Tricky-CRS Posted December 2, 2014 Share Posted December 2, 2014 I am currently researching the above wagons and looking for information. Does anyone know of a good source of information on these as I am not finding much at the moment? Ideally how long did the first batch in the 1930's last into BR, were any converted to vacuum brakes? Were the GWR set and the first batch of BR wagons the same? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Departmental Posted December 9, 2014 Share Posted December 9, 2014 In reply to your questions. 'British railway Wagons' by Don Rowland says that the first BR purchase of wagons of this type were not ordered until 1952 and follows the design of those purchased by the GWR from Metropolitan Cammell. 239 wagons were made to the original design and then 400 were built as vacuum braked and improved buffers, again by Met Camm. The original batch would have lasted into BR(W) service alongside the BR purchases and some probably lasted until the end of use of this type of wagon as ballast trains were not always vacuum braked as many engineering department wagon types were not vacuum braked during the early BR period. Hope this helps Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold TheSignalEngineer Posted December 9, 2014 RMweb Gold Share Posted December 9, 2014 This GWR one lasted until the late 1970s at least. http://paulbartlett.zenfolio.com/brmermaid/h1ce7881c#h1ce7881c Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fat Controller Posted December 9, 2014 Share Posted December 9, 2014 In reply to your questions. 'British railway Wagons' by Don Rowland says that the first BR purchase of wagons of this type were not ordered until 1952 and follows the design of those purchased by the GWR from Metropolitan Cammell. 239 wagons were made to the original design and then 400 were built as vacuum braked and improved buffers, again by Met Camm. The original batch would have lasted into BR(W) service alongside the BR purchases and some probably lasted until the end of use of this type of wagon as ballast trains were not always vacuum braked as many engineering department wagon types were not vacuum braked during the early BR period. Hope this helps Certainly, some of the BR-built unfitted ones were fitted with vacuum brakes in later years:- http://paulbartlett.zenfolio.com/brmermaid/h1ce7881c#h23a687f5 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tricky-CRS Posted December 9, 2014 Author Share Posted December 9, 2014 So the the first 2 batches were the same thank you, do you know when the unfitted would have been phased out? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fat Controller Posted December 10, 2014 Share Posted December 10, 2014 So the the first 2 batches were the same thank you, do you know when the unfitted would have been phased out? The latest photo of an unfitted one in PB's collection in unfitted form is dated 1978; any photos of these early wagons later than that shows them either in wagon works or retro-fitted with vacuum kit. If I might make a suggestion; from about 1975 for a year or two (perhaps longer), the WR had a programme of upgrading lines in preparation for the introduction of HST services. The most significant was the Badminton line upgrade, where the whole route was taken down to bare earth, 'blanketed' with sand or stone dust, which was covered with geo-textile and ballast. This was done one line at a time, with material being brought in on the other track, mainly in block trains of Mermaids. This would have probably used all serviceable wagons. Once this programme had been completed, then the oldest wagons would have gone for scrap, and the unfitted ones released for vac-fitting. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tricky-CRS Posted December 18, 2014 Author Share Posted December 18, 2014 Thank you Brian, how late do the fitted ones last? Am I right in remembering one is at Didcot museum? does anyone know where any others are? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fat Controller Posted December 19, 2014 Share Posted December 19, 2014 Thank you Brian, how late do the fitted ones last? Am I right in remembering one is at Didcot museum? does anyone know where any others are? I think the fitted nes lasted well into the 1980s. A quick look at the Vintage Carriage Trust survey suggests some 20+ wagons are 'preserved', all seemingly BR examples:- http://www.ws.vintagecarriagestrust.org/ws/wresults.asp Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tricky-CRS Posted December 19, 2014 Author Share Posted December 19, 2014 Thank you I will look in to this information. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Downendian Posted December 19, 2014 RMweb Gold Share Posted December 19, 2014 Thank you Brian, how late do the fitted ones last? Am I right in remembering one is at Didcot museum? does anyone know where any others are? There was one on the Dartmouth Steam railway in 2008Photo taken March 2008 Neil Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold The Fatadder Posted December 30, 2014 RMweb Gold Share Posted December 30, 2014 If you are looking for photos of a gwr mermaid have a look at this https://www.flickr.com/photos/bristol_passion/15884229210/sizes/o/in/photostream/ End on sadly but you can see the sides of wagons further down the train (Sadly not well enough to make out lettering, so still no idea how to finish my model... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fat Controller Posted December 30, 2014 Share Posted December 30, 2014 If you are looking for photos of a gwr mermaid have a look at this https://www.flickr.com/photos/bristol_passion/15884229210/sizes/o/in/photostream/ End on sadly but you can see the sides of wagons further down the train (Sadly not well enough to make out lettering, so still no idea how to finish my model... There is a photo in 'Freight Wagons of the GWR and BR (WR); Their Loads and Loading' which might be useful Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tricky-CRS Posted June 26, 2015 Author Share Posted June 26, 2015 Hi All I am now getting this project ready to launch on Kickstarter in September as an RTR vehicle working with Dapol. I have been in contact with Llangollen to arrange to go and photograph and measure their 2 but does anyone have pictures in there collections of the GWR liveries that they would be willing to share with me to use for livery design and promotion of the project. Please PM me if you can offer any assistance. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tricky-CRS Posted July 24, 2015 Author Share Posted July 24, 2015 I am still in desperate need of details of the GWR livery carried on these wagons as none of the pictures found to date are at all clear. Even bought a W.D. & H.O. Wills Cigarette card of railway equipment showing some in action, but no use, nice card and image though. Any help will be much appreciated. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
asmay2002 Posted July 25, 2015 Share Posted July 25, 2015 I am still in desperate need of details of the GWR livery carried on these wagons as none of the pictures found to date are at all clear. Even bought a W.D. & H.O. Wills Cigarette card of railway equipment showing some in action, but no use, nice card and image though. Any help will be much appreciated. The standard reference for GWR wagons is usually "GWR goods wagons" by Atkins, Beard and Tourret. Page 329 of the most recent edition has 3 pictures in GWR livery. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold The Fatadder Posted July 25, 2015 RMweb Gold Share Posted July 25, 2015 I think the photos in Russell are clear enough to work out the markings. Will have a look once I get hone Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tricky-CRS Posted August 2, 2015 Author Share Posted August 2, 2015 The standard reference for GWR wagons is usually "GWR goods wagons" by Atkins, Beard and Tourret. Page 329 of the most recent edition has 3 pictures in GWR livery. Yes I have this book but I can not read the text on the side of the wagons, some is clear but the majority is not, hence why I am asking for help. I am also looking for pictures that I can actually use on my website to show the livery options available. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Mallard60022 Posted August 22, 2015 RMweb Premium Share Posted August 22, 2015 I think there are examples at the WSR and the GCR, however I might be imagining the latter. P Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tricky-CRS Posted August 30, 2015 Author Share Posted August 30, 2015 Thank you all for the assistance I have another query, I have found two pictures on Paul Bartletts site showing them in "Dutch" livery does anyone have details on any others that made it into this livery? I do not want to pick a number at random in case it is wrong. I will be launching the Kickstarter fund raising in late September for the RTR N Gauge Mermaid. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
stevex52 Posted August 30, 2015 Share Posted August 30, 2015 Thank you all for the assistance I have another query, I have found two pictures on Paul Bartletts site showing them in "Dutch" livery does anyone have details on any others that made it into this livery? I do not want to pick a number at random in case it is wrong. I will be launching the Kickstarter fund raising in late September for the RTR N Gauge Mermaid. i noted, 989000 at doncaster 30-5-94, 989001,989584,989630 at nuneaton 1-7-90, 989026 at bury st edmunds 30-4-90, 989044 at bescot 9-10-88 989055,989079,989130,989150,989292,989585 at chesterton junction 15-3-98, 989440 at toton, 989480 at lincoln 11-3-88, 989533 at toton, There were many others, also a version lettered SAND which had a painted line of yellow on the top and bottom edge of the body, also scottish wagons had the white triangle on the lower body, noted on brown and dutch liveried wagons in 1994 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tricky-CRS Posted August 30, 2015 Author Share Posted August 30, 2015 i noted, 989000 at doncaster 30-5-94, 989001,989584,989630 at nuneaton 1-7-90, 989026 at bury st edmunds 30-4-90, 989044 at bescot 9-10-88 989055,989079,989130,989150,989292,989585 at chesterton junction 15-3-98, 989440 at toton, 989480 at lincoln 11-3-88, 989533 at toton, There were many others, also a version lettered SAND which had a painted line of yellow on the top and bottom edge of the body, also scottish wagons had the white triangle on the lower body, noted on brown and dutch liveried wagons in 1994 Thank you very much for this information, it is very help to explain the white triangle I have seen on some. I have seen pictures of some in preservation with no lettering with the 2 yellow lines along the outer edges of the body but was not sure what that was for. Do you have a picture of the sand version by any chance? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
stevex52 Posted August 30, 2015 Share Posted August 30, 2015 First time i have done photos, so see how it goes we have 989202 at Bury St Edmunds on 30-4-90, brown livery with Sand in white in a white edged box. Also 989292 at Chesterton Junction 3-5-99 in faded Dutch livery with Sand on a Black Patch with white edge Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tricky-CRS Posted August 31, 2015 Author Share Posted August 31, 2015 Excellent pictures thank you. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Karhedron Posted September 18, 2015 Share Posted September 18, 2015 I am interested in supporting this project but I am not especially familiar with these vehicles (although I get that they were used for carrying ballast ). Did they only run in rakes or could I have 1 or 2 as part of a permanent way train? I have seen plenty of photos of the wagons but not very many of them in trains. Can anyone suggest or show photos of short trains with mermaids in please? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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