FelixM Posted July 17, 2013 Share Posted July 17, 2013 Hi http://www.flickr.com/photos/64518788@N05/8695581829/ If I am correct the first coaach is a Stanier and the second and third are Gresleys. Then there would be the situation that between the first and the second coach the BR standard and the Pullman type connectors don't match. Would an adaptor always be used in those cases? Or is the Stanier coach a strengthening coach and therefore there wasn't a need of a connection? Thank you in advance for answering my question. Felix Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold The Stationmaster Posted July 17, 2013 RMweb Gold Share Posted July 17, 2013 Gangway adaptors would be used to couple coaches with non-Pullman gangways to those with Pullman gangways. I would be surprised if a strengthening coach wasn't gangway connected but it probably happened and it did happen in some cases where portions were involved and there was no need for through access. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Andy W Posted July 17, 2013 RMweb Gold Share Posted July 17, 2013 The Stationmaster's comment is definitive, if an adapter wasn't available the gangway doors were supposed to be locked to prevent passengers trying to cross between the coaches. I believe that some Stanier coaches ran in BR days with adapters permanently fitted, especially those allocated to Scotland where the ScR had inherited a mixture of LMS and LNER design vehicles. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Oldddudders Posted July 17, 2013 RMweb Gold Share Posted July 17, 2013 ISTR that certain Southern coaches, intended for working over other railways' routes, actually had a Pullman gangway at one end and a BS version at the other. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
clecklewyke Posted July 17, 2013 Share Posted July 17, 2013 What a good question. I am asking myself the same question regarding a mix of LMS and BR Mk 1 vehicles (a Hull - Liverpool inter-regional working) which I am running on Bradford North Western. I would have thought that there would be no problem between the Gresley and Mk 1 Pullman vestibules but that there would need to be an adaptor between the Stanier and Gresley or Mk1 coaches. Even if the Stanier coach were a strengthener I would expect the corridor connection to be made. I would love to here the informed advice of people like Sationmaster or other ex BR employees. Ian Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
chrisf Posted July 17, 2013 Share Posted July 17, 2013 Adapters were found on ex-GWR coaches too. As BR standard coaches were delivered it became inevitable that GWR stock, which like the LMS used non-Pullman gangways, would be mingled with the newer coaches. The carriage working programmes would specify at times that adapter fitted coaches were to be used. Chris Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
talisman56 Posted July 17, 2013 Share Posted July 17, 2013 (edited) ISTR that certain Southern coaches, intended for working over other railways' routes, actually had a Pullman gangway at one end and a BS version at the other. True: the Maunsell 'high-window' vehicles built to Orders E363 to E366 in 1928 were intended for 'inter-company' services and those allocated in sets had the Southern-standard Pullman gangway within sets and British-standard gangways at the brake end of the brake vehicles. The BCKs had BS gangways at both ends. The BS gangways were also fitted with CA adaptors to enable them to be coupled with Pullman gangways - the Southern workshops produced many hundreds of the CA adaptors to fit to the BS gangways built onto pre-Maunsell standard vehicles to enable them to be connected to the Pullman gangways on the Maunsells and subsequently the Bullied vehicles also. Source: King: An Illustrated History of Southern Coaches. Edited July 17, 2013 by talisman56 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold The Stationmaster Posted July 17, 2013 RMweb Gold Share Posted July 17, 2013 What a good question. I am asking myself the same question regarding a mix of LMS and BR Mk 1 vehicles (a Hull - Liverpool inter-regional working) which I am running on Bradford North Western. I would have thought that there would be no problem between the Gresley and Mk 1 Pullman vestibules but that there would need to be an adaptor between the Stanier and Gresley or Mk1 coaches. Even if the Stanier coach were a strengthener I would expect the corridor connection to be made. I would love to here the informed advice of people like Sationmaster or other ex BR employees. Ian As above Ian (my post No.2 in this thread) coupling LMS gangways (BS pattern) to BR standard coaches (effectively Pullman gangways) needed an adaptor where the LMS design vehicles' come up against a BR gangwayed vehicle. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Bigcheeseplant Posted July 17, 2013 Share Posted July 17, 2013 If you get the Masokits Hawksworth gangway connectors these come with the pullman adaptors. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Reid Posted July 17, 2013 Share Posted July 17, 2013 The Stationmaster's comment is definitive, if an adapter wasn't available the gangway doors were supposed to be locked to prevent passengers trying to cross between the coaches. I believe that some Stanier coaches ran in BR days with adapters permanently fitted, especially those allocated to Scotland where the ScR had inherited a mixture of LMS and LNER design vehicles. Were there any "mobile" adaptors ? not only did the BS Gangway' need an extension to it's height but it also needed two extra levers on the faceplate to become an Adaptor Gangway and to couple it to BR Standard stock. I thought they were all either adaptor fitted or just plain BS Gangways if not. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold The Stationmaster Posted July 17, 2013 RMweb Gold Share Posted July 17, 2013 Were there any "mobile" adaptors ? not only did the BS Gangway' need an extension to it's height but it also needed two extra levers on the faceplate to become an Adaptor Gangway and to couple it to BR Standard stock. I thought they were all either adaptor fitted or just plain BS Gangways if not. Bob, I can recall seeing adaptors 'lying round' so on that basis I'm assuming they didn't always stay on vehicles although vehicles could in any case be swopped in and out for maintenance or attention which might mean adaptors coming off or one needed to be put on. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Reid Posted July 17, 2013 Share Posted July 17, 2013 Thanks Mike - I'll need to keep an eye out for one to see what form it took. All of those (ex-LMS) vehicles I worked on that were adaptor fitted had a far more permanent arrangement - not something that could be fitted in a station, requiring the replacement of the whole gangway mechanism. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
andyman7 Posted July 17, 2013 Share Posted July 17, 2013 Does anyone have any pictures of what the adapters look like? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Reid Posted July 17, 2013 Share Posted July 17, 2013 See this topic (it's a question that come up from time to time) http://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/topic/19807-corridor-connections/ Halfway down the page there's links to photo's.... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ian Kirk Posted July 17, 2013 Share Posted July 17, 2013 Hi, A number of Gresley Brake Composites and a believe a few Bk 3rds were built with the "standard" corridor connection on one end. These were intended for through workings onto other railways who did not use the Pullman gangway. In BR days Scottish region they tended to keep the ex LMS vehicles in sets as far as possible. From a modelling point of view a train of mixed LMS/LNER or LMS/Br Mk 1 would be very unlikely. If seen together it would be as two sets coupled together (presumably using an adaptor). Trains with a mix of Gresley, Thompson and Mk1 were quite common. The fact that the ex LNER stock could be used along with the Mk1s, Pullman gangway and buckeye, I think made them seem more useful to the operating department although they looked older than the equivalent ex LMS types. The catering vehicles in particular lasted much longer. best wishes, Ian Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
robertcwp Posted July 18, 2013 Share Posted July 18, 2013 This one has an adaptor: Sleeper-ex-LMS_LeedsCity by robertcwp, on Flickr Note the extended faceplate at the top and the large clips so that the gangway could be clipped to a Pullman one. 2 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Dan Randall Posted December 27, 2015 RMweb Gold Share Posted December 27, 2015 Does anyone happen to know if any Hawksworth Full Brakes were fitted with Pullman adaptors? (If so, a picture or two would be great thanks!). I'm building a BR blue one in 7mm scale, but in any broadside views I've seen, the gangways are either unmodified, or it's too gloomy to tell. End views haven't helped much either, as the gangways are once again, unmodified, or have been removed completely! Regards Dan Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flood Posted December 27, 2015 Share Posted December 27, 2015 The 1976 RCTS Coaching Stock book states that some BGs (both Collett and Hawksworth) were fitted with adapter gangways at one end. Stated as such are: Diagram K42 98, 269 Diagram K45 293, 303, 304, 305, 324 Most of the remaining GW BGs had their gangways removed by 1976, it may well be that more had adapter gangways fitted originally. A quick look through the books in my collection have not revealed any photographs with adapters fitted. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Dan Randall Posted December 27, 2015 RMweb Gold Share Posted December 27, 2015 Drat! Mine's a K46.... Still, that's useful information for any future projects. Thanks very much. Regards Dan Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Allan Condie Posted July 1, 2022 Share Posted July 1, 2022 You are correct in stating that some Scottish Region ex LMS coaches had gangway adaptors permanently attached. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wickham Green too Posted July 1, 2022 Share Posted July 1, 2022 As far as I know, there was never an adaptor that wasn't permanently attached - it involved a significant modification to the existing gangway hoop adding the extra face at the top and rebuilding the waist height clamps to take British - so called - Standard or Pullman gangways. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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