the way. On issue with small 0-6-0T is that they don't have much grunt, nor do they pick-up well, both mainly down to the fact they are never heavy enough. So with this in mind I have packed the cab bunker with sheet lead, and given it a raised lead floor:

 

I've also been round with the filler on the rest of the body:

 

This was rubbed down, and left it looking like this:

 

To rub down I used a small bit of 1200 grit wet-&-dry folded and held in tweasers (stolen off the Mrs!), quite difficult to take a picture one handed but here it is:

 

The cab was glazed (not flush) and then stuck to the body. Then some more filling:

In the foreground you can see some of my riffler files, they are quite coarse, but are very useful to get at odd places.

 

As the body needs to be raised up slightly (remember the other Terriers have their buffers half above the running plate) I inserted some 10thou packing pieces, which also helped the wheels clear some of my mods!

 

This morning I gave it another coat of black paint (this must make the total about 7 or 8! each one rubbed back to act as a filler for small holes), so will take a shot when it's dry to see what it is like. I'm guessing theres more work to do on it yet!

 

I also ordered from Wizard Models some sprung GWR Dean conical buffers for this, and some CR axleboxes for both wagons and (I hope) tenders, along with a set of HR wagon buffers, all to help things on there way.

 

I hope that the terrier will be ready for lettering this weekend, so that I can put it to bed! I still have a pair of doors to make and fit, but they can't be added until the thing is lettered.

 

Andy

 

Edited to make some of it read correctly!

Edited June 13, 2013 by uax6

[uax6]

After checking the paint on the Terrier last night, I took it into work to put some transfers on it. The last coat was a thinned coat of satin black (put on with a 4mm paint-brush), which dried to a lovely semi-matt, already weathered finish. Just a bit of brownish weathering here and there.

 

Anyway, the transfers were HMRS Methfix LMS ones, quite easy to apply, and I prefer them to pressfix to be honest. The only issue I had was that the Terrier's number is 16118, and the sheet only has four 1's on it, so another sheet has been ordered.

 

Here is the way I do them:

 

Firstly you have to know how they are laid out on the loco and which ones you need. For this I use Locomotive Liveries of the LMS by Jenkinson and Essery. I also used the pictures from the RCTS Highland Loco books. For this Loco I need 14" gold numerals and a red backed LMS. The numerals need to be set out on the center-line of the tank (both directions). The numbers have to be spaced so that there is 13" (4.3mm) between two 1's, between two other numbers the centers are 15" (6.3mm), and between a 1 and another number is 19" (5mm).

 

Knowing this, you need to be able to line everything up. For this I used two dividers. You also need to have a sharp knife to lift the transfers off the backing sheet, a pair of tweezers, a paintbrush and some meths diluted 3 to 1 with water.

 

I started with the LMS. I cut round the sheet (using a new blade and not preesing too hard as you don't want to cut through the whole lot as it makes getting the transfer off a nightmare!) and lifted a corner with the blade, enough so that I could grip it with the tweezers. Then place face down in roughly the right position, with the dividers set up to give the correct spacing away from your reference point. I then flood the transfer with the meths and press down gently so that it sort of sticks. Then line it up with the dividers, and when happy, press down with your finger.

The tissue paper came off this one while I pressed it down. After a train had gone past (and after I had taken the photo) I noticed that it wasn't central, so I spent the next 8 mins adjusting it (flood with meths and then it will move about. I discovered that pressing it down again was a pain, as it wouldn't stick to the cab! The end results was by using the half cotton bud that usually helps hold my camera together. Pressing down firmly with this and rolling it off worked, and also got any creases out.

 

I then started the numbers. Lined up central on the tank (both ways) again using the dividers, the first one was placed and 'methed' into place. The ones are a nightmare to get vertical even with the dividers, as they tend not to look it! This one was ok:

 

Then the spacing 4.3mm (or 4. something as I used!) was set on one divider (the other was set to the high from the running plate to the bottom of the number) so that the next 1 could be put in place. This was again discovered to be not quite right, and again it was flooded to move, although sadly it broke in two, but I have managed to get it looking ok:

 

The 8 was next, 5mm center to center from the 1 next to it. This was actually quite easy and went on a dream. This was the first one that the tissue paper stuck too, so after I was happy it was in the right place and pressed down firmly I left it for two trains (one in each direction so about 16mins) to set a bit, before dabbing the tissue off with wet paper towel:

If you notice, you will see that the 8 looks small, but so does the original:

 

Then it was the time for the 6. Again 5mm from the 1. Easy peasey with the dividers, and went on in no time:

 

The final number is a 1, and again this was a pain to line up, but I got there in the end:

 

The finished side looks like:

 

So I'm just waiting for the other sheet to arrive so that the other side can be done. Notice that the cab steps fell off at one point, they have been re-glued!

 

I got home to find my order with Wizard had arrived. The buffers for the terrier are going to be these:

Gibson GWR Dean tapered loco buffers.

 

Also in there were two types of CR axleguards (for my HR sheep vans) and some CR springs for some tenders. Happy days!

 

Andy

Edited June 14, 2013 by uax6

[uax6]

Yesterday the new transfers arrived and guess what? Yeap I had ordered pressfix ones.... Grrr! So I will have a mix of press- and methsfix ones on the second side. It's not really much of an issue, but you can see a slight difference with them. Anyway I'll do the same as last time and show the thing building up.

 

The first thing to add was the LMS. This is Methsfix (mf) and lined up again as friday. To show the effect of how these transfers are when put on without any meths:

 

Brush on some meths solution (3:1 with water) and the tissue goes transparent enough so you can see the transfer underneath:

 

End result:

 

The next one to add was the first 1 (mf). Lined up again with two pairs of dividers. View of it with the tissue on:

 

I always do one number at a time, and wait until I can get the tissue paper off before adding the next one as you will find it impossible to line them up properly as you just cannot see whats what. It does make it a long job, but its worth it. This side took about 2 hours.

 

The next 1 was a pressfix (pf) one. Cut round the tissue and transfer as before, but in this case try and cut as close as you dare to the transfer, to reduced the 'halo' effect later. Put it in position and, so that you can see through the tissue, coat it with some meths solution. This makes the tissue go clear, but doesn't stop it sticking:

 

The 8 (mf) and 6 (mf) were added (in that order) as before:

 

And then finally the last 1 (pf) was added:

 

Then I moved on to the buffers. These GWR Dean ones are similar to the conical HR ones:

 

To see the spacing and height I put my Road Van next to it

 

The buffers were spaced at 22mm apart, with the top of the shank just clear of the top edge of the running plate:

 

And at the bunker end:

 

Then with a bit of red paint (whats the Humbrol number for vermillion please?) it looks like this:

 

So I just need to make some doors and put the handrails and whistle on (I wonder if I have a whistle!) and find the vermillion paint and shes done. The buffers will stay off until the verllion has been found!

 

Doors tomorrow!

 

Andy

 

 

 

Edited June 16, 2013 by uax6

[ChrisN]

Yesterday the new transfers arrived and guess what? Yeap I had ordered pressfix ones.... Grrr! So I will have a mix of press- and methsfix ones on the second side. It's not really much of an issue, but you can see a slight difference with them. Anyway I'll do the same as last time and show the thing building up.

 

The first thing to add was the LMS. This is Methsfix (mf) and lined up again as friday. To show the effect of how these transfers are when put on without any meths:

DSC05468.JPG

 

Brush on some meths solution (3:1 with water) and the tissue goes transparent enough so you can see the transfer underneath:

DSC05469.JPG

 

End result:

DSC05470.JPG

 

The next one to add was the first 1 (mf). Lined up again with two pairs of dividers. View of it with the tissue on:

DSC05471.JPG

 

I always do one number at a time, and wait until I can get the tissue paper off before adding the next one as you will find it impossible to line them up properly as you just cannot see whats what. It does make it a long job, but its worth it. This side took about 2 hours.

 

The next 1 was a pressfix (pf) one. Cut round the tissue and transfer as before, but in this case try and cut as close as you dare to the transfer, to reduced the 'halo' effect later. Put it in position and, so that you can see through the tissue, coat it with some meths solution. This makes the tissue go clear, but doesn't stop it sticking:

DSC05472.JPG

 

The 8 (mf) and 6 (mf) were added (in that order) as before:

DSC05484.JPG

 

And then finally the last 1 (pf) was added:

DSC05485.JPG

 

Then I moved on to the buffers. These GWR Dean ones are similar to the conical HR ones:

DSC05487.JPG

 

To see the spacing and height I put my Road Van next to it

DSC05488.JPG

 

The buffers were spaced at 22mm apart, with the top of the shank just clear of the top edge of the running plate:

DSC05491.JPG

 

And at the bunker end:

DSC05492.JPG

 

Then with a bit of red paint (whats the Humbrol number for vermillion please?) it looks like this:

DSC05493.JPG

DSC05494.JPG

DSC05495.JPG

 

So I just need to make some doors and put the handrails and whistle on (I wonder if I have a whistle!) and find the vermillion paint and shes done. The buffers will stay off until the verllion has been found!

 

Doors tomorrow!

 

Andy

 

Andy,

It is certainly looking a treat, well done! 

 

I have just been on the Humbrol site and they have changed it since last week so you cannot just type the coulkour you want in, anyway they did not have vermillion.

 

They did have, RC423 Carmine Matt, RC421 Virgin Red Matt, RC418 EWS Red Matt, and the most likely, RC406 Buffer Beam Red Matt.  I have not checked all through their others paints.  I found a website where you dial up the colour you want and see who makes it.  I will PM it to you if it would be helpful.

[uax6]

I morn the passing of the proper Humbrol railway colours, it was such a useful range. I'm guessing that vermillion is more of an orange colour, so I'll have to drag my Loco Liveries of the LMS book to the local stockist and try and match to the colour panel in there, not ideal!

I have a lead on Humbrol track colour, so hopefully I'll be able to get some of that made soon, would anyone be interested?

 

Andy G

Edited June 17, 2013 by uax6

[uax6]

Today I had 12 hours to kill in work, and promptly forgot to take my camera with me, so you can only see the end results!

 

The first job was to make up the handrails, easy enough, just 2 lengths of 0.45mm brass wire passed through the knobs already fitted, and then painted black.

 

Then it was time to make the doors. These are just two rectangles of 15thou black plasticard, with a bit of brass handrail wire on it for the bolt, and two bits of 5 thou for the hinges. These where fitted and then given a coat of black paint to match the rest:

 

The original Terrier whistle was found and fitted and can be seen in one of the photos above.

 

That just left the coal rails. These are the same 15thou black plasticard and were a devil to fit. Will add some real coal soon (What glue to stick that down with? PVA will make it glossy, any ideas?):

 

So that just leaves the following items: Driver, coal, buffers, vermillion paint and vac hoses. The couplings will be done way into the future! Almost job done!

 

Any ideas on which driver/fireman would be suitable please?

 

Andy

 

 

[Ben Alder]

I use UHU for fitting coal to tenders.

[ChrisN]

Andy,

I have checked on the colour comparison web site I mentioned.  Vallejo do a colour called vermillion and the Humbrol equivalent is Matt Scarlett, which is 60, or Signal Red which is 174.  Whether the Vallejo Vermillion is what we mean by vermillion is another matter.

 

The Revell colour is Carmine Red or Fiery Red and the Citidel colour id Blood Red.

Edited June 17, 2013 by ChrisN